Z28, Supercharged or Not?

[VADER SS L99]

Originally Posted by radz282003

It's my opinion they're going to price it around what a GT500 goes for with probably a similar premium that SS has over the GT. I, personally, have no problem with the idea of that, because I think Camaro comes with goodies that the Mustang doesn't that sustifies the premium. It just looks like my thinking is opposite of yours, whereas I think a person who could afford Z28 would still take it over a base Corvette. What makes me think that is looking at all those people who have tune cars (i.e. Tony Henry, Lingenfelter, Hennessey, etc.) that are spending upwards of $45K on mod'd SSs; they aren't spending that money on Corvettes, so I just happen to think that a person in the position of being able to afford Z28 will spend it there, and not on Corvette. I know if I'm in the position, my money would stay with Camaro.

JMVHO though...

Make no mistake, If GM builds this car it will be to go after the GT500 market. The same way they went for the Mustang GT market with the SS. In my mind the GT500 has its own market. I dont ever like seeing or hearing the Corvette vs mustang debate. These are 2 different classes of cars and are on different playing fields. I dont care if they cost around the same or even perform around the same. In my mind the Corvette will always be a true sports car while the Camaro and Mustang will be true muscle cars. Now....... since most of us will agree that the Z28 will target the GT500(lol)we want it to cost and perform the same or better.

[LostInMoscow]

Originally Posted by VADER SS L99

Make no mistake, If GM builds this car it will be to go after the GT500 market. The same way they went for the Mustang GT market with the SS. In my mind the GT500 has its own market. I dont ever like seeing or hearing the Corvette vs mustang debate. These are 2 different classes of cars and are on different playing fields. I dont care if they cost around the same or even perform around the same. In my mind the Corvette will always be a true sports car while the Camaro and Mustang will be true muscle cars. Now....... since most of us will agree that the Z28 will target the GT500(lol)we want it to cost and perform the same or better.

If it's going to compete with the GT500, then I guess we'll be seeing a Z28 convertible too!? But I digress...........

[SweetSandMan]

Originally Posted by radz282003

It's my opinion they're going to price it around what a GT500 goes for with probably a similar premium that SS has over the GT. I, personally, have no problem with the idea of that, because I think Camaro comes with goodies that the Mustang doesn't that sustifies the premium. It just looks like my thinking is opposite of yours, whereas I think a person who could afford Z28 would still take it over a base Corvette. What makes me think that is looking at all those people who have tune cars (i.e. Tony Henry, Lingenfelter, Hennessey, etc.) that are spending upwards of $45K on mod'd SSs; they aren't spending that money on Corvettes, so I just happen to think that a person in the position of being able to afford Z28 will spend it there, and not on Corvette. I know if I'm in the position, my money would stay with Camaro.

JMVHO though...

I totally see what you're getting at but for some reason here's my thinking on what they should do...let me know how you feel about this. The Z28 (when they bring it in a year or 2) should become basically what the 1SS is now. The SS Should then become what the 2SS is and be upped in power slightly like they had done in the past with either SLP add-ons or whatever they want to do. And then if they really want to go after a bit of the GT500 market, they need to seek out either Hennessy or Lingenfelter (like Ford does with Shelby) and do a special edition type of SS that wears one of those names and boasts substancially more power via the CTS-V motor and more aggressive styling. I just don't understand why they would take the Z28 name which has, to my knowledge, never been "higher up on the food chain" than the SS and make it such a monster. Most people remember the Z28 as being the lesser of the available V8s power wise and style wise. It just doesn't make sense, to me, for the Z28 name to suddenly be the top of the line...but that's just my thought process.

The people that pay the premium price tag for a GT500 pay for the Shelby name and all the Shelby stature that comes with it. It's more than just a suped up Mustang. So why would people pay such a hefty price tag for just a supped up Camaro? IMO for that kind of price it needs to boast some sort of name (ie. Lingenfelter or Hennessey) other than just a "Z28" badge...

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by n2oSS

i say scrap the z28 and make the bad boy " camaro like car " a firehawk.

any i can see a supercharger, gm seems to like slappin on boost to performance models these days.

That would require 3 things. First, Pontiac, 2nd, a Firebird, and 3rd, SLP's willingness to do so.

As for superchargers, do you have a simpler way to make a car significantly faster?

[radz28]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

That would require 3 things. First, Pontiac, 2nd, a Firebird, and 3rd, SLP's willingness to do so.

As for superchargers, do you have a simpler way to make a car significantly faster?

Nuclear fision

[n2oSS]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

That would require 3 things. First, Pontiac, 2nd, a Firebird, and 3rd, SLP's willingness to do so.

As for superchargers, do you have a simpler way to make a car significantly faster?

1. Way i hear things pontiac name should be easy to purchase.

2. Dont need a firebird, do like gm has done for years take camaro platform and add a few diff body panels.

3. who gives a damn about slp's willingness.

Superchargers is only one of many many ways to make a car faster.

btw hows that grand am? hit the 17 quarter yet?

[djsnoflake]

Originally Posted by n2oSS

1. Way i hear things pontiac name should be easy to purchase.

2. Dont need a firebird, do like gm has done for years take camaro platform and add a few diff body panels.

3. who gives a damn about slp's willingness.

Superchargers is only one of many many ways to make a car faster.

btw hows that grand am? hit the 17 quarter yet?

Doesn't SLP own the brand Firehawk?

That's why you should give a damn

[ORANGE U NV]

A sports car (Corvette) & a muscle car (Camaro) are two different breeds. Lots of people will pay base Corvette $ to have the top model Camaro.

A lot a people scribe to the theory that most people will envy the most bad a$$ Camaro ever made more than a "base" Corvette. Just ask the kid at the drive thru window. The Corvette will be slightly faster, but won't massage your ego as much. I'm not judging..I'm just saying

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by n2oSS

1. Way i hear things pontiac name should be easy to purchase.

2. Dont need a firebird, do like gm has done for years take camaro platform and add a few diff body panels.

3. who gives a damn about slp's willingness.

Superchargers is only one of many many ways to make a car faster.

btw hows that grand am? hit the 17 quarter yet?

Its not a matter of buying the Pontiac name, GM already owns it. SLP owns the Firehawk name, so their willingness is a requirement unless GM wants to get into a lawsuit with them. What GM did for years was they sold tens of thousands of Firebirds along side tens of thousands of Camaros. Creating a car with a unique body and a unique interior with a unique drivetrain is creating an all new car, whether you call it one or not. So it would cost nearly as much to develop it as the Camaro, yet it would sell at a rate of maybe 10:1 (at best), causing each car sold to carry 10x the development cost (15x would be more realistic). It could never be priced high enough to recoup those costs yet still be seen as a good buy from a sufficient number of people. Thats why a Firebird would be needed for what you propose, to spread the overall cost out. And you can't really have a Firebird without having a Pontiac brand. Thats why all 3 are needed.

Never raced my Grand Am, I'm smart enough to know that a stock 3.4L V6 FWD car isn't fast and doesn't deserve to be seen near a dragstrip other than in the parking lot. Why do you ask? I ask that because what I or anyone else drives, and the 1/4 mile time of that car, has no bearing on how informed they are or their ability to form an opinion. If I had a 3rd gen IROC in my garage that ran a 10.37 last summer with 68% humidity and air temp of 82F, would it change how much I know about the auto industry? I don't own such a car, I just threw that out there for comparison against a stock Grand Am. Whats far more important here than what I drive is the fact that my screen name is in red itallics and I have moderator in my title.

[Orange5thGen]

Originally Posted by SamSS

I mean the past Z28's weren't supercharged. So is it a fact the new Z28 is gonna be supercharged or is it just another rumor?

Mine was..........Wow and it was fun.....

[2010ssraper]

Originally Posted by radz282003

For how long?... GM decided the thicker walls of the 6.2 were what was needed to get to the powerlevel and poweradder they wanted. I think that's saying something.

Well A LOT of people are taking the risk of doing 200shot on stock blocks, one corvette forum member has a APS Twin Turbo System running 13PSI on the stock block forged internals. Im sure the reason GM didn't use the LS7 block is because the risk would be too high on the company while going through bankrupcy and having a 2.3L Supercharger on a 427 aluminum block. If you look for a video on youtube they run the magnacharger and at least 150-200shot of nitrous on the aluminum block. Only god will know how long that blower will last considering Magnuson suggest not using nitrous on their blowers cause the bad buildup inside, exploding the manifold. But I am 90% that the LS7 aluminum block could handle a lot more than people expect!

I will post a couple video's of what the LS7 aluminum block can handle below..

[boxmonkeyracing]

Originally Posted by SweetSandMan

I totally see what you're getting at but for some reason here's my thinking on what they should do...let me know how you feel about this. The Z28 (when they bring it in a year or 2) should become basically what the 1SS is now. The SS Should then become what the 2SS is and be upped in power slightly like they had done in the past with either SLP add-ons or whatever they want to do. And then if they really want to go after a bit of the GT500 market, they need to seek out either Hennessy or Lingenfelter (like Ford does with Shelby) and do a special edition type of SS that wears one of those names and boasts substancially more power via the CTS-V motor and more aggressive styling. I just don't understand why they would take the Z28 name which has, to my knowledge, never been "higher up on the food chain" than the SS and make it such a monster. Most people remember the Z28 as being the lesser of the available V8s power wise and style wise. It just doesn't make sense, to me, for the Z28 name to suddenly be the top of the line...but that's just my thought process.

The people that pay the premium price tag for a GT500 pay for the Shelby name and all the Shelby stature that comes with it. It's more than just a suped up Mustang. So why would people pay such a hefty price tag for just a supped up Camaro? IMO for that kind of price it needs to boast some sort of name (ie. Lingenfelter or Hennessey) other than just a "Z28" badge...

I say you're wrong about this whole thing. originally the Z28 could handle better then any SS stock could ever dream. and it could keep up if not out run most SS's. there hasn't always been an SS camaro but there has up until the 5th gen has always had a Z28 camaro. which would make the Z28 high on the food chain. the ONLY reason the SS in the 4th gen was better then the Z28 was because the Z28 was already in production and SLP came to GM saying they wanted to do an SS. now the SS is in production and the Z28 isn't. they will not up the SS because you only know the 4th gens. . .

Originally Posted by 2010ssraper

Well A LOT of people are taking the risk of doing 200shot on stock blocks, one corvette forum member has a APS Twin Turbo System running 13PSI on the stock block forged internals. Im sure the reason GM didn't use the LS7 block is because the risk would be too high on the company while going through bankrupcy and having a 2.3L Supercharger on a 427 aluminum block. If you look for a video on youtube they run the magnacharger and at least 150-200shot of nitrous on the aluminum block. Only god will know how long that blower will last considering Magnuson suggest not using nitrous on their blowers cause the bad buildup inside, exploding the manifold. But I am 90% that the LS7 aluminum block could handle a lot more than people expect!

I will post a couple video's of what the LS7 aluminum block can handle below..

It's not just about risk, it's about durability tests. I will guarantee you those people will blow those engines long before a stock one would. That's the reason the LS7 will never see the light of day from GM stock with a supercharger on it.

[radz28]

Originally Posted by boxmonkeyracing

I say you're wrong about this whole thing. originally the Z28 could handle better then any SS stock could ever dream. and it could keep up if not out run most SS's. there hasn't always been an SS camaro but there has up until the 5th gen has always had a Z28 camaro. which would make the Z28 high on the food chain. the ONLY reason the SS in the 4th gen was better then the Z28 was because the Z28 was already in production and SLP came to GM saying they wanted to do an SS. now the SS is in production and the Z28 isn't. they will not up the SS because you only know the 4th gens. . .

It's not just about risk, it's about durability tests. I will guarantee you those people will blow those engines long before a stock one would. That's the reason the LS7 will never see the light of day from GM stock with a supercharger on it.

Did any 4th Gen SSs even perform better than 1LE Z28s anyways? I don't see why so many feel like the SS can't be topped by Z28, but my opinion isn't any more relavent than anyone elses, so I just don't see GM changing the line-up for something like this. Who knows though

[boxmonkeyracing]

Originally Posted by radz282003

Did any 4th Gen SSs even perform better than 1LE Z28s anyways? I don't see why so many feel like the SS can't be topped by Z28, but my opinion isn't any more relavent than anyone elses, so I just don't see GM changing the line-up for something like this. Who knows though

to be honest I don't see them sliding in a performance variant below current models. IF the Z28 was being produced now the SS would be placed above it. . .and vice versa. . .