11-19-2009, 09:57 PM | #99 | |
Drives: 5th Gen Rental Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: New England
Posts: 1,901
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Quote:
1. excess body role 2. Excess understeer when pushed really hard 3. Excess movement of suspension components Body role is a function of height of the vehicle, low coil rates, and sway bars not strong enough. Excess understeer is related to the above concerns, plus short wheel base, and geometry issues Excess movement in the suspension is totally related to excess bushing movement or lack of structural support by the primary bushings: front radius rod, rear subframe, and rear diff mount bushings. So depending on the total overall upgrades, that you want to do, will depend on how much improvement you actually want. To assist you with this process, I would be glad to chat with you to help you. Now to your original question: Will our Solution B sway bar package add more stability, reduce body role, and improve understeer. The answer is definately yes. It will make a major change. Our Pedders bars front bar is 90% stronger than OE and 133% stronger than OE rear. I made a significant post about sway bar analysis that you should read. There is a serious amount of data there. Here is a small bit of it which compares some of the units that are out there: CENTER][/CENTER] There is a lot of data here! Strength measured is a function of polar inertia. To make selections of bars requires looking at ratio, strength, and adjustability. For example, 1. Competitor A offers a VERY low ratio, considering they are replacing 2 sway bars, compared to Pedders Solution B ratio of 1.000 and a 90%/133% increase, compared to their 106% / 20% improvement. No end links are included with their kit 2. Competitor B is a good ratio, but offers much lower strength gains than the Pedders Solution B Package. No endlinks are included with their kit. 3. Competitor C offers a too high of a ratio, and too low of an increase in the front. This will reduce understeer , but will offer insufficient improvements in body roll. No endlinks are included with their kit 4. Competitor D offers a 2 sway bar kit with very good control in body role, but will increase understeer as compared to OE and Pedders Solution B. No endlinks are included with their kit. The Competitor D has a low ratio of .553 while the Pedders Solution B has an improved ratio of 1.00. The Pedders % improvement is 90%/133%, while the Competitor D offers a 111%/44%. Pedders again offers a better all around balance 5. Competitor E was found at SEMA but had their bars on their Camaro, but has not listed the Camaro yet on their website. They have the same size bars as Competitor B, but has the advantage of having a 2 way adjustable front bar compared to Competitor B. As in Competitor B, the balance is better than OE, but the front and rear strengths are seriously lower than Pedders Solution B at 53/87% increase over OE compared to Pedders 90/133% increase over OE We feel the Pedders Solution B package is the best balanced bar on the market. The ratios of rear bias are up conservatively to reduce the understeer function, but rates of strength are up substantially to reduce body role, which is more demonstrative than understeer. So unlike many of the aftermarket bars out there, our Solution B bat attacks both body role and understeer. then do a understeer reducing specific alignment will complement the sway bars quite nicely. Hope this helps. mike dms Last edited by Info@PeddersUSA.com; 11-19-2009 at 10:08 PM. |
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11-20-2009, 10:22 AM | #100 | |
Drives: Camaro Justice Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Virginia
Posts: 20,174
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Quote:
Radius Bush Snubbers Sub-Frame Inserts (Not In Stock) Sub-Frame Bushes Sway Bar Solution B Three Weeks out. Sway bars are the FINAL tuning element to add to a vehicle. The glaring weaknesses are the radius and sub-frame bushes. These are the foundational components (sub-frame and radius bushes) that should be the first mod for every Camaro owner. These bushes followed by Solution B Sway bars would be a stellar setup. One mod for this winter and only one mod??? I'll cheat and call it a Foundational Bush Kit and make the snubbers and sub-frame bushes one item. They should be because they are the two weakest links in the OEM suspension. Hey Mike, Is there a Foundational Bush Kit for the Camaro in our catalog? |
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11-20-2009, 11:51 AM | #101 |
Tampa Gulf Coast Family
Drives: 1977 Z28, 2SSRS 2010 M6 Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Dunedin FL
Posts: 810
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I'm interested in your total package, but money is always an object. Bushings come first, then coil overs, then sway bars, correct? Ball park how much for each step and how noticeable will each step be in daily driving and racing. I went autocrossing for the first time with my 2ss and am hooked and then 4 days later went to the drag strip. I know one suspension is not ideal for all situations. Would I have to setup the suspension for the one I plan on doing most, most likely, or how would you advise me on this. Plan on doing more autocrossing and road racing. Thanks for any info. Josh
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11-20-2009, 08:17 PM | #102 | |
Drives: 5th Gen Rental Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: New England
Posts: 1,901
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Quote:
thanks mike dms |
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11-20-2009, 08:41 PM | #103 |
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..and the car
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11-20-2009, 08:43 PM | #104 | |
SST...
Drives: SST Camaro 2010 Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: East Coast of Florida
Posts: 5,927
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Quote:
Excellent Aby !!! Take the time to look at this - http://www.ridetechtv.com/video/8590 It is Mary Pozzi who is the 11 time SCCA Autocross Champion at the Del Mar Goodguys show. I grabbed this from a different site where Mary hangs out. She is very cool and an awesome autocrosser. |
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11-20-2009, 09:07 PM | #105 | |
Drives: 5th Gen Rental Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: New England
Posts: 1,901
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Quote:
I checked out the video from Mary Pozzi. She did a really great intro job. Where is she located? mike dms |
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11-20-2009, 09:42 PM | #106 |
Drives: 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 2002 Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Central California
Posts: 1
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Just found this site and very cool. Thanks for the compliments on the RideTech autocrossing video and it was fun talking "work" with Ty.
As for the question about location, I'm about 100 miles south of you. Cheers, Mary Pozzi |
11-20-2009, 09:51 PM | #107 |
SST...
Drives: SST Camaro 2010 Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: East Coast of Florida
Posts: 5,927
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Hey Mary -
Thanks for stopping in. A few posts up, Aby, wants to start learning how to autocross, so I figured to give her a link to the best. We are having a big fifth gen Camaro get together next April 16-18 including autocross, so your tips are a big help for so many here. FYI: http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46574 -Bruce |
11-21-2009, 09:36 AM | #108 | ||
Drives: the 2nd amendment home Join Date: May 2008
Location: OK
Posts: 14,707
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Quote:
What suspension mods have been done? Quote:
I think there's a young lady on here that will be wanting to bend your ear.
__________________
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
-- Benjamin Franklin |
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11-22-2009, 11:02 AM | #109 |
Drives: 1968 LS2 powered - Bad Penny Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Anaheim Hills, CA
Posts: 235
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Watch out for Mary.. she cheats! (j/k)
But she does always drive my car faster in the autox than I do.. so that does get annoying.. Welcome to the site Mary!
__________________
Tech Editor for Camaro Performers Magazine
1968 Camaro - 461 RHS LS 700hp, various stuff, called Bad Penny 1968 Camaro - In progress, called Track Rat 2010 Camaro - DSE Suspension, Baer 6S Brakes, Boze Wheels, Nitto NT05 Tires, JBA Exhaust and long tubes, Magnacharger TVS, 660rwhp Forged Eagle 416 LS3 short block, ADM fuel system, Lingenfelter GT-9 cam, G-Force axles, Anvil and Seibon CF parts, Centerforce Dual-Disc Clutch www.fquick.com/steve1968ls2 |
11-22-2009, 10:07 PM | #110 |
Drives: Camaro Justice Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Virginia
Posts: 20,174
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Very well done Mary!
You can find some interesting data here. http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showth...54#post1198554 |
11-23-2009, 09:02 PM | #111 |
SST...
Drives: SST Camaro 2010 Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: East Coast of Florida
Posts: 5,927
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That's cool Steve. You are not slouch either ...and Penny is one bad-ass ride.
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11-25-2009, 01:02 AM | #112 |
Account Suspended
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Hey JusticePete, question with Forgeline, I was told by forgeline I have to run a spacer in order for my wheels to fit the Camaro, the wheel size is 20x10.5 with 295/35/20 Nitto INVO. Due to the "reverse mount" of the 20x10.5 wheel, if I want to eleminate the spacers, I have to run 10" wide wheel. I know your Pedders Camaro run 19x10.5, did you have to add spacers? I'm gonna have to bite the bullet and sacrifice 1/2 inch just so I don't have deal with dumb spacers. By the way, I was (past tense) going to run 20x10.5 all the way around. The other option I was given is the step lip outter but thats not the look I'm after. Performance wise, yes the step lip would be better. But I'm also going after the look and the option of step lip outter would make it look "cheesy". If you don't have an answer, anyone? Trying to figure out this wheel and tire combo is a PITA and its becoming very fustrating.
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