Ball bearing vs journal bearing turbos?

[BlakeH827]

So what are the main differences between ball bearing and journal bearing turbos? I know that ball bearings spool faster. But is there any difference in the reliability of them? Does one last longer than the other?

[roller]

ive used both on a drag radial car a journal bearing and a billet wheel.
most of promod guys are running billet wheels and journal bearings and some of us drag radial guys are also.
spooling the turbo has alot to do with the converter and the tune up and a/r ratio

[SC2150]

Agree w/roller.

We see longer life on the street w/ball bearing vs journal, but alot has to do with the manufacturer of the turbo and the oiling & return system used.

Roller, you guys make so much power you dont need to wait to spool!!! Nice to see another actual drag racer on here....only a handfull on here as members.

[BlakeH827]

The kit I was looking into is the ips entry kit with journal bearings. They said the kit is really reliable but I was told by a guy with the granatelli kit not to get journal bearings. They are Garrett turbos. How reliable for a street car/dd?

[SSE 4 2SS]

Originally Posted by BlakeH827

The kit I was looking into is the ips entry kit with journal bearings. They said the kit is really reliable but I was told by a guy with the granatelli kit not to get journal bearings. They are Garrett turbos. How reliable for a street car/dd?

If the journal bearing turbo's are properly sized, to the cubic inches and rpm range, and the orifice's for the oiler circuit are correctly sized, then there is no real concern from one to the other...
Like was mentioned, make sure you have a good return circuit so oil isn't building up at the turbo, and that they are properly sized so you are not over/under spinning them... Taking a turbo kit designed for a 376 cubic inch engine and tossing 427 CI worth of exhaust at them isn't so good for them... ask me how I know...

The IPS kit have been reliable based on talking to a few guys with it... IPS did their homework...

[BlakeH827]

Originally Posted by SSE 4 2SS

If the journal bearing turbo's are properly sized, to the cubic inches and rpm range, and the orifice's for the oiler circuit are correctly sized, then there is no real concern from one to the other...
Like was mentioned, make sure you have a good return circuit so oil isn't building up at the turbo, and that they are properly sized so you are not over/under spinning them... Taking a turbo kit designed for a 376 cubic inch engine and tossing 427 CI worth of exhaust at them isn't so good for them... ask me how I know...

The IPS kit have been reliable based on talking to a few guys with it... IPS did their homework...

Okay with that being said I was planning on going with a 3 inch cat back instead of the 2.5inch. Is that to much? I don't know the specs yet of the turbos other than they are smaller with 2.5in down pipes and t3 flanges. The A/R is .82 and they aren't billet or ball bearing. I know people have said great thing about the ips kit. But the other kit had billet wheels and ball bearings. Also I don't want over 700whp so Idk if that changes things or not. Ips got like 650 on a stock l99 except 3 in cat back on 9lbs I believe

[SSE 4 2SS]

Originally Posted by BlakeH827

Okay with that being said I was planning on going with a 3 inch cat back instead of the 2.5inch. Is that to much? I don't know the specs yet of the turbos other than they are smaller with 2.5in down pipes and t3 flanges. The A/R is .82 and they aren't billet or ball bearing. I know people have said great thing about the ips kit. But the other kit had billet wheels and ball bearings. Also I don't want over 700whp so Idk if that changes things or not. Ips got like 650 on a stock l99 except 3 in cat back on 9lbs I believe

I have a three inch cat back... with full mufflers, but as for your purposes, I would honestly ask IPS... They can probably give you the low down... My turbos originally came with 2.5" down pipes, and we cut them off and put 3" pipes in. I didn't know and wasn't told from the get go that 3" down pipes were an option...

[roller]

Originally Posted by SC2150

Agree w/roller.

We see longer life on the street w/ball bearing vs journal, but alot has to do with the manufacturer of the turbo and the oiling & return system used.

Roller, you guys make so much power you dont need to wait to spool!!! Nice to see another actual drag racer on here....only a handfull on here as members.

thanks for the nice props on real drag racer ive been doing it for awhile.
i took the last 5 yrs off to regroup and build the new turbo combo and to focus on my bussines and family.
getting ready to get back into x-275 stuff and the new nmca class.
and your right we have a lot of power and can spool pretty quick.

can you recomend a few companys that build some bolt on turbo kits for theses cars for daily driver

[Ken_]

Originally Posted by BlakeH827

The kit I was looking into is the ips entry kit with journal bearings. They said the kit is really reliable but I was told by a guy with the granatelli kit not to get journal bearings. They are Garrett turbos. How reliable for a street car/dd?

Garrett turbos are choice. You can't go wrong with a Garrett. Since you are speaking about a street/dd, it won't matter much whether you get a BB or journal style bearing. In fact, on the Garrett site, you can choose either. But for me, BB is the choice.

[SC2150]

IPS does a good job, turbonetics, stay clear of STS. We do custom ones but have not released a kit yet.

For heads up racing we go back to the Keen bro's in 10.5" but most of what we do is NHRA TD, SC, SG, SS, and stock. Some comp eliminator.

Used to run the IHRA divisional and National circuit as well but no time for that now. Won a couple National Championships last season in NHRA (SG & SS) but last World was 2011 in Pomona.

Browse through here and there is a small handfull of other true competitive drag racers to get to know.

[stevieturbo]

If you're auto ( ie mostly higher rpm and foot never leaves the floor ), only do straight lines, and arent using huge boost then it would maybe be hard to warrant the extra cost for a BB unit.

But at higher boost pressures, the BB units handle it better. Thrusts on oil journals are less reliable.
If you've a manual trans, and lift off changing gear, or around a racetrack, then the faster response of a BB unit would well be worth having.

[Unreal]

Totally depends on the size of turbos. Running twin 56mms on an auto car we have near instant boost and are making full boost by 2300rpm. That is twin BW 56mm conventional bearing turbos.

[BlakeH827]

I just want a nice dd/street car. I just need everything to last. I think they got 650rwhp on 9 psi on a stock l99 with 3 inch catback with the ips entry level kit, no ball bearing or billet. Just basic turbos. If the journal bearing will last at that boost level then by all means that's fine with me. I'd like to get 700 eventually with about 10-11 psi but no more than that. This car does 85% of its driving just cruising at under 2k rpm. What would be the best option?

[stevieturbo]

Originally Posted by BlakeH827

I just want a nice dd/street car. I just need everything to last. I think they got 650rwhp on 9 psi on a stock l99 with 3 inch catback with the ips entry level kit, no ball bearing or billet. Just basic turbos. If the journal bearing will last at that boost level then by all means that's fine with me. I'd like to get 700 eventually with about 10-11 psi but no more than that. This car does 85% of its driving just cruising at under 2k rpm. What would be the best option?

Really, for such relatively low goals ( ie 650 with twins and such low boost ), it would be hard to justify the added cost of BB units.
But just depends on your budget and whether it actually matters or not.