Serious ZL1 Defects - Page 23 - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

2ss-booya · 09-06-2012, 12:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VChula

I don't think the above statement is correct.

I could be wrong, but I believe that there is no physical/mechanical connection between the steering wheel and the steering rack, hence the term "electric steering"..

I believe this is incorrect. The difference with electric steering is that there is an electric motor assisting the rack/pinion etc. as opposed to a hydraulic pump.

jdenotter · 09-06-2012, 12:09 AM

He is right ... Electric power steering replaces the hydraulic system that has been used for decades. A rack and pinion system is still in place but instead of fluid under pressure by means of the power steering pump. The electric system uses a computer controlled motor to assist in steering. On some cars this motor can be located in the steering rack itself or it may be mounted outside. Some of these system have a computer to monitor road speed, and adjust the motor speed to provide different feedback depending on speed. This allows for better low speed assist and better road feel on the highway. Another advantage is that because their is no power steering pump to draw horsepower away from the engine. It would have a slight effect on engine load. These systems are becoming mainstream and will probably be in most vehicles in the next few years.-from wiki.answers.com

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Mersades · 09-06-2012, 12:19 AM

Glad that you're ok, Cam. I don't blame you a bit for how you're feeling. The video made my stomach churn, but I'm really glad the car kept you safe.

Best wishes from another Camaro lover.

Fixer · 09-06-2012, 06:53 AM

What a story! I feel for you CAM ZL1! With all you've put up with, GM's still got a customer in you. Wow!

Glad you're okay!

Happy_Dan · 09-06-2012, 07:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr02Z/28

LoL @ Happy Dan...... I'm just interested in what your fellow C5 members are unhappy with... an expensive car with some issues that shouldn't happen.... I read the threads, it's not hard to do, I'm assuming you have read about the problems too... My take on it is that some buy this car and are not able to handle to power it holds and some probably have been street racing and caused the accidents, hence where the car is located, like in the middle of no where..

Fair enough. But every car line has problems. We have a spotlight on this one and there has been no definitive statements from engineers or people doing toe RCA. So the conclusions and opinions we have are not necessarily fact and on the internet, when we state things as facts they tend to be believed. All I am asking is to wait for FACTS on the reasons for the problems and not say everything is junk.

Norm Peterson · 09-06-2012, 07:38 AM

Cam - I'm glad to hear that you could walk away, and I hope that you don't experience any lingering or delayed symptoms.

I saw the video before the crash thread went into time-out, and I don't think I've ever witnessed such a display of insensitivity and lack of sympathy as I heard there. If that crash thread never resurfaces, nobody who claims to have even a shred of decency would care.

Hats off to SSE 4 2SS for his action.

About the Electric Power Assisted Steering (EPAS) itself, the wiki.answers write-up is a pretty basic description of these systems in general, with a little hype thrown in for good measure. Beyond that, I'll just wait for official findings to become available through Cam, assuming that they eventually will.

Norm

Norm Peterson · 09-06-2012, 10:23 AM

And it's not going to get resolved overnight, no matter who'd like that to happen or how much commotion is made over it.

The video in that thread serves no constructive purpose whatsoever.

Norm

MarcInUtah · 09-06-2012, 11:32 AM

Is this the FIRST documented EPAS failure on the ZL1?

jdenotter · 09-06-2012, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarcInUtah

Is this the FIRST documented EPAS failure on the ZL1?

No. However noone has wrecked a car over one and I can not really see how you could lose total control of a vehicle with it going out. To me there more to this than what we all know.
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mr_honez · 09-06-2012, 01:42 PM

Glad you are ok CAM, that is the most important part. I have issues with electric steering though, and won't own a vehicle with one until they have some analog type of backup system with it. Any vehicle with electric steering with no backup is crazy IMHO.

toesuf94 · 09-06-2012, 02:22 PM

Guys: CamZL1 has pretty much asked us all to stand down until he gets some answers from the analysis of his car. He is not panicked about the steering as a ZL1 issue because it may have been the result of other worked performed on the car at the dealer level. The engine was replaced in his car at the dealer, so the entire underside of the front end was in and out of the car. We may never know for sure. Just be glad that Cam is o.k. and that if there is something to tell us, he will when he has something to tell. Right now, we are in a "wait and see" holding pattern.

101fng · 09-06-2012, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr_honez

Glad you are ok CAM, that is the most important part. I have issues with electric steering though, and won't own a vehicle with one until they have some analog type of backup system with it. Any vehicle with electric steering with no backup is crazy IMHO.

EPAS still uses a rack and pinion. something must've let go between the steering wheel and rack for it to just veer off uncontrollably. that, or a tie rod came apart. an electronic failure would just make steering a little stiffer at low speeds, but judging from the video, he wasn't exactly going slow when it happened.

Norm Peterson · 09-06-2012, 03:52 PM

Let's just say that the simplified descriptions of EPAS operation - which usually are written up as analogies to hydraulic power assist systems - really don't give you enough to go on here.

When a ditch is involved as Cam has already noted, you don't have to be going very fast for the damage to be extensive. All we really know is that it was a fast enough and a hard enough hit to deploy the air bag.

I'm afraid that if this thread degenerates much further into speculation it'll get sent to the time-out corner too.

mr_honez - I'm not sold on EPAS either. But my reasons are somewhat different and not relevant to the discussion thus far.

Norm

ToolFan66 · 09-06-2012, 04:02 PM

Personally I think CAM should stay clear of this issue till he resolves it with the powers that be.

Also if this ends up being an issue with these cars you can be certain there will be a recall, and this I'm sure will happen fast if it needs to be taken care of cause nobody wants to see someone get hurt..

Just My .02

Glad you are OK and update when you feel the need to do so, till anything is certain you have no need to defend your self in this matter..

Peace..

09-06-2012, 12:09 AM	#310
jdenotter Drives: 2010 2SS/RS,M6,Black w/CGM Stripes Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Nashville, NC Posts: 1,778 View My Garage	He is right ... Electric power steering replaces the hydraulic system that has been used for decades. A rack and pinion system is still in place but instead of fluid under pressure by means of the power steering pump. The electric system uses a computer controlled motor to assist in steering. On some cars this motor can be located in the steering rack itself or it may be mounted outside. Some of these system have a computer to monitor road speed, and adjust the motor speed to provide different feedback depending on speed. This allows for better low speed assist and better road feel on the highway. Another advantage is that because their is no power steering pump to draw horsepower away from the engine. It would have a slight effect on engine load. These systems are becoming mainstream and will probably be in most vehicles in the next few years.-from wiki.answers.com Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2 __________________ 3" RDP Motorsports aggressive cat-back exhaust w/ x-pipe, Vararam CAI, Hurst's short throw shifter, Gary's Customs painted bowties, Ofer's HID DRL/Fog Light wiring harness, Kelvin 8K HID DRL bulbs, ZL1 grille. Johnson's window tint film, LSR lowering springs, Metra dash kit with Pioneer In-Dash DVD head unit.

09-06-2012, 12:19 AM	#311
Mersades Web Geek Chick & NHRA fan Drives: 2010 2SS LS3 RJM Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Reno, NV Posts: 412 View My Garage	Glad that you're ok, Cam. I don't blame you a bit for how you're feeling. The video made my stomach churn, but I'm really glad the car kept you safe. Best wishes from another Camaro lover. __________________

09-06-2012, 02:22 PM	#319
toesuf94 Drives: THR #11 E-force supercharged Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Cedar Rapids, IA Posts: 4,746	Guys: CamZL1 has pretty much asked us all to stand down until he gets some answers from the analysis of his car. He is not panicked about the steering as a ZL1 issue because it may have been the result of other worked performed on the car at the dealer level. The engine was replaced in his car at the dealer, so the entire underside of the front end was in and out of the car. We may never know for sure. Just be glad that Cam is o.k. and that if there is something to tell us, he will when he has something to tell. Right now, we are in a "wait and see" holding pattern. __________________ Cars and women are both going to give you problems...but you can pay somebody else to fix your car!

09-06-2012, 06:53 AM	#312
Fixer Drives: Virtual ZL1 Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Guam Posts: 21	What a story! I feel for you CAM ZL1! With all you've put up with, GM's still got a customer in you. Wow! Glad you're okay!

09-06-2012, 07:38 AM	#314
Norm Peterson corner barstool sitter Drives: 08 Mustang GT, 19 WRX Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Eastern Time Zone Posts: 6,990	Cam - I'm glad to hear that you could walk away, and I hope that you don't experience any lingering or delayed symptoms. I saw the video before the crash thread went into time-out, and I don't think I've ever witnessed such a display of insensitivity and lack of sympathy as I heard there. If that crash thread never resurfaces, nobody who claims to have even a shred of decency would care. Hats off to SSE 4 2SS for his action. About the Electric Power Assisted Steering (EPAS) itself, the wiki.answers write-up is a pretty basic description of these systems in general, with a little hype thrown in for good measure. Beyond that, I'll just wait for official findings to become available through Cam, assuming that they eventually will. Norm

09-06-2012, 10:23 AM	#315
Norm Peterson corner barstool sitter Drives: 08 Mustang GT, 19 WRX Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Eastern Time Zone Posts: 6,990	And it's not going to get resolved overnight, no matter who'd like that to happen or how much commotion is made over it. The video in that thread serves no constructive purpose whatsoever. Norm

09-06-2012, 11:32 AM	#316
MarcInUtah Banned Drives: Mustang(s) Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Syracuse, Utah Posts: 44	Is this the FIRST documented EPAS failure on the ZL1?

09-06-2012, 01:42 PM	#318
mr_honez Wifey Lover Drives: 2013 Crystal Red 2LT/RS Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Bastrop, Texas Posts: 1,540 View My Garage	Glad you are ok CAM, that is the most important part. I have issues with electric steering though, and won't own a vehicle with one until they have some analog type of backup system with it. Any vehicle with electric steering with no backup is crazy IMHO.

09-06-2012, 03:52 PM	#321
Norm Peterson corner barstool sitter Drives: 08 Mustang GT, 19 WRX Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Eastern Time Zone Posts: 6,990	Let's just say that the simplified descriptions of EPAS operation - which usually are written up as analogies to hydraulic power assist systems - really don't give you enough to go on here. When a ditch is involved as Cam has already noted, you don't have to be going very fast for the damage to be extensive. All we really know is that it was a fast enough and a hard enough hit to deploy the air bag. I'm afraid that if this thread degenerates much further into speculation it'll get sent to the time-out corner too. mr_honez - I'm not sold on EPAS either. But my reasons are somewhat different and not relevant to the discussion thus far. Norm

09-06-2012, 04:02 PM	#322
ToolFan66 Drives: 2011 2SS 6.2L W/RS package Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Colorado Posts: 3,008	Personally I think CAM should stay clear of this issue till he resolves it with the powers that be. Also if this ends up being an issue with these cars you can be certain there will be a recall, and this I'm sure will happen fast if it needs to be taken care of cause nobody wants to see someone get hurt.. Just My .02 Glad you are OK and update when you feel the need to do so, till anything is certain you have no need to defend your self in this matter.. Peace..