Launch control failure(axle) - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

maxxer442 · 08-08-2012, 09:52 AM

So my 2010 SS M6 has around 10,000 easy miles on it-all from me. No racing, just run it thru the gears once in a while, no hard launches. I have tried the launch control like twice when I first bought it way back in 09. Didn't like it, its too violent. I had a buddy with me the other night, and he wanted to see how it worked. So I put it in the mode, it worked like it was supposed to, until I dumped the clutch and broke the right side half-shaft. What the heck! Is this a fluke? Do I have to worry about ever using that again? The car is bone stock with catback and a hurst short-throw. It was covered under warranty with no questions asked-but is this common?

Jason@JacFab · 08-08-2012, 10:00 AM

I've read of a few occurences. The general concensus I see is, use the factory launch control, and break stuff. I've used it twice and experienced violent wheel hop both times, I don't think I will ever use it again. Glad you got it covered under warranty!

Russell James · 08-08-2012, 10:04 AM

Forget that feature is there and never use it.

Too many variables to not avoid busting something. Road grip, tire pressure, temp, clutch grip, alignment.... get the right combo that causes wheel hop and parts will break.

Lucky it was just the axle and not the driveshaft that can destroy the exhaust and belly pan of the car.

HumanWiki · 08-08-2012, 10:23 AM

^ Ditto.

LC on the SS is just a nice little toy that you'll roll the dice on every time.. It's ultimately useless and a decent driver will outrun it every time.

Driveshaftshop · 08-08-2012, 10:26 AM

one of the issues is the rear axles are made from a carbon material and will have a wide range of results as far as breakage. Retained Austenite in the material is the culprate (along with wheel hop) this is why the failures are not as consistent as most would like to see. some of the axles will last for some time and with allot of abuse and others will fail quickly. this is why the aftermarket will use Chromoly materials that are a cleaner bland to start with so there is much less or no Retained Austenite.

How Does Retained Austenite Affect Performance?
Hardening of steels requires heating to an austenitic phase and quenching to room temperature to produce a hard martensitic phase. Due to incomplete transformation some austenite is retained at room temperature. Retained austenite can have a detrimental affect on the mechanical properties of the steel. Properties such as fatigue strength, toughness, hardness, yield strength and machinability can be influenced by retained austenite

ZED SLED · 08-08-2012, 10:29 AM

Are our axles yet another high quality item made in China?

Driveshaftshop · 08-08-2012, 10:56 AM

no, but in the beginning CV axles were made from a much higher grade of material. as time went on they were able to understand the way there made and what it can take. on a scale from 1-10 if an axle needed to handle say a #5 it would be made to #9 now the axles that need to handle #5 are designed for just over it like a #5.5 its not that there made bad, there just being made to do what it was intended for, no more.

Kiernans88 · 08-08-2012, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Driveshaftshop

one of the issues is the rear axles are made from a carbon material and will have a wide range of results as far as breakage. Retained Austenite in the material is the culprate (along with wheel hop) this is why the failures are not as consistent as most would like to see. some of the axles will last for some time and with allot of abuse and others will fail quickly. this is why the aftermarket will use Chromoly materials that are a cleaner bland to start with so there is much less or no Retained Austenite.

How Does Retained Austenite Affect Performance?
Hardening of steels requires heating to an austenitic phase and quenching to room temperature to produce a hard martensitic phase. Due to incomplete transformation some austenite is retained at room temperature. Retained austenite can have a detrimental affect on the mechanical properties of the steel. Properties such as fatigue strength, toughness, hardness, yield strength and machinability can be influenced by retained austenite

+1

This put a smile on my face. Iron/carbon phase diagrams oddly excite me!

GFORCE1320 · 08-08-2012, 10:37 PM

It all boils down to the cheaper the steel, the more inconsistent results you get.
There are lots of different steel one could use for drivetrain parts.
We have tested just about every material there is that is suitable for making drivetrain parts from and we also do material analysis on OEM parts to see what they are made of and why they fail.
You would be surprised at what kind of mixtures steels and low grades the OEM's use. Some of the materials the OEM’s use are not even on the engineering standards charts..

As far as aftermarket axles, we don’t use chromoly steel, it's a 41xx series steel from the Chromium-Molybdenum family hence the commonly used name Chro-moly.
We've never had much luck with it and the tensile strength isn’t as high as say 4340 or 300m.
4340 is from the Nickel-Chromium family of 43xx steels and is not chromoly, 300m is a modified version of 4340. 300m is not a chromoly either. Totally different material.
To get drivetrain parts to live under extreme conditions, the material has to be able to survive high impact loads, be able to twist without breaking and spring back to it’s original state.

The automotive OEM's could produce some really great drivetrain parts if they wanted to but when they are cranking out cars by the 100,000's of thousands, spending an extra $100. on materials would really add up.
So they only design parts to live up to normal driving and warranty anything that breaks.

I love experimenting with different materials, seeing how they come out as far as tensile strength tests and also how they machine in our cnc machines.
Sorry if I rambled on but this stuff is what I love to do

2012-2SS · 08-09-2012, 03:47 AM

Since when do our camaros have launch control?

Higgs Boson · 08-09-2012, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2012-2SS

Since when do our camaros have launch control?

http://www.camaro5.com/launch-control-demo-information

ZED SLED · 08-09-2012, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2012-2SS

Since when do our camaros have launch control?

March 16, 2009. Fleet test cars before that.

carbon8 · 08-09-2012, 11:32 AM

Can anyone show pics of where the axels break at.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Higgs Boson · 08-09-2012, 12:10 PM

they usually twist off one of the ends.

08-08-2012, 09:52 AM	#1
maxxer442 Drives: 2010 IOM 2SS M6 Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Illinois Posts: 27	Launch control failure(axle) So my 2010 SS M6 has around 10,000 easy miles on it-all from me. No racing, just run it thru the gears once in a while, no hard launches. I have tried the launch control like twice when I first bought it way back in 09. Didn't like it, its too violent. I had a buddy with me the other night, and he wanted to see how it worked. So I put it in the mode, it worked like it was supposed to, until I dumped the clutch and broke the right side half-shaft. What the heck! Is this a fluke? Do I have to worry about ever using that again? The car is bone stock with catback and a hurst short-throw. It was covered under warranty with no questions asked-but is this common?

08-08-2012, 10:29 AM	#6
ZED SLED Drives: 2017 Mosaic Bk ZL1 M6 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: South of Raleigh, NC Posts: 9,477 View My Garage	Are our axles yet another high quality item made in China? __________________

08-09-2012, 03:47 AM	#10
2012-2SS Drives: 2012 Camaro 2SS/RS Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Dover, NH Posts: 678	Since when do our camaros have launch control? __________________ 2012 Camaro 2SS/RS, Hurst Short Throw, IdealG M/C, Pypes Pipe Bomb, LSR Cold Air Intake, LSR Toe Links/Lower Control Arms Clear Image headers, high flows, Slowhawk tune 1974 Chevy K10 Built 355, FAST EZ EFI, 5speed 2000 Chevy Tahoe LT 5.3L, Slowhawk tune

08-08-2012, 10:00 AM	#2
Jason@JacFab Drives: 2016 1LT RS Camaro; 72 Chevelle Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Central Point, OR Posts: 5,688 View My Garage	I've read of a few occurences. The general concensus I see is, use the factory launch control, and break stuff. I've used it twice and experienced violent wheel hop both times, I don't think I will ever use it again. Glad you got it covered under warranty!

08-08-2012, 10:04 AM	#3
Russell James Drives: '15 SS 1LE, '69 Z28 drag car Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Mich Posts: 4,482	Forget that feature is there and never use it. Too many variables to not avoid busting something. Road grip, tire pressure, temp, clutch grip, alignment.... get the right combo that causes wheel hop and parts will break. Lucky it was just the axle and not the driveshaft that can destroy the exhaust and belly pan of the car.

08-08-2012, 10:23 AM	#4
HumanWiki Drives: Car Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Place Posts: 3,361	^ Ditto. LC on the SS is just a nice little toy that you'll roll the dice on every time.. It's ultimately useless and a decent driver will outrun it every time.

08-08-2012, 10:26 AM	#5
Driveshaftshop Drives: own more cars than i can list Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Charlotte NC Posts: 1,124	one of the issues is the rear axles are made from a carbon material and will have a wide range of results as far as breakage. Retained Austenite in the material is the culprate (along with wheel hop) this is why the failures are not as consistent as most would like to see. some of the axles will last for some time and with allot of abuse and others will fail quickly. this is why the aftermarket will use Chromoly materials that are a cleaner bland to start with so there is much less or no Retained Austenite. How Does Retained Austenite Affect Performance? Hardening of steels requires heating to an austenitic phase and quenching to room temperature to produce a hard martensitic phase. Due to incomplete transformation some austenite is retained at room temperature. Retained austenite can have a detrimental affect on the mechanical properties of the steel. Properties such as fatigue strength, toughness, hardness, yield strength and machinability can be influenced by retained austenite

08-08-2012, 10:56 AM	#7
Driveshaftshop Drives: own more cars than i can list Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Charlotte NC Posts: 1,124	no, but in the beginning CV axles were made from a much higher grade of material. as time went on they were able to understand the way there made and what it can take. on a scale from 1-10 if an axle needed to handle say a #5 it would be made to #9 now the axles that need to handle #5 are designed for just over it like a #5.5 its not that there made bad, there just being made to do what it was intended for, no more.

08-08-2012, 10:37 PM	#9
GFORCE1320 Drives: 05 GTO Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Wichita, KS Posts: 1,243	It all boils down to the cheaper the steel, the more inconsistent results you get. There are lots of different steel one could use for drivetrain parts. We have tested just about every material there is that is suitable for making drivetrain parts from and we also do material analysis on OEM parts to see what they are made of and why they fail. You would be surprised at what kind of mixtures steels and low grades the OEM's use. Some of the materials the OEM’s use are not even on the engineering standards charts.. As far as aftermarket axles, we don’t use chromoly steel, it's a 41xx series steel from the Chromium-Molybdenum family hence the commonly used name Chro-moly. We've never had much luck with it and the tensile strength isn’t as high as say 4340 or 300m. 4340 is from the Nickel-Chromium family of 43xx steels and is not chromoly, 300m is a modified version of 4340. 300m is not a chromoly either. Totally different material. To get drivetrain parts to live under extreme conditions, the material has to be able to survive high impact loads, be able to twist without breaking and spring back to it’s original state. The automotive OEM's could produce some really great drivetrain parts if they wanted to but when they are cranking out cars by the 100,000's of thousands, spending an extra $100. on materials would really add up. So they only design parts to live up to normal driving and warranty anything that breaks. I love experimenting with different materials, seeing how they come out as far as tensile strength tests and also how they machine in our cnc machines. Sorry if I rambled on but this stuff is what I love to do

08-09-2012, 11:32 AM	#13
carbon8 Drives: 2010 Camaro SS,2008 Hayabusa Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Yukon,Oklahoma Posts: 621	Can anyone show pics of where the axels break at. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

08-09-2012, 12:10 PM	#14
Higgs Boson Perpetual Order Drives: indeed Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Texas Hill Country Posts: 1,277	they usually twist off one of the ends.