Wongs performance vancouver...the place to go

[1KillerSS]

the bs was for the fact that your putting your ZR1 on such a high and mighty pedestal and acting like your crap dont stink...i have already agreed that i would expect my car to be cleaned and fingerprint free...would you have them leave the scratch in it? would you have them send it to he paint shop? would you have them discount the bill? or would you have them just try to make it right?

things happen man even to your baby same as all our baby's

what the hell does dyno sheets have to do with your car being dirty or any swirl marks
to prove that your happy about the performance but you arent going back>?
congrats to the OP and glad your happy man charge hard!

[DroptopZ]

Originally Posted by 1KillerSS

the bs was for the fact that your putting your ZR1 on such a high and mighty pedestal and acting like your crap dont stink...i have already agreed that i would expect my car to be cleaned and fingerprint free...would you have them leave the scratch in it? would you have them send it to he paint shop? would you have them discount the bill? or would you have them just try to make it right?

things happen man even to your baby same as all our baby's

what the hell does dyno sheets have to do with your car being dirty or any swirl marks
to prove that your happy about the performance but you arent going back>?
congrats to the OP and glad your happy man charge hard!

The internet is the internet, and tone is hard to read. I took 'I know when I smell BS (paraphrasing)' to mean 'You're a troll who never had his car tuned at Wong's, no ZR1, etc.' The pictures were to reinforce that I've had real, relevant experience. It was also to reinforce that I was happy with Tom's treatment of MY car and how it came out.

I don't treat my car like it's priceless and like I said, I understand mistakes happen. The car is my dad's; all I was doing is sharing my experience with the place, which I think is more than fair in case someone might have the same concern.

Again, congrats OP as it sounds like a fantastic build.

[1KillerSS]

understood man and thanks

[CWI]

Originally Posted by christianchevell

apparently driving the car which is a blessing to be done by the tuner in your opinion is a hazard to be avoided in a way that most of us would beg to have it done but someone who looks at finger prints from their engines dirt and grease as a big fault and the tuner test driving it as a no-no really does not deserve to ever have that person work on their car ever again. Yes tom drove my car, and your damn right I am glad he did, I had to wait over a hour when I dropped off my car because he went to lunch and was test driving a corvette, If he did not test drive it he would be negligent in performing his job in my opinion. If it had a tuning problem I am sure he would have fixed it say a flat spot in its performance.... or stumbling at a rpm under load etc by re tuning the cars calibrations. This is someone who can adjust every option in the cars tune including the air fuel mixtures at every rpm, tuning off traction control and tuning out traction management, changing the rev limiter. I defer to his many years of judgement as he is the expert, If you think he should go wash your car when he is done fine you should pay $100 a hour to have your car washed. If you look at the dyno my car is protected on the sides and the front over the clear bra. the things you mentioned are very pitifully small compared to what I have heard of other tuners doing and the quality of their work.
And do you honestly think he spent time trying to buff something out of the Camaro? get real, time is money, my car came to him dirty with road spray from a heavy rain and 60+ miles up I-5 should I expect it detailed when I pick it up? God forbid should he touch the car with a finger........ If he could I am sure he would have remedied the situation of told your where they could go for their next bit of work, and someone that anal I would never let them near the car while I was working on it....and I picked all my parts myself and verified every thing in the tune and install beforehand so call me anal.
I think this is more to do with age and the blame game that is part of todays narcissistic culture club. But hey that's just me a old hot rodder who knows you have to break some friggin eggs to make a omlet and WTF, if the owner of the car noted every thing on his condition of a car like a home depot delivery person when dropping off a appliance checking every wall and door opening in a house...well I for one would want to charge that person extra, and to work on their car and not test drive it...well I might just tell them forget it, go away, your a liability I am not willing to take........BUH BYE, don't let the door hit you in the arse.
Gee Figure that........ Insert picture of: highly paid G.M. expert electrical engineer with over 20 years experience wiping a dirty finger print or three off a spoiler from opening trunk for parts or to disconnect a battery, OR insert picture of: illegal alien , or minimum wage flunky standing by with squirt bottle and rag to clean up any finger print ASAP and then detail car for owner....... you make the choice.

And so think what you will his facebook page with the ZR1, the z06's, the nickey 1000 h.p. Camaro, the many high dollar builds way beyond my car and this is the comment you come to give about how he tuned your car nice but a friend car.... oh my god he touched it and drove it........... Man ROFL WTF? I guess this guys Camaro must have been made of solid gold, or its on a pedestal so friggin high........... whats gonna happen with road rash or a door ding or god forbid, goose poop.... lol

I am just glad he posted on facebook how my car drove so it puts me at ease when I go to get my car finally today. And for the most radical LS3 cam you can get having him call it suitable for a daily driver yet going 60 in sixth it have a little cam surge is something I do want to know before I drive it, and also that he the expert recommends no more than this for a cam for the ls3 to be a daily and I am happy my choice being a old hot rodder is the bomb and I made 490 on the mustang dyno with only a cam, CAI, and headers. In other words for about $4500 I have 560+ conservative measurement flywheel .....and so I have about the power of a zl1 for the fraction of the cost and with better economy old school naturally aspirated dream of a engine LS# 3 is the bomb just as the hot rod and other tech mag's said.
And many who worry about if they will over cam are leaving a lot on the table, and may have little experience as I have had since building my own SBC cars for decades to drive and hot rod. And I am say a ported throttle body etc....away from the 500 rwhp club, or say a dynojet dyno away from the what club?...lol 490x10%= 49+490=539, or 490x15%= 73 + 490= 563 I know there is at some times on some dynos a great disparity between them and dyno jets inflate numbers from 1% to 10-15% from what I have read. So who knows, I am just happy I got the right guy who made sure to fine tune my ride and I made the right parts choices myself for my car to get these numbers which BTW is awesome....especially if you compare it to others with their flying monkey cam and night ranger cam etc...lol Mine is called a kick ass and take names cam....... lol well enough rambling, I have been excited as hell to go get my car and its T - two hours, 55 minutes until I hit the road with my wife. And this mofo helped make my dream come true, back off.

Wow. That shit is hard to read.

[christianchevell]

Sorry, but hey spilt milk is taking over.....lol and if you do not speak up when you think something has gone wrong at a shop immediately you have no course of action but to drink from "the big cup " of....STFU in my opinion. Guess I should go add some spaces in there.......... lol And BTW had to drive there again and have the two front o2s disabled as they sent up a couple codes about 40 miles down the road from delayed readings my exhaust is so fast now....... Of course maybe if Mr.Wong had just driven my car over 40 miles I would not have had to go back!!!! Man I better get on that guy not driving customers cars enough!!!!! Oh some people have a problem with that? oh and then they do not even speak up about a little dirt or such and hold it inside to try to what .... damage someones business through endless internet banter when the guy is a real nice guy? WTF. And yes the car is getting more stares than a topless car wash.

[EarlyApex]

So let me get this straight.

He is so good that your car is now throwing codes and the front 2 O2 sensors are now disabled?

You do know that the front sensors are needed by the computer to monitor the air fuel ratios among other things. Isn't that part of the tuning? I thought part of the advantage of a custom tune is not throwing codes due to headers, intakes and such.

I am not trying to dis your guy but I also don't think he walks on water based on your results.

I am in the Portland Metro area so I have to be able to pass DEQ. At some point in the future I will be adding a set of headers and hi flow cats so knowing of a good tuner in the area would be a plus. Any other options?

[DroptopZ]

Originally Posted by christianchevell

Sorry, but hey spilt milk is taking over.....lol and if you do not speak up when you think something has gone wrong at a shop immediately you have no course of action but to drink from "the big cup " of....STFU in my opinion. Guess I should go add some spaces in there.......... lol And BTW had to drive there again and have the two front o2s disabled as they sent up a couple codes about 40 miles down the road from delayed readings my exhaust is so fast now....... Of course maybe if Mr.Wong had just driven my car over 40 miles I would not have had to go back!!!! Man I better get on that guy not driving customers cars enough!!!!! Oh some people have a problem with that? oh and then they do not even speak up about a little dirt or such and hold it inside to try to what .... damage someones business through endless internet banter when the guy is a real nice guy? WTF. And yes the car is getting more stares than a topless car wash.

Don't be a corn-hole, dude. Sorry my opinion differs. I gave good and bad. Truthful, not just OMG Mai tooner is teh best guys! I throw teh codez but it's no biggie.

[christianchevell]

The deal is the headers flow so well the position of the front o2s even are too far, and I had to drive back so that makes not big deal really as the air fuel tables are already adjusted for the car and it is running like a champ. This is not just a problem with my headers but all headers are capable of doing this and it may be due to the fact my exhaust is so wide open with the dual mode it can be very loud now compared to before the headers when its opened up. You might find no matter where you go if you have brand x that all the o2s have to be disabled. And with brand Y your lucky enough not to have to worry about it, until one day...than you have to either clear the code or disable the front o2s as well. In the day there were no stupid o2 sensors on headers and things were just fine once you adjusted the carburetor /injection and that was it( if you had your metering rods right and the jetting right), except for the engine needing more gas in the cold which now is determined by the intake sensors of the air temp...
in the day it was the driver noticing the stumbling of the car wanting more gas as the idle would be a little off due to the denser air and that's easier to tell with a hot rod and then you just turn out the jet screws a little to the barrels, or adjust the idle a little for the cold weather.
And once again if you do not speak up you have nothing to say when you accept a car and drive off in it, if your lucky the guy is nice and will make everything right, if not well lesson learned but if you do not give him a chance or even have him on here to defend his self well that's trashy. And well people can always go to fast specialties in Vancouver, not to say they are not good, but hey they wanted a lot more for the same work! now what would you call that from a place that does not give your car personal attention as much as the ford or the dodge next to it because they are higher volume and want charge you more and do not specialize in g.m., and take more money and may give you the same grief?.

I am happy as hell with my car and I wish it was quieter now sometimes as people keep staring ......lol I love the cam lope though. And you know what they say about opinions? they are like what? and everyone has one! And I am happy my air fuel ratio is right where it should be in the 12 range on my dyno sheet and I have no heat induced pulling of timing or drop off in the h.p. until at the very end in the 6000 rpm range and my torque does not drop until the 5500 range. And yes you tell there is no data smoothing in my dyno chart , and of course the friend turns out to be your "DAD" .......... so dad couldn't man up and speak up so junior has to now huh? whatever, and BTW white sucks. lol


here if you want something about o2 sensors here is what I could dig up, and what do you think guys do that do a CAT delete? most people absolutely have to delete the downstream o2 sensors with cats,

The general idea however, is that the computer measures the amount of oxygen in the exhaust stream before the catalytic converter, and compares the results after the catalytic converter. In a properly functioning system, the converter will combine the unused fuel and the available oxygen together to produce carbon dioxide and water. Because the oxygen was consumed in this process, there will be less oxygen in the exhaust after it has passed through the catalytic converter.

The computer maintains a constant switching from rich to lean to produce a stoichiometric average. This method eliminates the need for air injection into the catalyst bed, and increases catalyst performance. The converter contains a variety of metals which carry out the reaction process, but it also contains a variety of other metals and compounds that assist this process, including a variety of oxygen storage compounds, typically either Cerium Oxide or Zirconia Oxide. Because of the reactions that take place, the waveform of the downstream sensor on a vehicle is typically a much more steady signal that is quite different from the rich to lean oscillations of the upstream sensors. If the converter is missing, or is no longer functioning, these reactions do not take place, and the downstream sensor will "mirror" what the upstream sensor does. The computer will measure the signal from the rear sensor, and if it is outside the acceptable limits, the computer will set the CEL.

You see the upstream still being on makes the car do rich lean rich lean rich lean.......... however>>>>>>>>>>>>>>


When an internal combustion engine is under high load (e.g. wide open throttle), the output of the oxygen sensor is ignored, and the ECU automatically enriches the mixture to protect the engine, as misfires under load are much more likely to cause damage. This is referred to as an engine running in 'open-loop mode'. Any changes in the sensor output will be ignored in this state. In many cars (with the exception of some turbocharged models), inputs from the air flow meter are also ignored, as they might otherwise lower engine performance due to the mixture being too rich or too lean, and increase the risk of engine damage due to detonation if the mixture is too lean.

and this: I am operating in open loop running a little rich, and that's what happens with the deletion of 02 sensors....................

The computer uses the oxygen sensor's input to regulate the fuel mixture, which is referred to as the fuel "feedback control loop." The computer takes its cues from the O2 sensor and responds by changing the fuel mixture. This produces a corresponding change in the O2 sensor reading. This is referred to as "closed loop" operation because the computer is using the O2 sensor's input to regulate the fuel mixture. The result is a constant flip-flop back and forth from rich to lean which allows the catalytic converter to operate at peak efficiency while keeping the average overall fuel mixture in proper balance to minimize emissions. It's a complicated setup but it works.
When no signal is received from the O2 sensor, as is the case when a cold engine is first started (or the 02 sensor fails), the computer orders a fixed (unchanging) rich fuel mixture. This is referred to as "open loop" operation because no input is used from the O2 sensor to regulate the fuel mixture. If the engine fails to go into closed loop when the O2 sensor reaches operating temperature, or drops out of closed loop because the O2 sensor's signal is lost, the engine will run too rich causing an increase in fuel consumption and emissions. A bad coolant sensor can also prevent the system from going into closed loop because the computer also considers engine coolant temperature when deciding whether or not to go into closed loop.

http://www.autotap.com/techlibrary/u...en_sensors.asp

So If I were up in Portland I would leave my stock exhaust alone thanks to friggin DEQ or go with shorty headers and keep the stock cats intact as its a crap shoot if you got the right exhaust headers to be able to use one set or both sets of your o2 sensors as far as I can tell there is no one saying hey our headers work with all the stock o2 sensors enabled and they never have a problem, if you do find one let me know! I am doing fine, and glad I do not have DEQ or I would have to put my stock exhaust back on. And the o2 sensors do not work until they are like 600 degrees and that's why they have heaters on them now, and why they added a second set in the last decade because the EPA ruins America.....excuse me runs America thanks to the super green movement..... and a reason all the ZDDP is way lower in oil cause it may hurt the precious catalytic converter and we can just forget about any classic engines surviving and maybe ours if we do not pay attention to the oil we use being just right. That's why I am using driven racing ls30 after I dump my second break in oil of br30 here in 200 miles. And I have no codes on my car now. I will be talking with mr. wong to see if he can custom adjust my tuning even better so the computer does not have a problem with the delay in the front o2 sensors not being hot enough so it can try to adjust the air fuel mixture rich then lean then rich then lean then rich then lean in its damn operational functioning. I frankly hate this part of new cars and the two sensors they have now on each exhaust instead of one, and want to see if I can fix mine better yet it is not such a easy one time fix apparently if you want to use the sensors and not run rich. Here is what stainless works says about the sensors and codes:


Will your Stainless Works Headers throw a check engine light (CEL)?

This is a very common question that we get asked when someone wants to install long tube headers on their vehicle. Before we go into the full explanation, we can definitely say that not every car is exactly the same. Some people will throw a CEL with our headers, and some people will not.
The CEL can come on for two main reasons when you're dealing with any kind of long tube header and high flow cats/offroad lead pipes.
The first reason is the rear o2 sensors will throw a cat efficiency code. Basically because the high flow cats flow a lot better than the factory cats, the o2 sensor is sensing more emissions than before and they will freak out. The way you fix that issue is you tune out the rear o2s. There are hand held programmers that can do this for you or you can contact your local tuner or contact Stainless Works for a recommendation. This cat efficiency code is most common.
The second reason a CEL will come on is because of the front o2 sensors. The front o2 sensors are meant to reach a certain temperature reading in a certain amount of time. If it doesn't reach that temperature, then it will throw a code. The o2 sensor bung is located in the collector of the long tube header. This usually means the location is pushed farther away than where the o2 bung is from the factory. From the extra flow of the long tube, and the new location of the o2 bung, it does not heat up as fast or as much as factory manifolds/lead pipes. This code will definitely require a custom tune to help change the reading from the computer.
With this said, we would like to re-iterate that not every vehicle is the same. Some may install the full system and never have a code thrown.. We hope this is true for everyone, but I would not count on it 100%. If you're thinking about doing long tubes headers, you are most likely throwing around the idea of a tune as well. If not, you should definitely consider it. The long tubes and tune go hand in hand and will maximize the most power and efficiency out of your vehicle.

SO this as you can tell is a ugly can of worms........... and I do have a email waiting for response from stainless works as to the adjustments to the tune that can be made to be able to re enable the front o2s........ if I have too? And in your case with long tube headers you would have to most likely have your own handheld tuner to enable the rear o2s for testing and pray then disable them again after testing unless you go shorty headers.... And the long tubes might not be able to pass DEQ.. cause they are a MOFO.....

[DroptopZ]

Originally Posted by christianchevell

The deal is the headers flow so well the position of the front o2s even are too far, and I had to drive back so that makes not big deal really as the air fuel tables are already adjusted for the car and it is running like a champ. This is not just a problem with my headers but all headers are capable of doing this and it may be due to the fact my exhaust is so wide open with the dual mode it can be very loud now compared to before the headers when its opened up. You might find no matter where you go if you have brand x that all the o2s have to be disabled. And with brand Y your lucky enough not to have to worry about it, until one day...than you have to either clear the code or disable the front o2s as well. In the day there were no stupid o2 sensors on headers and things were just fine once you adjusted the carburetor /injection and that was it( if you had your metering rods right and the jetting right), except for the engine needing more gas in the cold which now is determined by the intake sensors of the air temp...
in the day it was the driver noticing the stumbling of the car wanting more gas as the idle would be a little off due to the denser air and that's easier to tell with a hot rod and then you just turn out the jet screws a little to the barrels, or adjust the idle a little for the cold weather.
And once again if you do not speak up you have nothing to say when you accept a car and drive off in it, if your lucky the guy is nice and will make everything right, if not well lesson learned but if you do not give him a chance or even have him on here to defend his self well that's trashy. And well people can always go to fast specialties in Vancouver, not to say they are not good, but hey they wanted a lot more for the same work! now what would you call that from a place that does not give your car personal attention as much as the ford or the dodge next to it because they are higher volume and want charge you more and do not specialize in g.m., and take more money and may give you the same grief?.

I am happy as hell with my car and I wish it was quieter now sometimes as people keep staring ......lol I love the cam lope though. And you know what they say about opinions? they are like what? and everyone has one! And I am happy my air fuel ratio is right where it should be in the 12 range on my dyno sheet and I have no heat induced pulling of timing or drop off in the h.p. until at the very end in the 6000 rpm range and my torque does not drop until the 5500 range. And yes you tell there is no data smoothing in my dyno chart , and of course the friend turns out to be your "DAD" .......... so dad couldn't man up and speak up so junior has to now huh? whatever, and BTW white sucks. lol

***Trimmed at OP request***

TL;DR. Dude, drop it. Unless you just HAVE to be right. You win. Go thump your chest some more and roid rage. Sorry you can't have an adult conversation. As stated, the ZR1 is my dad's. Check my albums before you call me out, numb-nuts.

Had a 2010 black, sold it and got a 2013, white, 4zr. Need more pics? Video? As previously stated, pic of my middle finger next to the swirl marks on the aftermarket cf spoiler? LMK...

[christianchevell]

whatever this was about me and my car first...da now I am trying to friggin find out about a front cel code and you have to fuggin copy and paste and sidetrack my post to hell and back. And this other dude got me worried my front o2s being disabled were going to be a problem I had to email Wong and he set me straight....He only just plugged into my car for like one minute when I went back up there so I thought for sure he just disabled them but no....he knows his h.p. ! and frigging did the adjustments I did not even know he had time for in a flash and I never even thought to ask as he had some other race car dude from another shop chatting with him while he worked on a GTO and was going to smoke test the intake in the shop next door........ See he is next to two other shops and they all help each other out! He is a nice guy I should never have doubted him. Wongs rocks.......... here is his email back to me

wow thanks a lot tom you answered my question fast far out I wondered what miracle shit you did with your computer savy h.p. tuning stuff, wow that's great you got me not even knowing you did stuff zI did not think you had time to do in the like minute you logged into my computer man your fast!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! yeahaw I was worrying over nothing, I thought they were disabled. Thanks a bunch, Mark!!!


From: "Thomas Wong" <tjwong@qwestoffice.net>
To: christianchevelle@comcast.net
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 4:29:37 PM
Subject: Re: Disabling the front o2 sensors

The front sensors are enabled. They are working as they should be and the car is running in closed loop as it should be. The only codes
that were disabled were the codes that has to do with the PCM way of seeing sensor response. If the sensor doesn't act like it thinks
it should then it sets the DTC. With the added DTC for model year 13 and up, the sensitivity was cranked way up. With the headers and
where the sensors are located, the sensors will NEVER going to give the PCM the same signal it expected when it was stock. The engine
should run just fine with the way its set up, and it will run in closed loop just as it did before the mods.

Don't read too much into the internet BS, as there are LOTS of it in there.



And that's the word from the man apparently the 13 up Camaros have more Diagnostic Trouble Codes and the sensitivity to the sensor is way up compared to prior years thus the dang sensor could not heat fast enough from the exhaust flowing so well being dual mode and all most likely is what I figure going 75 on the freeway for a extended time at the same speed it cooled and thus the delayed reaction of the front o2 code? I dunno I am just glad he was so damn fast I did not even know he fixed it right the first minute and sazamm I do not have to worry......... Rock on, and maybe his being a electrical engineer for over twenty years may be helping him? the electricians I work with are pretty friggin smart.

[IOM Black Diamond]

I got my car tuned from him and he did a great job. I spent the whole time there asking him things and watching. He really knows his stuff and is a great guy to work with. I would and will take my car back to him. When he tuned my car he went though 1/2 tank of gas just on the dyno. And if he wanted to drive my car he would be more then happy to. I tell everyone to go to him.

[DWCamaro69]

I have heard very good things about Tommy Wong but my stuff only goes here:

http://www.modernclassicsauto.com/

Amazing facility, owner is a big time GM enthusiast with lots of knowledge and experience. From LS powered classics to new ZL1's, you see it all there.

[Jayhawk500]

Originally Posted by DWCamaro69

I have heard very good things about Tommy Wong but my stuff only goes here:

http://www.modernclassicsauto.com/

Amazing facility, owner is a big time GM enthusiast with lots of knowledge and experience. From LS powered classics to new ZL1's, you see it all there.

Very True! Plus his wife is a Camaro Disciple.

[CWI]

Originally Posted by IOM Black Diamond

I got my car tuned from him and he did a great job. I spent the whole time there asking him things and watching. He really knows his stuff and is a great guy to work with. I would and will take my car back to him. When he tuned my car he went though 1/2 tank of gas just on the dyno. And if he wanted to drive my car he would be more then happy to. I tell everyone to go to him.

How far in advance do you need an appointment with Tommy? I am looking at having my car back together with a new cam by second week of April. Can you tell me his fees? And how long he takes?