ALERT: Lutz mentions engine options for Camaro -- 4 cylinder turbo a possibility! - Page 9 - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

Maven · 03-19-2008, 06:11 PM

WOW, this one is going nuts. I think everyone needs to calm down and for a multitude of reasones. Like has been said, they arent making you buy a 4cyl car.....Its not destroying any heritage or tradition because the Camaro has had a four-banger before. It also shouldnt be a real big suprise because that they are gonna offer multiple lower level engines(non-V8s) nor should it be a cause anyone to wanna scream blasphemy since the only years that Chevy sold more V8 than base Camaros was during the IROC frenzy in 85-88.

I like several others are vey happy that they are planning on installing the LNF(2.0 turbo) into the Camaro as the base engine. Its so far superior to the 60deg OHV engines that its not even funny. I wouldve been pissed if they put a 3.5/3.9 in the Camaro.

Now lets get to the power issue. This engine makes 260hp @5300rpm, and 260ftlbs @ 2000rpm. No its not a typo. thats TWO HUNDRED SIXTY pounds of torque at 2,000rpm. So it actually makes MORE torque than the 3.6L LY7(253ftlbs), and it loses the hp race by only 3. More important is HOW the LNF delivers its power. There is 260ftlbs of torque available from 2,000rpm ALL THE WAY to the horsepower peak of 5300rpm. Max torque from 2,000-5,300.
The 3.6L cant claim that.

As for lacking power in general....Well the LNF Sky's and Solsti' are putting down 240's to the GROUND. Thats only about 10hp less than a stock LT1.

The ECO's also have a great aftermarket whereas the 3.6L's.....well, dont.

The ECO also responds well to mods, and has extremely high potential, you can get over 300hp at the crank from just a handheld tuner!!!!

The ECOTEC engine itself is good to about 550hp with a simple rod/piston upgrade.

Solstice guys are getting 20+hp from intercooler upgrades.

I see the inclusion of the ECOTEC brand in the new Camaro as a great thing, now instead of only having one engine worth upgrading(the V8) and therefore having a hefty initial purchase price if your looking to be able easily modify your car, we now have two. This I feel is going to make the Camaro appealing to MANY more people, especially if GM campaigns a base Camaro in the Drift series, or offers "tuner" type cars with limited options, designed to be blank slates for the customizing companies out there or setup like the "Club Sport" Solstices for SCCA racing, I can see the LNF F's becoming very popular, and doing well in a class like G-stock Solo by destroying V6 Mustangs and 4Th gen F's

Since having our 3rd car cost 30k is out of the question, I can see myself driving a Camaro that goes PSSHHHHHHT. and being perfectly happy about it.

flaguy · 03-19-2008, 06:12 PM

Last week I was under the impression that the Camaro will be priced with the Mustang, that the V6 will have 300hp, that a turbo was going into the cobalt. Today I find the Camaro will cost more, excuse me, will be at a premium compared to the Mustang, the V6 just lost 40hp, and the turbo has entered the Camaro.

What next? Dare I say it???????????????

PREPO HEADLIGHTS ARE STAYING???????????

After reading this thread, I'm sure GM could **** this up some more....they're on a good start.

Warghost · 03-19-2008, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

He didn't completely drop it. He said it will be more, and that's nothing new. If you're thinking thousands more...your insane (and if that's the truth...well, so's GM.) But ~$1000 more for an EXTREMELY superior car. That's not unreasonable to me.

I agree. I don't think a Camaro will be $5,000 more than a comparably priced Mustang. That would be suicide and GM knows it. However, considering the full independent suspension, better interior quality and components, upgraded wheel packages (20"+), etc., I think Lutz was just preparing the public for the bottom line: nice options cost more money. I don't think this is anything we should be concerned with, and I don't think it's anything most people weren't prepared to hear anyway. And these options aren't even available with the Mustang or Challenger anyway!

Getting back to the 4-cylinder turbo motor....I can definitely understand how some people find this engine to be "un-American". It's got small displacement and a power adding system usually only found in European and Japanese vehicles. American muscle has usually been the opposite: large naturally aspirated displacement. I would prefer GM not release a 4-cyl turbo, because it's automatically associated with the ricer crowd, but if it's necessary to keep the Camaro alive, then so be it. I wouldn't want to own one, but it wouldn't be any worse than a 210HP V6, right? That's what the Mustang is offering in their base model.

Just keep the faith, guys. Like I said earlier, I am happy to hear the Camaro will not be a "cheap" car anymore, that can only help its reputation and status...and I'm pretty sure that it will still be priced about the same as a COMPARABLE Mustang. But just remember, there will be no Mustang or Challenger that is comparable to this car!

linkwpc · 03-19-2008, 06:14 PM

The only thing I have to say is that I'm NOT buying 4 or 6 for my new car!

4 cyl just sucks!

Sweeper · 03-19-2008, 06:15 PM

Camaro's Korean cousin

Set for public debut at the New York Auto show in two days, press photos of the yet to be revealed Hyundai Genesis Coupe have leaked. Sent to us as a tip (thanks Evan), the photos were found over at MyRide.com who added these pictures to an old article from the Genesis Coupe Concept debut in Los Angeles last year.

If the new Genesis sedan is an indicator of things to come, the Genesis Coupe, as the Tiburon replacement, will be a far superior car with greater quality, performance and driving dynamics. With a rear wheel drive platform and the entry level engine as a 2.0 liter turbo producing 215hp, the Genesis Coupe is off to a great start. But Hyundai is out for blood and takes it a bit further with a 3.8 liter V6 making approximately 310hp. As a result, the Genesis Coupe is going to get a lot of attention in New York and it's no surprise why.

Awww. Look. It's next to a Mustang. I wonder what it will look like next to the Camaro???

Jose_The_Great_Cuervo · 03-19-2008, 06:26 PM

"3.8 liter V6 making approximately 310hp"

Wow, if a this and a Caddy w/ a V6 can produce that much hp then I don't see why the Camaro can't ATLEAST match it...

Sweeper · 03-19-2008, 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maven

Since having our 3rd car cost 30k is out of the question, I can see myself driving a Camaro that goes PSSHHHHHHT. and being perfectly happy about it.

I second that remark. If the base model is priced low enough. It would be the a steal!!! I would love to have a low priced RWD sports car with the great looks of a Camaro.

What do you think about.....
$24k 4 cylinder turbo_____260hp
$32k DI V6_____________306hp
$40k V8________________400hp
$50k Supercharged V8____500hp

stevenm357 · 03-19-2008, 06:29 PM

awesome news... since i may have to wait an extra year or two... i'll hope they come out with a real GT500 destroyer shortly after

z28camaro2471 · 03-19-2008, 06:29 PM

I'm all for selling more Camaros. I understand economics, business, etc. If the I4 got 45 mpg, the v6 got 28 mph and the v8 got let's say 18mpg, I could completely understand the business case. Additionally, if the I4 Camaro was $18,000, the v6 Camaro was $23,000 and the base v8 was $28,000, again I could understand the business case.

There are problems with both of the above, the fuel economy on the I4 (as noted in 1 or maybe 2 previous posts) is not that much better than the v6. I'm guessing on the second one because we have no knowledge on price, but I don't see the I4 undercutting the v6 that much by price.

And that's why I want to hurl when they mention putting a 4 cylinder in the new Camaro. Yes, I do remember the Iron Dukes. And yes I know the turbo 4 only makes 15 hp less than my LT1 so I know it's a hot little motor. I like that motor in the Cobalt, HHR, Solstice etc. It just doesn't work for me in a Camaro. Just my opinion.

Maven · 03-19-2008, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweeper

I second that remark. If the base model is priced low enough. It would be the a steal!!! I would love to have a low priced RWD sports car with the great looks of a Camaro.

What do you think about.....
$24k 4 cylinder turbo_____260hp
$32k DI V6_____________306hp
$40k V8________________400hp
$50k Supercharged V8____500hp

I prefer.....
$24k 4 cylinder turbo____260hp > FE1 suspension, 5spd Auto or Manual
$28k DI V6_____________306hp > FE1 suspension, FE3 optional, 6spd auto or manual
$31k V8_______________430hp > FE3 suspension, 6spd auto or manual, better brakes
$42k Supercharged V8____550hp >FE5 Suspension, 6spd manual, Brembo(iron or carbon) brakes

CHVY4LF · 03-19-2008, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Black5thgen

You guys are rediculous. Has everyone forgot about the 4 cylinder camaro's of the 80's. It didn't disgrace the car's rep then, why will it now. In the 80's we were getting over the gas crunch and the ecomony sucked (just like today) and the I4 only lasted a few years. I think a 4 is a great idea. It will help with the fleet mpg's and lower the price for non-enthusiasts. WE ARE STILL GETTING THE V8, whats the big deal. Yeah, maybe ricers will buy the I-4 turbo, but that means more sales insuring the future of the camaro. The more people this car appeals to the better. The camaro has to adapt and evolve to survive. Let's not forget that the car went on hiautus because it didn't evolve. All of you that are upset that the camaro can be offered with a 4 are obsured. Go buy a turbo cobalt and get jelous when I blow past in my V8 fifth gen.

Completely agree, not only that but the I4 will get alot more people to buy camaro and that way GM won't cut production again.

The_Stache · 03-19-2008, 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweeper

I second that remark. If the base model is priced low enough. It would be the a steal!!! I would love to have a low priced RWD sports car with the great looks of a Camaro.

What do you think about.....
$24k 4 cylinder turbo_____260hp
$32k DI V6_____________306hp
$40k V8________________400hp
$50k Supercharged V8____500hp

Try this on .. its more likely the closer to the real thing..

$19k 4 cylinder turbo_____260hp
$24k DI V6_____________306hp
$32k V8________________400hp
$40k Supercharged V8____500hp

z28camaro2471 · 03-19-2008, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by diarmadhi

Try this on .. its more likely the closer to the real thing..

$19k 4 cylinder turbo_____260hp
$24k DI V6_____________306hp
$32k V8________________400hp
$40k Supercharged V8____500hp

That would make sense. And then I wouldn't complain about a 4 cylinder.

09fathomgreen · 03-19-2008, 06:39 PM

Just my two cents--to me, it doesn't matter if the engine is a four-cylinder or a V8. It's still a Camaro, and I plan on buying what I can afford regardless. I've never owned a Camaro, and I will buy a fifth gen. (Always wanted one, just never had the chance.)
To me, that's what matters--that GM is trying to return a classic car to production, which will hopefully be a quality product that will be in production for years to come.

03-19-2008, 06:11 PM	#113
Maven Bowtie Technician Drives: 1969 Corvette Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: NJ, USA Posts: 38	WOW, this one is going nuts. I think everyone needs to calm down and for a multitude of reasones. Like has been said, they arent making you buy a 4cyl car.....Its not destroying any heritage or tradition because the Camaro has had a four-banger before. It also shouldnt be a real big suprise because that they are gonna offer multiple lower level engines(non-V8s) nor should it be a cause anyone to wanna scream blasphemy since the only years that Chevy sold more V8 than base Camaros was during the IROC frenzy in 85-88. I like several others are vey happy that they are planning on installing the LNF(2.0 turbo) into the Camaro as the base engine. Its so far superior to the 60deg OHV engines that its not even funny. I wouldve been pissed if they put a 3.5/3.9 in the Camaro. Now lets get to the power issue. This engine makes 260hp @5300rpm, and 260ftlbs @ 2000rpm. No its not a typo. thats TWO HUNDRED SIXTY pounds of torque at 2,000rpm. So it actually makes MORE torque than the 3.6L LY7(253ftlbs), and it loses the hp race by only 3. More important is HOW the LNF delivers its power. There is 260ftlbs of torque available from 2,000rpm ALL THE WAY to the horsepower peak of 5300rpm. Max torque from 2,000-5,300. The 3.6L cant claim that. As for lacking power in general....Well the LNF Sky's and Solsti' are putting down 240's to the GROUND. Thats only about 10hp less than a stock LT1. The ECO's also have a great aftermarket whereas the 3.6L's.....well, dont. The ECO also responds well to mods, and has extremely high potential, you can get over 300hp at the crank from just a handheld tuner!!!! The ECOTEC engine itself is good to about 550hp with a simple rod/piston upgrade. Solstice guys are getting 20+hp from intercooler upgrades. I see the inclusion of the ECOTEC brand in the new Camaro as a great thing, now instead of only having one engine worth upgrading(the V8) and therefore having a hefty initial purchase price if your looking to be able easily modify your car, we now have two. This I feel is going to make the Camaro appealing to MANY more people, especially if GM campaigns a base Camaro in the Drift series, or offers "tuner" type cars with limited options, designed to be blank slates for the customizing companies out there or setup like the "Club Sport" Solstices for SCCA racing, I can see the LNF F's becoming very popular, and doing well in a class like G-stock Solo by destroying V6 Mustangs and 4Th gen F's Since having our 3rd car cost 30k is out of the question, I can see myself driving a Camaro that goes *PSSHHHHHHT.* and being perfectly happy about it. __________________ ASE Master Auto Technician & Advanced Engine Performance Specialist GM Mark Of Excellence Platinum Award winner Oft consequences unintended, result from plans ill comprehended.

03-19-2008, 06:15 PM	#117
Sweeper Drives: 2008 Suburban Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 40	Camaro's Korean cousin Camaro's Korean cousin Set for public debut at the New York Auto show in two days, press photos of the yet to be revealed Hyundai Genesis Coupe have leaked. Sent to us as a tip (thanks Evan), the photos were found over at MyRide.com who added these pictures to an old article from the Genesis Coupe Concept debut in Los Angeles last year. If the new Genesis sedan is an indicator of things to come, the Genesis Coupe, as the Tiburon replacement, will be a far superior car with greater quality, performance and driving dynamics. With a rear wheel drive platform and the entry level engine as a 2.0 liter turbo producing 215hp, the Genesis Coupe is off to a great start. But Hyundai is out for blood and takes it a bit further with a 3.8 liter V6 making approximately 310hp. As a result, the Genesis Coupe is going to get a lot of attention in New York and it's no surprise why. Awww. Look. It's next to a Mustang. I wonder what it will look like next to the Camaro???

03-19-2008, 06:29 PM	#120
stevenm357 Drives: 98 Trans am 00 Trans am 01 corvette Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: West Virginia Posts: 381	awesome news... since i may have to wait an extra year or two... i'll hope they come out with a real GT500 destroyer shortly after __________________ 2001 Corvette Heads,Big cam, 4:11, Custom Exhaust, MGW Shifter Baer Eradispeed +2 2 pieces rotors, Hotchkiss swaybars. and a few other little things. 1998 Trans Am A4 ( was STS turbo until the turbo and oil pump died) 2000 WS6 Trans AM under the knife ( sadly turned into long term project.

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03-19-2008, 06:12 PM	#114
flaguy Drives: 2014 2SS RS Spring Edition Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Ga Posts: 230	Last week I was under the impression that the Camaro will be priced with the Mustang, that the V6 will have 300hp, that a turbo was going into the cobalt. Today I find the Camaro will cost more, excuse me, will be at a premium compared to the Mustang, the V6 just lost 40hp, and the turbo has entered the Camaro. What next? Dare I say it??????????????? PREPO HEADLIGHTS ARE STAYING??????????? After reading this thread, I'm sure GM could **** this up some more....they're on a good start.

03-19-2008, 06:14 PM	#116
linkwpc The punching cat Drives: '10 Camaro SS Black W/Hugger&W/IOI Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Torrance, CA Posts: 4,048 View My Garage	The only thing I have to say is that I'm NOT buying 4 or 6 for my new car! 4 cyl just sucks!

03-19-2008, 06:26 PM	#118
Jose_The_Great_Cuervo Drives: Purple/Pink Ford Escort Lx Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Georgia Posts: 65	"3.8 liter V6 making approximately 310hp" Wow, if a this and a Caddy w/ a V6 can produce that much hp then I don't see why the Camaro can't ATLEAST match it...

03-19-2008, 06:29 PM	#121
z28camaro2471 C5 Member #227 Drives: Camaros Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: NY Posts: 808	I'm all for selling more Camaros. I understand economics, business, etc. If the I4 got 45 mpg, the v6 got 28 mph and the v8 got let's say 18mpg, I could completely understand the business case. Additionally, if the I4 Camaro was $18,000, the v6 Camaro was $23,000 and the base v8 was $28,000, again I could understand the business case. There are problems with both of the above, the fuel economy on the I4 (as noted in 1 or maybe 2 previous posts) is not that much better than the v6. I'm guessing on the second one because we have no knowledge on price, but I don't see the I4 undercutting the v6 that much by price. And that's why I want to hurl when they mention putting a 4 cylinder in the new Camaro. Yes, I do remember the Iron Dukes. And yes I know the turbo 4 only makes 15 hp less than my LT1 so I know it's a hot little motor. I like that motor in the Cobalt, HHR, Solstice etc. It just doesn't work for me in a Camaro. Just my opinion.

03-19-2008, 06:39 PM	#126
09fathomgreen Drives: 1997 Ford Join Date: May 2007 Location: Midwest Posts: 52	Just my two cents--to me, it doesn't matter if the engine is a four-cylinder or a V8. It's still a Camaro, and I plan on buying what I can afford regardless. I've never owned a Camaro, and I will buy a fifth gen. (Always wanted one, just never had the chance.) To me, that's what matters--that GM is trying to return a classic car to production, which will hopefully be a quality product that will be in production for years to come.