IPF vs Trifecta Full Review

[rtcat600man]

I get what you guys are saying. I agrree with you that if Trifecta is not returning communication then this is bad business. I sent an email myself recently asking for some more thoughts on thsi subject, to date still no reply.

If I was new coming to the forum looking for a tune, I would certainly be looking at IPF based on much of waht I read.

Thanks for the replies and understanding to keep it cival.

[MagnumForceGB]

Trifecta mostly just looks at the fuel trims and if they are within a few % of 0, they call it good. No built-in wideband hurts these cars, so unless you do a full dyno tune the best a mail-order tune can do is guess. With my IPF tune I had a wideband gauge and told Arno what my AFR was at every 500 RPM's.

I also have a BAMA tune on the Mustang, but the Mustang has a built-in wideband so when you do a datalog they can see everything and adjust it perfectly. Only thing they don't do is remove torque management.

['11CamaroLS]

I've sent an email to trifecta when I got dyno'd and showed them my air fuel was extremely lean the entire pull. And trifecta claimed all is OK and basically said the wideband must be faulty, even tho I told him my friend did pulls right after me and his air fuel was perfect. That right there is proof its not a faulty wideband and proof trifecta just must not care. I hate to spend money on another tune buts its inevitable, just matter of ipf or HP tuners

[etmx183]

I use the HP Tuners Pro Suite and it has provision for me to datalog my A/F also. I also HAD Trifecta at one time and ran into the same lean issues and was told everything was good. Since Matt from FSP took over my tuning REMOTELY I have been quicker and faster than ever. When I did another dyno pull on the same dyno as my Trifecta tune my A/F was almost a perfect flat line. Needless to say my HP/TQ were also up. So if the IPF looks to work good for you go with them. I would think twice about Trifecta, just my opinion and my experience with them.

[RickRay]

Originally Posted by rtcat600man

I get what you guys are saying. I agrree with you that if Trifecta is not returning communication then this is bad business. I sent an email myself recently asking for some more thoughts on thsi subject, to date still no reply.

If I was new coming to the forum looking for a tune, I would certainly be looking at IPF based on much of waht I read.

Thanks for the replies and understanding to keep it cival.

Ecspecially when they don`t comment anymore as much as before...Vince hasn`t posted since last March & BNR since middle of Dec 13....We need more tuners so that they can compete with each other...

[jkchambless]

Finally received responses from badnewsracing and trifecta concerning ECU locking:

First, from Trifacta:

Hello Kent,

Our tune does not lock the ECM per se. If it did, the dealership wouldn't be able to flash it.

If the tuning solution you are using can't read the ECM with our tune on it, then you should at least be able to do a 'full write' to flash it with a stock calibration.
- Steven Weller
Weller OBD Tuning, Inc.

On 1/22/2014 7:33 PM, Kent Chambless wrote:
Several users on Camaro5.com who have decided to load another vendor tune (on their 2010+ Camaro LLT’s) are reporting that the Trifecta tune locks the ECU and TCU and that is was necessary to have a dealer re-flash/re-load in order to unlock the system. Are these reports true and if so, how can I tell if mine is locked or unlocked?
Thanks,
Kent

From Badnewsracing:

Subject: trifecta tune - lock ecu?

It's not ever locked, it's just a different operating system so the other tuning softwares don't recognize it. It's not a problem with trifecta or any other competitor it's just what it is. Efilive, hptuners, diablosport for example all also offer custom operating systems for certain features or to get around the limitations of the stock calibrations. For example if you tuned a car with a custom efilive calibration from redline performance, you would not be able to tune over top of it or read the ECM code using hptuners or diablo or the like. But if you flashed back to stock using said software, the other software would be able to tune the ECM since the stock gm operating system was back on it.

Sincerely,
Bad News Racing

[KMPrenger]

Originally Posted by Mvp_Me

I wouldn't rush, Hpt will be available later in the year. if you want a really good tune, HpTuners is the way to go.

Actually, I'd say if you can get on a dyno and get a real dyno tune with just about any tuner that is what I'd consider a "really good tune". Otherwise it is all just educated guessing, based on the testing the company has done to develop their tunes, and on where you live, your mods, and their experience with the ECM/access to tables..

I feel IPFs "mailed" solution is likely a better solution than Trifecta's, but again it is just a mailed solution. They do the best they can without actually getting your car on a dyno and seeing the realtime data and Air to fuel ratio.

The advantage that HPTuners will have, is that customers will have MUCH better access to get a real dyno tune done compared to IPF or Trifecta since most dyno shops do not use their software in house. But I feel that if I were to take my car to Arizona for a real dyno tune with IPF, versus some shop for a real dyno tune with HPTuner, the results wouldn't be hugely different.

Originally Posted by MagnumForceGB

Trifecta mostly just looks at the fuel trims and if they are within a few % of 0, they call it good. No built-in wideband hurts these cars, so unless you do a full dyno tune the best a mail-order tune can do is guess. With my IPF tune I had a wideband gauge and told Arno what my AFR was at every 500 RPM's.

I also have a BAMA tune on the Mustang, but the Mustang has a built-in wideband so when you do a datalog they can see everything and adjust it perfectly. Only thing they don't do is remove torque management.

I agree, and its kind of on the same page as what I said above with the AFR and what not. If the Camaro had a stock wideband, tuning would be a different story.

Originally Posted by jkchambless

Finally received responses from badnewsracing and trifecta concerning ECU locking:

First, from Trifacta:

Hello Kent,

Our tune does not lock the ECM per se. If it did, the dealership wouldn't be able to flash it.

If the tuning solution you are using can't read the ECM with our tune on it, then you should at least be able to do a 'full write' to flash it with a stock calibration.
- Steven Weller
Weller OBD Tuning, Inc.

On 1/22/2014 7:33 PM, Kent Chambless wrote:
Several users on Camaro5.com who have decided to load another vendor tune (on their 2010+ Camaro LLT’s) are reporting that the Trifecta tune locks the ECU and TCU and that is was necessary to have a dealer re-flash/re-load in order to unlock the system. Are these reports true and if so, how can I tell if mine is locked or unlocked?
Thanks,
Kent

From Badnewsracing:

Subject: trifecta tune - lock ecu?

It's not ever locked, it's just a different operating system so the other tuning softwares don't recognize it. It's not a problem with trifecta or any other competitor it's just what it is. Efilive, hptuners, diablosport for example all also offer custom operating systems for certain features or to get around the limitations of the stock calibrations. For example if you tuned a car with a custom efilive calibration from redline performance, you would not be able to tune over top of it or read the ECM code using hptuners or diablo or the like. But if you flashed back to stock using said software, the other software would be able to tune the ECM since the stock gm operating system was back on it.

Sincerely,
Bad News Racing

Well, before I sold my Trifecta unit, I flashed the ECM back to stock, but the program failed when trying to flash the TCM back to stock. So I hope that means I can still at least do an ECM flash with IPF or HPTuner if I go that route without having to speed 100 bucks on a dealer MDI flash.

[KMPrenger]

peregrine...is this your car?

IPF posted this on there facebook page of a customer in lebannon saying with a cat delete, tune, and K&N intake they gained 45HP and over 40torque. Pretty nice if you ask me.

[rtcat600man]

45 HP gain is good.

Probably went something like this.

Cat delete is worth approx. 12 -15 hp.

K&N can be worth approx. 12 -15 hp.

That leaves the tune worth approx. 15 - 20 hp.

It would be nice to see gains of this tune without the others added.

[Mvp_Me]

since when does a intake give you 12-15hp? not trying to start anything but 45hp just from these mods.....mmmmm i beg to differ.
do the high flow cats or cat delete really give you that much hp also? thats something ive never experienced yet.

[Mvp_Me]

Originally Posted by KMPrenger

Actually, I'd say if you can get on a dyno and get a real dyno tune with just about any tuner that is what I'd consider a "really good tune". Otherwise it is all just educated guessing, based on the testing the company has done to develop their tunes, and on where you live, your mods, and their experience with the ECM/access to tables..

I feel IPFs "mailed" solution is likely a better solution than Trifecta's, but again it is just a mailed solution. They do the best they can without actually getting your car on a dyno and seeing the realtime data and Air to fuel ratio.

The advantage that HPTuners will have, is that customers will have MUCH better access to get a real dyno tune done compared to IPF or Trifecta since most dyno shops do not use their software in house. But I feel that if I were to take my car to Arizona for a real dyno tune with IPF, versus some shop for a real dyno tune with HPTuner, the results wouldn't be hugely different.



I agree, and its kind of on the same page as what I said above with the AFR and what not. If the Camaro had a stock wideband, tuning would be a different story.



Well, before I sold my Trifecta unit, I flashed the ECM back to stock, but the program failed when trying to flash the TCM back to stock. So I hope that means I can still at least do an ECM flash with IPF or HPTuner if I go that route without having to speed 100 bucks on a dealer MDI flash.

from what i am getting from all the hype of this release of HPT is that all the tables will be unlocked. with that you could go deeper in the ECU and refine the tune even more while IPF and Trifecta are limited after a certain point. this is just what im thinking, i could be very well wrong but thats what i comprehend from reading about it so far.
I do understand what you are also saying though...

[rtcat600man]

Originally Posted by Mvp_Me

since when does a intake give you 12-15hp? not trying to start anything but 45hp just from these mods.....mmmmm i beg to differ.
do the high flow cats or cat delete really give you that much hp also? thats something ive never experienced yet.

Too Late.............joking of course...........


There was a test almost 4 years ago of some of the Intake systems at the time, see the chart below. I was being kind to the K&N and giving it a little more credit than it deserves.

The CAT delete is truly worth some HP. Why do you think High Flow Cats work so well. Eliminate the back pressure issue. Is it worth 12 - 15. Maybe, maybe not. Nobody has proven thru a dyno test that I am aware of yet.

But I for one am NOT believing all that HP came from the tune either.

When someone proves me wrong, on a DYNO here in the United States, preferably a (Dyno Jet), before and after on the same day. And include some track passes, I will MAYBE think to believe those numbers.

[RubyCamaro]

They need to do a test for the CAI with the Apex water bottle relocation & scoop added.

[peregrine_alpha]

Originally Posted by KMPrenger

peregrine...is this your car?

IPF posted this on there facebook page of a customer in lebannon saying with a cat delete, tune, and K&N intake they gained 45HP and over 40torque. Pretty nice if you ask me.

Nope its not mine, and 45HP just cat delete and tune is a bit exaggerated in my opinion.

I got around 50HP with these:
K&N
Throttle Body
Vmax Ice-olator
ARH Headers with cat delete
Borla Catback
IPF tune.

if all of these got me 50HP, i really doubt just cat delete gives 45HP