Motor Trend Head to Head: 2015 Camaro 1LE vs. new 2015 Mustang 5.0 GT PP

[Angrybird 12]

Originally Posted by Melkor

1. 1st gear and syncros had to be replaced.

2. Started slipping out of gear during acceleration. Transmission had to be replaced.

3. Sometimes EXTREMELY hard to shift into 2nd. I have to double clutch at times.

4. Replaced clutch. Still doesn't shift well into 2nd and now there's a really bad shudder through the whole car during low end acceleration (1st and reverse)

5. Once the car is warm, there is a very loud and weird grinding noise during low end acceleration. This is accompanied with a noticeable loss in torque/power. When the car is cold, no problem at all. It should be noted that this was the very first thing I took the car in for after about 100 miles of driving. They still don't know what it is so they're attitude is "it must be normal".

6. Electrical problem with the windows that has been "fixed" but is still there. If I roll both down at the same time, the driver's side stops and goes back up. Sometimes the driver's side doesn't respond at all.

7. MyLink is terrible and doesn't work with any iPhone I try to use it with. The worst part is that it doesn't work SOME of the time. I'll get all comfortable and think whatever they've done has finally fixed it but, no... it still unpairs from bluetooth, doesn't like to play music, and has... other issues. Like, I can't make a call if the radio's off? I thought this was an error at first but then realized, nope... that's how Chevy designed it. Some of this is that I just don't like MyLink. I think it's a horrible system and am disappointed that so many cars are going to systems like these.

8. I take 50% of the blame here because my research didn't tell me this before I got the car. I didn't know about the low temperature problems with the Eagle F1s. I feel stupid about that. But, I also put some of that on the salesman who told me AFTER I signed the paperwork... in March... in Montana. Between March and June there were several days I couldn't drive to work. Also the tires were delivered cracked and, luckily, I got them covered under warranty. But that was frustrating as hell. Again, 50% (at least) of that was my fault but I'd never had to research tires for that and didn't know that was a possibility.

There have been other little things here and there (tail lights going out a week after purchase, etc...) but I feel like I really just won the lottery in car problems. GM refunded me a month of car payment which... was nice, but I really just want out of this thing. Every time I think one thing is fixed, another pops up, OR the same thing starts happening again.

Maybe you should check into the lemon law in your state. With all those issues you may be eligible for a buyback. It just sounds like yours is an exception rather than the rule.

[Firefighter]

Originally Posted by Melkor

1. 1st gear and syncros had to be replaced.

2. Started slipping out of gear during acceleration. Transmission had to be replaced.

3. Sometimes EXTREMELY hard to shift into 2nd. I have to double clutch at times.

4. Replaced clutch. Still doesn't shift well into 2nd and now there's a really bad shudder through the whole car during low end acceleration (1st and reverse)

5. Once the car is warm, there is a very loud and weird grinding noise during low end acceleration. This is accompanied with a noticeable loss in torque/power. When the car is cold, no problem at all. It should be noted that this was the very first thing I took the car in for after about 100 miles of driving. They still don't know what it is so they're attitude is "it must be normal".

6. Electrical problem with the windows that has been "fixed" but is still there. If I roll both down at the same time, the driver's side stops and goes back up. Sometimes the driver's side doesn't respond at all.

7. MyLink is terrible and doesn't work with any iPhone I try to use it with. The worst part is that it doesn't work SOME of the time. I'll get all comfortable and think whatever they've done has finally fixed it but, no... it still unpairs from bluetooth, doesn't like to play music, and has... other issues. Like, I can't make a call if the radio's off? I thought this was an error at first but then realized, nope... that's how Chevy designed it. Some of this is that I just don't like MyLink. I think it's a horrible system and am disappointed that so many cars are going to systems like these.

8. I take 50% of the blame here because my research didn't tell me this before I got the car. I didn't know about the low temperature problems with the Eagle F1s. I feel stupid about that. But, I also put some of that on the salesman who told me AFTER I signed the paperwork... in March... in Montana. Between March and June there were several days I couldn't drive to work. Also the tires were delivered cracked and, luckily, I got them covered under warranty. But that was frustrating as hell. Again, 50% (at least) of that was my fault but I'd never had to research tires for that and didn't know that was a possibility.

There have been other little things here and there (tail lights going out a week after purchase, etc...) but I feel like I really just won the lottery in car problems. GM refunded me a month of car payment which... was nice, but I really just want out of this thing. Every time I think one thing is fixed, another pops up, OR the same thing starts happening again.

Holy Shizz Man... that's a lemon. I have zero of the problems you've had. The Mylink is just a getting used to thing aside from the iPhone issues (to that I say Droid for life) the tire thing IS an inconvenience but it's a package deal for a quasi track car.

Sorry you got the "bad one" I've been buying GM for thirty years and they've all been bullet proof.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

[Melkor]

Originally Posted by Angrybird 12

Maybe you should check into the lemon law in your state. With all those issues you may be eligible for a buyback. It just sounds like yours is an exception rather than the rule.

I'm constantly thinking about it, but there are a couple reasons I haven't yet.

1) I don't really have the money to sink into a lawyer... I mean. I have it but I'm not sure that's where I want the money to go. But every day I get closer.

2) According to the Lemon Law, I may have an uphill battle at best as the car is not "undrivable" nor does it have anything that would "reduce it's value or safety" on the surface. It's just seriously annoying and not something I would ever take near a track because I don't trust it.

3) I'm tired. Seriously, all I've been doing with this thing since March is taking it to the god damn dealer for problems. No track time. Hell, not even much just fun time. Mostly it just sits parked now and I drive my CRV around.

4) Chevy WERE willing to try and get me into another GM car but there were two problems there. a) The only two cars I'm interested in from GM are upper limit Camaros and the new Stingray. The Stingray is out of my price range as are most of the Camaros. The reason I was able to get this one was because it was a 1SS, which is really rare, apparently. b) The dealerships would only get me into another car that was on their lot or a lot near them, of which every 1le was a 2SS, which was out of my price range. I didn't want a standard SS because, frankly, I don't like them. I liked the 1le. But there was no way to make a deal work.

5) Sigh... I feel like such an asshole complaining about all of this :(

[Firefighter]

Listen man while I've never had a issue like that if I had spent all the money and it was that "One bad car" I would be a wreck too. Knock on wood I've been lucky but it happens every now and again to even manufacturer of all things.

It just sucks it had to happen at all. I don't have any good advice but I feel for you.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

[Angrybird 12]

Originally Posted by Melkor

I'm constantly thinking about it, but there are a couple reasons I haven't yet.

1) I don't really have the money to sink into a lawyer... I mean. I have it but I'm not sure that's where I want the money to go. But every day I get closer.

2) According to the Lemon Law, I may have an uphill battle at best as the car is not "undrivable" nor does it have anything that would "reduce it's value or safety" on the surface. It's just seriously annoying and not something I would ever take near a track because I don't trust it.

3) I'm tired. Seriously, all I've been doing with this thing since March is taking it to the god damn dealer for problems. No track time. Hell, not even much just fun time. Mostly it just sits parked now and I drive my CRV around.

4) Chevy WERE willing to try and get me into another GM car but there were two problems there. a) The only two cars I'm interested in from GM are upper limit Camaros and the new Stingray. The Stingray is out of my price range as are most of the Camaros. The reason I was able to get this one was because it was a 1SS, which is really rare, apparently. b) The dealerships would only get me into another car that was on their lot or a lot near them, of which every 1le was a 2SS, which was out of my price range. I didn't want a standard SS because, frankly, I don't like them. I liked the 1le. But there was no way to make a deal work.

5) Sigh... I feel like such an asshole complaining about all of this :(

I know many states the car only has to have a certain number of problems within a specified amount of time to qualify for the Lemon Law. Also if you go the proper route a lawyer is not required, the state appoints a independant third party to arbitrate and decide the case. How far have you taken this beyond the dealer?

[Camaro Dude]

You need to escalate this past the dealer, end of story.

Yes, this may sadly take some legwork, most likely, hours and productive time lost on the telephone.

[Melkor]

Jeez, thanks guys :-) (Seriously. No sarcasm.) I'm going to make some calls on Monday.

[mikec1le]

Originally Posted by Melkor

5) Sigh... I feel like such an asshole complaining about all of this :(

Don't feel bad about complaining about this. You have legitimate complaints here.

[Melkor]

Originally Posted by mikec1le

Don't feel bad about complaining about this. You have legitimate complaints here.

Thanks. Sometimes it's nice to have some support.

[Todd in Vancouver]

Originally Posted by Melkor

Thanks. Sometimes it's nice to have some support.

In my past life before the job I have now I was that manufacture corporate guy (different car company) that investigated these type of situations for the manufacturer. Here are a couple things I would recommend you do/know;

1- always be polite, it may feel better to vent but you need them on your side
2- don't make threats
3- don't knock the car or company, you just happened on a bad one
4- do not blame the dealer, in fact tell them they've done all they can to help you but the car is just above them to figure out
5- keep a log of when it acts up, deal in facts
6- **most important. Tel them you want anothe GM product and not something else
I can tell you from experience once a person goes sideways and says they're never going to own another said brand then there is nothing to be done, at that point anything the manufacturer does is just wasted money. What they want is happy customers because if they know that they can help you and sell you more cars in the future, their help will profit in the future. Just let them know you need help and want to keep in another GM product but you've lost faith in this car and your scared of it.

Also, maybe time to look at other packages because what makes the 1LE such an awesome car is not what you are looking for. Maybe a nice SS RS or a different GM product. Work with them and once they feel for you and see you need help they will do what they can to help you out. It was always so much easier to help a customer when they were being reasonable, (you're not getting a free corvette) and the customer service agent would call me and say " we need to help this customer, they're so nice to deal with".

Feel free to PM me if you want additional insight or I can help.

[Spoolin]

Originally Posted by Melkor

Jeez, thanks guys :-) (Seriously. No sarcasm.) I'm going to make some calls on Monday.

Best of luck man! I think your doing the right thing, we pay too much money not to have a product we can sit in and feel proud to own.

[Melkor]

Originally Posted by Todd in Vancouver

In my past life before the job I have now I was that manufacture corporate guy (different car company) that investigated these type of situations for the manufacturer. Here are a couple things I would recommend you do/know;

1- always be polite, it may feel better to vent but you need them on your side
2- don't make threats
3- don't knock the car or company, you just happened on a bad one
4- do not blame the dealer, in fact tell them they've done all they can to help you but the car is just above them to figure out
5- keep a log of when it acts up, deal in facts
6- **most important. Tel them you want anothe GM product and not something else
I can tell you from experience once a person goes sideways and says they're never going to own another said brand then there is nothing to be done, at that point anything the manufacturer does is just wasted money. What they want is happy customers because if they know that they can help you and sell you more cars in the future, their help will profit in the future. Just let them know you need help and want to keep in another GM product but you've lost faith in this car and your scared of it.

Also, maybe time to look at other packages because what makes the 1LE such an awesome car is not what you are looking for. Maybe a nice SS RS or a different GM product. Work with them and once they feel for you and see you need help they will do what they can to help you out. It was always so much easier to help a customer when they were being reasonable, (you're not getting a free corvette) and the customer service agent would call me and say " we need to help this customer, they're so nice to deal with".

Feel free to PM me if you want additional insight or I can help.

I've been perfectly nice to everyone (except one person at the service department... I got snippy). But I've had very long and pleasant conversations with the managers at two different dealers as well as someone from Chevy who oversaw the one month's payment refund.

Never threatened anyone (even when I was being threatened). I'm sure I have come across as exhausted, but never rude. Always pleasant and always thankful to them for taking the time to listen.

There was a moment not that long ago when I though, "Maybe I'll try being a complete jerk and see how that goes." But I didn't.

[stand-al0ne]

New Mustang is sick. Mods will make it really potent. Not to mention this new platform just came out. It will only get better over time.

That said, Camaro 1LE is sick as well and is a great value. Hard for me to say which one I'd part ways with my money for one. I'm being conservative and keeping my v6 bc its paid off...but oh the pain I get from seeing all these bad-ass cars coming out!!! Be responsible, be responsible be responsible...

I'd have to drive the new GT to see if it would be worth switching over - but 2014+ 1LE's are just money... its a great time we live in

[KMPrenger]

Originally Posted by stand-al0ne

New Mustang is sick. Mods will make it really potent. Not to mention this new platform just came out. It will only get better over time.

That said, Camaro 1LE is sick as well and is a great value. Hard for me to say which one I'd part ways with my money for one. I'm being conservative and keeping my v6 bc its paid off...but oh the pain I get from seeing all these bad-ass cars coming out!!! Be responsible, be responsible be responsible...

I'd have to drive the new GT to see if it would be worth switching over - but 2014+ 1LE's are just money... its a great time we live in

First off...new Mustang. Hell no.

As for a new Camaro...I am waiting for several things before I can make up my mind but...

If the new V6 offers a bit more power, and if the car is lighter, and they offer a performance pack for the V6 I think I'll be in for another V6. (Possibly even if there is no performance pack for the V6). I'm already pretty happy with my car, so I couldn't argue with a bit more power in a lighter car that would be even quicker and more fun to drive than my car.

Of course the 6th gen has to LOOK the part too. If not...its a deal breaker.

By the time I trade my super nice low mileage 2010 in, and plop down some cash on top of that, getting into a new nicely equipped V6 would be pretty cheap for me.

Otherwise, if the V6 is un-impressive or the weight isn't down, I'll either be keeping my car and mod it further, hunt for a used ABM SS or Hotwheels edition (gotta have the blue!), or possibly go for a new 16 SS. I could afford the new 16 SS, but I like putting away a lot of cash into savings each month, and I don't need the SS to be happy. (Really, its just the V8 sound lol)