Experts, Do I need to Upgrade speaker wire?? - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

CyberPunk223 · 04-30-2013, 07:15 PM

Planning this

this is what I bought, it's 240 watts rms, like 720 peak.

http://www.crutchfield.com/p_113KAC8....html?tp=35782

http://www.crutchfield.com/p_2064CS6...654.html?tp=95

http://www.crutchfield.com/p_109GT66...-69.html?tp=91

Do I need to upgrade to a heavier gauge to the speakers? I was assuming I would have too. What Gauge? 10?

not finding much helpful with web searches,

http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm#wiretable

wal-dog · 04-30-2013, 07:48 PM

You can if it makes you feel better about your system but you will unlikely see any noticeable improvement.

crashprime · 04-30-2013, 09:41 PM

60w RMS to each channel. You're looking at maybe 12ft to the rears, probably 3-4ft to the fronts worth of stock wiring. Camaro has 18 AWG I believe.

If you utilize the stock wiring and add say .. 8ft to the cable run (from the amp to the headunit) you're looking at a distance of ~12ft to the front, ~20ft to the rear 6x9's.

At that distance, 55 1/2 watts of your 60w make it to the front speakers. You lose 1/3rd of a decibel. 53 watts of your 60w make it to the rear speakers. You lose 1/2 of a decibel.

To most human ears, you need to measure at least 1 dB to notice a difference in volume. So, basically, no. With what you have you don't need to worry about it.

Ocx · 05-01-2013, 09:49 AM

Speakers:
16 gauge = Good
14 gauge = Better (Speakers over 125w RMS)

Subs:
12 gauge = Better
10 gauge = >1000 watts

AMP Power Cables:
8 gauge = Good
4 gauge = Better
0 gauge = Best

If you are upgrading to some good speakers/subs/amps spend the extra time to properly wire them. This will save you the headache of troubleshooting pops, hisses, distortion, SQ issues.

Motto to live by in Life and Cars: "Do it right the first time"

baum · 05-01-2013, 11:55 AM

comming from someone who was a installer for 12+ years..

what you are buying is a "basic" stereo. IMO i would just use the factory wiring for the equipment that you are buying. Keep in mind to do it properly to get wire through the doors you either need to do a new boot or go through the molex plugs (pain in the a$$).

i have ran lots more power than that in my own cars and never re-wired the speakers.

CyberPunk223 · 05-01-2013, 07:34 PM

alrighty, i'm learning a lot,,, so I'll use the stock wiring in the doors, the back ones are easy to re-wire cause the amp will be right next to them and I will use heavier gauge wire to what is added for the fronts.

here's how the thing will work,

-Amp in trunk & use speaker level inputs on Amp.
- splice into speaker wires behind HU and use to relay speaker level signals into Amp, keep all ground wires spliced together.
- run + & - speaker wire from amp to rear speakers (really short run)
-run & splice heavy gauge wire from amp to front + & - speaker wires behind head unit.

pretty much like this

crashprime · 05-01-2013, 08:14 PM

Add an LC7i, LCQ-1, RE-Q5, or JBL MS-8 between your head unit and amp to fix the pre-EQ'd bass attenuation.

CyberPunk223 · 05-01-2013, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crashprime

Add an LC7i, LCQ-1, RE-Q5, or JBL MS-8 between your head unit and amp to fix the pre-EQ'd bass attenuation.

I would think a quality amp with speaker level inputs would already take care of this.., the amp does already have a bass booster.

I'm going to try without it,, if I'm not happy with it, I may install one, atleast it would be an easy DIY add on,

thanks for the Tip though

CyberPunk223 · 05-02-2013, 08:19 AM

did some more research, just bought one of these, comes with everything you need for Plug & play install

Pac Aa-Gm44

baum · 05-02-2013, 08:39 AM

^^ that will do.

There is no need to waste your money on a heavy gauge speaker wire to go from the amp to the factory front wires. Just match the gauge. Your basically creating a "choke" point since you will be stepping down the wire.

When you say splice, make sure to actually cut the wire.

crashprime · 05-02-2013, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CyberPunk223

did some more research, just bought one of these, comes with everything you need for Plug & play install

Pac Aa-Gm44

I thought the AA-GM44 was going to be a perfect solution for me too.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showpo...1&postcount=33

Turns out it's a POS. You're better off using speaker level inputs.

HOWEVER ... you did not waste money on the AA-GM44, because it's an excellent T-Harness, so you can splice into your factory wiring without actually cutting any factory wiring.

CyberPunk223 · 05-02-2013, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crashprime

I thought the AA-GM44 was going to be a perfect solution for me too.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showpo...1&postcount=33

Turns out it's a POS. You're better off using speaker level inputs.

HOWEVER ... you did not waste money on the AA-GM44, because it's an excellent T-Harness, so you can splice into your factory wiring without actually cutting any factory wiring.

Really, so the PAC is really worse than running straight from the amp to the speakers?

Can I use the PAC to atleast send RCA cables to the amp?

If SO, then I'll just use the PAC as an amp turn on unit and to send the 4 channel signals to the amp.. I'll modify the PAC harness so the speaker power comes right from the amp..

which side of the HU harness plugs into the HU? white or Black?

Is the small white connector for the speaker signal input into the PAC or the speaker power from the PAC?

CyberPunk223 · 05-02-2013, 04:18 PM

I see people doing this, using these kicker ZISL cables to adapter their speaker wires to RCA outputs.

but won't this damage an amp not designed for this? WOuldnt this damage my Kenwood KAC-8405? this would only work with the kicker amp right?

The ZISLs are used from the radio side of the PAC harness, which gives us the RCAs to run to the amp.

CyberPunk223 · 05-02-2013, 04:33 PM

still reading, starting to understand this better, I dont understand why the rca adapters are needed? I guess so you can attach some longer cables to reach the amp? But again, isn't the amp not designed for this??

I think that these guys are sending too strong signals to their amps and that's why they have to turn their amps gains all the way down,, I dont think this is the correct way to do this..... not sure I want to go this way if it's not right,,,,, thinking of just using the PAC as it was designed to be used.. and turning up the gain dials up higher if needed.

04-30-2013, 07:15 PM	#1
CyberPunk223 Account Suspended Drives: 2012 LS Camaro Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Hagerstown, MD Posts: 383 View My Garage	Experts, Do I need to Upgrade speaker wire?? Planning this this is what I bought, it's 240 watts rms, like 720 peak. http://www.crutchfield.com/p_113KAC8....html?tp=35782 http://www.crutchfield.com/p_2064CS6...654.html?tp=95 http://www.crutchfield.com/p_109GT66...-69.html?tp=91 Do I need to upgrade to a heavier gauge to the speakers? I was assuming I would have too. What Gauge? 10? not finding much helpful with web searches, http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm#wiretable

04-30-2013, 07:48 PM	#2
wal-dog Drives: 2016 Garnet Red 1SS Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Tucson Posts: 208	You can if it makes you feel better about your system but you will unlikely see any noticeable improvement.

04-30-2013, 09:41 PM	#3
crashprime Drives: 2010 Camaro 1SS IOM M6 Join Date: May 2012 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 171	60w RMS to each channel. You're looking at maybe 12ft to the rears, probably 3-4ft to the fronts worth of stock wiring. Camaro has 18 AWG I believe. If you utilize the stock wiring and add say .. 8ft to the cable run (from the amp to the headunit) you're looking at a distance of ~12ft to the front, ~20ft to the rear 6x9's. At that distance, 55 1/2 watts of your 60w make it to the front speakers. You lose 1/3rd of a decibel. 53 watts of your 60w make it to the rear speakers. You lose 1/2 of a decibel. To most human ears, you need to measure at least 1 dB to notice a difference in volume. So, basically, no. With what you have you don't need to worry about it.

05-01-2013, 09:49 AM	#4
Ocx Drives: 2013 Camaro 2SS/RS Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Lake St. Louis, MO Posts: 174	Speakers: 16 gauge = Good 14 gauge = Better (Speakers over 125w RMS) Subs: 12 gauge = Better 10 gauge = >1000 watts AMP Power Cables: 8 gauge = Good 4 gauge = Better 0 gauge = Best If you are upgrading to some good speakers/subs/amps spend the extra time to properly wire them. This will save you the headache of troubleshooting pops, hisses, distortion, SQ issues. Motto to live by in Life and Cars: "Do it right the first time"

05-01-2013, 11:55 AM	#5
baum Drives: 2013 1LS, 2013 Ram 1500 Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Minneapolis, mn Posts: 645	comming from someone who was a installer for 12+ years.. what you are buying is a "basic" stereo. IMO i would just use the factory wiring for the equipment that you are buying. Keep in mind to do it properly to get wire through the doors you either need to do a new boot or go through the molex plugs (pain in the a$$). i have ran lots more power than that in my own cars and never re-wired the speakers.

05-01-2013, 07:34 PM	#6
CyberPunk223 Account Suspended Drives: 2012 LS Camaro Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Hagerstown, MD Posts: 383 View My Garage	alrighty, i'm learning a lot,,, so I'll use the stock wiring in the doors, the back ones are easy to re-wire cause the amp will be right next to them and I will use heavier gauge wire to what is added for the fronts. here's how the thing will work, -Amp in trunk & use speaker level inputs on Amp. - splice into speaker wires behind HU and use to relay speaker level signals into Amp, keep all ground wires spliced together. - run + & - speaker wire from amp to rear speakers (really short run) -run & splice heavy gauge wire from amp to front + & - speaker wires behind head unit. pretty much like this

05-01-2013, 08:14 PM	#7
crashprime Drives: 2010 Camaro 1SS IOM M6 Join Date: May 2012 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 171	Add an LC7i, LCQ-1, RE-Q5, or JBL MS-8 between your head unit and amp to fix the pre-EQ'd bass attenuation.

05-02-2013, 08:19 AM	#9
CyberPunk223 Account Suspended Drives: 2012 LS Camaro Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Hagerstown, MD Posts: 383 View My Garage	did some more research, just bought one of these, comes with everything you need for Plug & play install Pac Aa-Gm44

05-02-2013, 08:39 AM	#10
baum Drives: 2013 1LS, 2013 Ram 1500 Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Minneapolis, mn Posts: 645	^^ that will do. There is no need to waste your money on a heavy gauge speaker wire to go from the amp to the factory front wires. Just match the gauge. Your basically creating a "choke" point since you will be stepping down the wire. When you say splice, make sure to actually cut the wire.

05-02-2013, 04:18 PM	#13
CyberPunk223 Account Suspended Drives: 2012 LS Camaro Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Hagerstown, MD Posts: 383 View My Garage	I see people doing this, using these kicker ZISL cables to adapter their speaker wires to RCA outputs. but won't this damage an amp not designed for this? WOuldnt this damage my Kenwood KAC-8405? this would only work with the kicker amp right? The ZISLs are used from the radio side of the PAC harness, which gives us the RCAs to run to the amp.

05-02-2013, 04:33 PM	#14
CyberPunk223 Account Suspended Drives: 2012 LS Camaro Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Hagerstown, MD Posts: 383 View My Garage	still reading, starting to understand this better, I dont understand why the rca adapters are needed? I guess so you can attach some longer cables to reach the amp? But again, isn't the amp not designed for this?? I think that these guys are sending too strong signals to their amps and that's why they have to turn their amps gains all the way down,, I dont think this is the correct way to do this..... not sure I want to go this way if it's not right,,,,, thinking of just using the PAC as it was designed to be used.. and turning up the gain dials up higher if needed.