How Many Cancelling Order if no ABL (ambient lighting) ?

[70 COPO]

Pete,

Perhaps the likely reason GM is "mum" on many things right now is for legal, competitive reasons, and Christmas vacations.

[NAHURRY]

Originally Posted by SilverTurtle

there is a problem here... and the problem is that we've waited for this car and been faithful to the cause for YEARS... we've endured the cancellation of the 4th gen and waited for years with nothing... then watched this car go from Concept to IVER to pre-production to production car and SEMA concepts and now to captured fleet cars roaming the streets... and we've ALL made some sacrifices along the way... the roof is a little taller, there is a b-pillar, the gas tank isn't up on the rear shoulder, the gas tank is on the OTHER SIDE OF THE CAR, the radio looks completely different than the Concept's, there's no navigation system (yes, there is OnStar, but it would have been cool to have something like what the CTS has)... all of these things we suffered through and persisted with our loyalty and love for the car... we "kept the faith"... we've ordered our cars knowing that we weren't getting HUD... we ordered our cars knowing that parking assist wasn't going to make it to the first run of cars... we ordered our cars knowing that a Z28 might come out and completely blow our cars away in a year... but there is a line... and not having ambient lighting available in the car at launch is NOT ACCEPTABLE.

the Ignition video was put out to tease us with how cool the interior would be... and then you tell us we can't have the one thing you were hoping to garner interest in with that video? the HUD, as it stands, in that video isn't going to be available but now you tell us that if you order at launch you're not going to get the AMBIENT LIGHTING?!?!? are we going to get a discount versus those who will order later and get the same car but WITH the ambient lighting? or is this a "you're buying the first run" tax? will there be a retro fit for those of us who have remained loyal for sooooooo long? for those of us who have MULTIPLE CAMAROS and GM products? or is this a "too bad, so sad" deal?

because, honetly, GM, this is a DEAL BREAKER when compounded with everything else that we've endured... Heaven knows I love to be the first to have a super cool new thing, but if this isn't going to be available, why order now? mark my words, guys, if this ambient lighting thing is true, we will be cancelling our pre-order... I would rather wait to get the best possible deal and package rather than being first in line... as it stands, if we wait, we'll be able to get a lower cost out the door, more options for the car and maybe even swing a Z06/Camaro SS double purchase for waiting, so this truly is a deal breaker.


GM, if you're hurting for money, dont piss off your core fans... dont make us wait for ANOTHER item on this car... you need sales right now and this WILL NOT BE GOOD for your reputation or sales... make some miracles happen, GM... you've had over 2 years of developing this car to get it right... time to prove that you're number one on the planet and deliver on your promises or get ready to have your name dragged through the mud.

your loyal following awaits an honest answer before January 1, 2009.

I feel the same way ...Great post

[35th02ss]

Ok I can understand everyone's feelings and passion about this car. But you have to understand that GM is not doing this to anger, loss sales, etc. Please know that the Camaro Team is trying to give you the car that everyone has been waiting along time for, me included.

If you think that they are not working the issue, your very wrong. They are working very hard to resolve this. The time that these people have put in is mind blowing to say the least. It would be nothing for Cheryl or John to go to the office for 12 hours then have to come home for a 2 hour tele con.

I assure you that everyone is giving 150% to this. Give them your understanding they know your disappointed as they are.

[Rogue Leader]

I'm still not worried.... Its a feature that is available on other GM cars and one of the simplest ones. I'm SURE they will figure it out in 2 months. Worst case I'm sure the wiring harness is ready to go and it can be retrofitted in.

[kinyu]

Originally Posted by XAnimal

I read that somehow as "I have it in my overrated SSR"

That's true too

[SilverTurtle]

Originally Posted by 35th02ss

Ok I can understand everyone's feelings and passion about this car. But you have to understand that GM is not doing this to anger, loss sales, etc. Please know that the Camaro Team is trying to give you the car that everyone has been waiting along time for, me included.

If you think that they are not working the issue, your very wrong. They are working very hard to resolve this. The time that these people have put in is mind blowing to say the least. It would be nothing for Cheryl or John to go to the office for 12 hours then have to come home for a 2 hour tele con.

I assure you that everyone is giving 150% to this. Give them your understanding they know your disappointed as they are.

I dont think they're intentionally doing this... I never have thought they were doing this on purpose... and I dont doubt that they're giving this their all... what I want to know is "what are you going to do about this?"... the people who buy this car first thing out of the gate will be the ones that make the car or break the car... their demonstration of how it performs and what it is capable of will either spread the love or spread the disdain... how is it going to look for GM to have a car launched, after much talk and media blitz, only to have one of the coolest features not on the car? and how is it going to look if those people dont get some kind of retrofit or discount for this suddenly missing item? "we coldn't get this to work, so we're going to charge you for it, anyway, and then it'll be free to those that buy the car next year... oh, you can't afford to buy a car and trade it in a year and a half later? too bad, so sad for you"... that's not going to go over well with customers.

this feature doesn't HAVE to be on the car... but something has to be done if its not going to be.

[SdustinK]

already cancelled mine

[35th02ss]

let me ask everyone this. Would you rather have something on the car that is not 100% or wait till it is. Just because it's on another car means nothing. It still has to pass the durability test for this car.

Take for example. A person buys this car that lives in AZ. After three or so years the dash starts to seperate from the ABL due to the heat which leaves a gap. Do you think that person would be happy? What kind of review would they give GM for that. This is just some of the things that GM looks at.

With or without ABL I'll still be getting mine.

[70 COPO]

OK I will bite. I will Pass. No ABL, No Long stripe offering I will be canceling my order too just a matter of time.

I am however very willing to give GM some more time to get past the technical issues and the bean counters, but I too have limits.

Where are all you guys that pounced on me over the assertion that I would cancel the order on the short rally stripes?? ABL is cosmetic too - and the differance is I have not yet canceled the order for my car over the stripes yet others are canceling over ABL right here and are seemingly getting a "board pass" for doing so. Where is the fan boy outrage?

Please...consistancy guys......

[NVMY68SS]

Uhm, let's see.........I think we are being very consistent and fair in our comments on both items.

Yes, they are both cosmetic, but the stripes are there, the ABL is still a question on it's status.

You made the same comments over and over and over about how your friends were going to laugh at the short stripes or how it looked like a U-haul. Nobody has made the same ridiculous references on the ABL. The stripes can be added or deleted adjusting the bottom-line price. So far, we don't know if we can make the same adjustments if the ABL will not be on the first run cars.

You have commented on the length of the stripes. We are commenting on an integral electrical system to the vehicle that may or may not be a simple retrofit later. We don't want to pay for something we aren't getting is the biggest thing here as well as not getting something that has been hyped-up by GM for the last year.

[70 COPO]

Originally Posted by NVMY68SS

Uhm, let's see.........I think we are being very consistent and fair in our comments on both items.

Yes, they are both cosmetic, but the stripes are there, the ABL is still a question on it's status.

You made the same comments over and over and over about how your friends were going to laugh at the short stripes or how it looked like a U-haul. Nobody has made the same ridiculous references on the ABL. The stripes can be added or deleted adjusting the bottom-line price. So far, we don't know if we can make the same adjustments if the ABL will not be on the first run cars.

You have commented on the length of the stripes. We are commenting on an integral electrical system to the vehicle that may or may not be a simple retrofit later. We don't want to pay for something we aren't getting is the biggest thing here as well as not getting something that has been hyped-up by GM for the last year.

Your assertion fails on its face. I only responded as I did after being repeadedly attacked.

BTW: Where is that utterly insulting quote you borrowed from Pete that is suddenly missing from your signature?
Here: http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showth...?t=9238&page=5
(at post #112)

Please explain your conduct.

[SilverTurtle]

Originally Posted by 35th02ss

let me ask everyone this. Would you rather have something on the car that is not 100% or wait till it is. Just because it's on another car means nothing. It still has to pass the durability test for this car.

Take for example. A person buys this car that lives in AZ. After three or so years the dash starts to seperate from the ABL due to the heat which leaves a gap. Do you think that person would be happy? What kind of review would they give GM for that. This is just some of the things that GM looks at.

With or without ABL I'll still be getting mine.

that still does nothing to address the question I posed: what is GM going to do about this if this item is missing? discount? retrofit? upgrade? nothing?

the people that bought '98-'00 model Camaros SSs and Z28s missed out on the LS6 intake and upgraded exhaust manifolds that went into the '01-'02 models... the folks that bought in '98-'99 missed out on the steering wheel controls available from '00-'02... the '98 models had the worst flowing heads... the '01 Z06 had 385hp, while the '02-'04 Z06s had 405hp... these are all little things that initial customer didn't get, but the later customers did get... but they are examples from the past where it was a "too bad, so sad" deal and the price didn't change for the car... but in all of those cases, the initial run of cars wasn't broadcast to have something that it didn't have... and that is the case here.

again, I'm not saying it has to be on the car, I'm saying that if it isn't, there needs to be something done for the initial run customers so they can say, "hey, I didn't get the cool ambient lighting, but GM did me right and gave me XXXXXXX to make up for it"... whether its a free car cover, a retrofit, a free year of turn by turn OnStar, or whatever, GM needs to make the decision to take care of the customer here and not leave them out in the cold.

and Jeremy, please dont take this is a personal attack or anything, because I'm certainly not attacking anyone on the forums, or even GM, here... I am just giving GM the reality check that they said something was going to be there, made a video of the feature being there and now, suddenly, it might not be there... if its not, something needs to be done to fulfill the customer... simply telling them to cancel their order and wait is not enough... we've ALL waited long eough for GM to resurrect the Camaro, its time to make us smile at ownership and beam with pride at the product we get... and its time for GM to give back to the loyal following that has kept Camaro a household name for over 6 years while GM tried to use front wheel drive cars to fill the void left by their bean counters and bad decisions back in 2002.

[speedster]

You might not like this response, but are you buying a car or are you buying pretty lights?

I am really surprised to see hard core Camaro performance enthusiasts cancelling orders because of lights... There is an incredible amount of turmoil going on in OUR economy and like it or not some items may be impacted. They may not be able to afford to do the ambient lighting right now. They ARE in bailout mode. Be happy they are producing the Camaro at all and that it is as close to the concept as realistically possible. Remember the phrase "The price of perfection is bankruptcy". Never truer than right now... Wouldn't you prefer a Camaro with no ambient lighting over a Toyota with Neons? We have to assume so since all of us have taken the time to be an integral part of this site and made the effort to place our orders...

[Attorneyguy]

Originally Posted by speedster

You might not like this response, but are you buying a car or are you buying pretty lights?

I am really surprised to see hard core Camaro performance enthusiasts cancelling orders because of lights... There is an incredible amount of turmoil going on in OUR economy and like it or not some items may be impacted. They may not be able to afford to do the ambient lighting right now. They ARE in bailout mode. Be happy they are producing the Camaro at all and that it is as close to the concept as realistically possible. Remember the phrase "The price of perfection is bankruptcy". Never truer than right now... Wouldn't you prefer a Camaro with no ambient lighting over a Toyota with Neons? We have to assume so since all of us have taken the time to be an integral part of this site and made the effort to place our orders...

I agree it is somehow silly to cancel an order because you can't get the pretty little lights. The rest of the car is still sweet. The people canceling their orders will be kicking themselves in the foot come this spring when they see their friends driving down the road in their high-powered Camaros and they're still driving around in their beater...all because of some little lights!

On the other hand, we ARE the customers. If you promise something as a company, you better deliver. I don't buy the bailout excuse. GM can't add these lights because of the financial problems they're having?