**LG L99 to LS3 Conversion G5XB Cam and Magnacharger TVS 2300 Results**

[pharmd]

Originally Posted by old motorhead

Please explain to a dumb old farmer how you make the quantum leap from 560 rwhp to somehow equal 700 at the flywheel. I'm a little mystified.....

700flywheel minus the 20% drivetrainloss = ~560rwhp

700 x 0.8 (ie the 20 loss minus 100 = 80% rwhp)=560rwhp

Does that help? Its confusing to try to explain via typing.

FWIW most M6 2300's with cam are a little over 600rwhp @ 8psi (for those of you that have done this, is that about accurate...M6 guys?)

[bad2000z]

Originally Posted by Chocolate Apocalypse

I cant wait for someone to take it to the track with a set of DRs, those are the numbers that really count.

Exactly

[old motorhead]

Originally Posted by pharmd

700flywheel minus the 20% drivetrainloss = ~560rwhp

700 x 0.8 (ie the 20 loss minus 100 = 80% rwhp)=560rwhp

Does that help? Its confusing to try to explain via typing.

FWIW most M6 2300's with cam are a little over 600rwhp @ 8psi (for those of you that have done this, is that about accurate...M6 guys?)

I understand the math and yours is spot on. However, I don't believe it. I can understand 20% drivetrain loss in a heavy a$$ed 3/4 ton truck drivetrain, but I can't go for that in a Camaro. Also, I'm not totally convinced that the drivetrain loss is a straight percentage across the board. Maybe 20% at lower HP levels, but less % wise as HP goes up.

If you're believing the 20% drivetrain loss in this build, you have to believe that this build is 50 hp better than a ZR1. Stock vette ZR1's dyno in the same 560hp range. Engine hp in the ZR1 is 636. An auto trannied ZR1 should dyno 510 if you use the same 20% drivetrain loss factor. If you believe these #'s, you have to believe that this build is 50+ hp more. Hmmmmm..

[pharmd]

Originally Posted by old motorhead

I understand the math and yours is spot on. However, I don't believe it. I can understand 20% drivetrain loss in a heavy a$$ed 3/4 ton truck drivetrain, but I can't go for that in a Camaro. Also, I'm not totally convinced that the drivetrain loss is a straight percentage across the board. Maybe 20% at lower HP levels, but less % wise as HP goes up.

If you're believing the 20% drivetrain loss in this build, you have to believe that this build is 50 hp better than a ZR1. Stock vette ZR1's dyno in the same 560hp range. Engine hp in the ZR1 is 636. An auto trannied ZR1 should dyno 510 if you use the same 20% drivetrain loss factor. If you believe these #'s, you have to believe that this build is 50+ hp more. Hmmmmm..

The factor works man...my car dyno'd 321 stock...based on fly wheel SAE rating of 400...400 x .8=320rwhp (my car 321rwhp)...on my car, on that dyno, its exact. These auto's suck BTW.

[bad2000z]

I would love to know how much this package costs...12k?

[old motorhead]

Originally Posted by pharmd

The factor works man...my car dyno'd 321 stock...based on fly wheel SAE rating of 400...400 x .8=320rwhp (my car 321rwhp)...on my car, on that dyno, its exact. These auto's suck BTW.

I agree 100% at lower Hp levels, but I have a hard time believing those numbers when hp levels go up. 1000 engine hp would be 800 at the wheels. That "missing" 200 hp should show up somewhere. Things ought to be VERY hot somewhere in the drivetrain. 200hp doesn't just disappear. I think the drivetrain loss percentage goes down as hp levels go up.

[chappy48]

Originally Posted by pharmd

The factor works man...my car dyno'd 321 stock...based on fly wheel SAE rating of 400...400 x .8=320rwhp (my car 321rwhp)...on my car, on that dyno, its exact. These auto's suck BTW.

How do they suck? They manage roughly the same 1/4 mile time with less hp and more drivetrain loss. Find someone to tune that tranny with faster shifts and optimized shift points, watch out!

[chappy48]

Originally Posted by old motorhead

I agree 100% at lower Hp levels, but I have a hard time believing those numbers when hp levels go up. 1000 engine hp would be 800 at the wheels. That "missing" 200 hp should show up somewhere. Things ought to be VERY hot somewhere in the drivetrain. 200hp doesn't just disappear. I think the drivetrain loss percentage goes down as hp levels go up.

Well the car I drive right now (2004 Honda Accord v6) is dynoing around 200whp with 240bhp. Obviously the camaro is a completely different car, but they are dynoing right around 320-330whp with 400bhp. Unless the camaro's auto tranny is a lot worse then the accords, that shows you it's a pretty constant percentage loss through the drivetrain.

[old motorhead]

Originally Posted by chappy48

Well the car I drive right now (2004 Honda Accord v6) is dynoing around 200whp with 240bhp. Obviously the camaro is a completely different car, but they are dynoing right around 320-330whp with 400bhp. Unless the camaro's auto tranny is a lot worse then the accords, that shows you it's a pretty constant percentage loss through the drivetrain.

I agree with losing 20% on a stock car. If you add 100 engine hp to your stock Accord, I'm saying that more than 80 will show up on the dyno. You won't lose 20% of every hp you add. While the drivetrain loss will always be there, it won't be a constant 20% as hp goes up.

[pharmd]

Originally Posted by old motorhead

I agree 100% at lower Hp levels, but I have a hard time believing those numbers when hp levels go up. 1000 engine hp would be 800 at the wheels. That "missing" 200 hp should show up somewhere. Things ought to be VERY hot somewhere in the drivetrain. 200hp doesn't just disappear. I think the drivetrain loss percentage goes down as hp levels go up.

It would be nice if that were so, but I don't think we will ever know the truth on this. All I know is it doesn't appear to be a exponential type curve, it appears to be linear, but don't think we will ever know.

[pharmd]

Originally Posted by chappy48

How do they suck? They manage roughly the same 1/4 mile time with less hp and more drivetrain loss. Find someone to tune that tranny with faster shifts and optimized shift points, watch out!

All I can tell you (having had all the things you mentioned already done on my car) is that my RPM modified 4L70 in my TBSS smokes this tranny, in terms of shift speed, smoothness, and overall general operation. Until a shop can get into one of these things and mod it, its just not gonna be good enough IMHO.

[bad2000z]

^^I agree. I wouldn't be surprised if shops start doing 4l65e-4l70e swaps in these cars with mega horsepower. That A6 tranny is one of the main reasons I haven't pulled the trigger on a new Camaro yet. The other reason is the AFM/VVT crap.

[1BadaSS]

Originally Posted by chappy48

Well the car I drive right now (2004 Honda Accord v6) is dynoing around 200whp with 240bhp. Obviously the camaro is a completely different car, but they are dynoing right around 320-330whp with 400bhp. Unless the camaro's auto tranny is a lot worse then the accords, that shows you it's a pretty constant percentage loss through the drivetrain.

You have a fwd car as well which typically don't lose as much as rwd. AWD cars lose the most. When my 6MT Acura TSX was stock, it put down 175 fwhp and the car is rated at 200 hp at the flywheel. Auto's do about 165-170 stock. After adding the supercharger, I put down 255 whp and autos are doing roughly 220-230.

[LSX-80MM]