Supercharger or Turbo?

[lil_red_v6]

talk about sick

[Congoman775]

yea thats pretty sick.

id be getting the base V8 so probaly start with around 400-430 hp.

right away id look for pulleys, throttle body, exhaust, coldair intake, and then look for the "engine steriods"

so right now it seems like with all that, and with finances in mind, a Roots supercharger would be the way to go?

[The_Blur]

Before you do any type of forced induction, do very thorough research. If you do not know the pros and cons of each already, we cannot advise you. You should be on the verge of a degree in physics before you install any type of forced induction. It is neither simple nor easy to install nitrous oxide, a turbocharger, or a supercharger. Get some books on each type of forced induction and learn about them. Make a class of it before you consider installation. Failure to do this may result in a motor without pistons.

I do not mean to pick on any of your opinions with this post, but this is the best advice I can give. All of us posting in this thread are probably underinformed about the specifics of forced induction. It is not as simple as bolting on a few tubes and turning the key. Do yourselves a favor and do the hard research work before you do the FI build.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by The_Blur

You should be on the verge of a degree in physics before you install any type of forced induction.

I agree 100% with everything else you wrote; research your brains out, otherwise bad things can happen very easily, but........a degree in Physics?

[Congoman775]

well i hope i didnt come across as implying id be installing these myself... im a journalism major haha.

but yes this is the tip of the ice berg as far as the research goes, ill continue to build on this and use it as a starting point on which to build.

just a couple more questions...

how do turbos compare to superchargers in way of gas milage?

and i have recently had the chance to ... play ... with one of my family members 06' Saab Turbo. and i have to say the lag on that turbo is horrible. i dont know what kinds of turbos were used in those cars etc. but id hope they have better equipment now???

[Robert91RS]

I also agree that a power adder should not be taken lightly or done without research, however several companys are taking the guess work out of it for some of the newer cars. I'm talking mostly about complete kits that include a programer preset for the boost range it produces and all the necissary hardware. These kits often run from 3,000-6,000 dollars and the speed shops who would be willing to install such a kit would cost another small fortune. I feel confident that installation of one of these kits shouldn't be to difficult.

Turbos are generaly more mpg friendly.

[The_Blur]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

I agree 100% with everything else you wrote; research your brains out, otherwise bad things can happen very easily, but........a degree in Physics?

In other words, have a very thorough understanding of Newtonian physics and how they relate to your motor. It can be an associate's degree!

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by The_Blur

In other words, have a very thorough understanding of Newtonian physics and how they relate to your motor. It can be an associate's degree!

I'm still not getting it. (I'm probably thinking way too much into it) But being a backyard mechanic, who has a thorough understanding of all thing Internal Combustion isn't enough? Especially as these companies put out almost idiot-proof kits.

[Nickdago]

An LS3 with a procharger, that will get you in the mid 550 HP range

[The_Blur]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

I'm still not getting it. (I'm probably thinking way too much into it) But being a backyard mechanic, who has a thorough understanding of all thing Internal Combustion isn't enough? Especially as these companies put out almost idiot-proof kits.

Obviously, I'm exaggerating. I just think that a thorough understanding of how the engine works with and without forced induction makes a big difference. You don't want to blow your motor. You also don't want to look like an idiot at the track explaining your gains with forced induction; you'll look like a 16-year-old with a JDM clone talking about how great your car is. When doing something elaborate to your car, you need to be right about everything. If you aren't right about FI, you could end up really hurting your car and maybe endangering your life or the lives of your passengers. Engines are underestimated in the danger category. What happens when your beam breaks and you have a rogue piston bouncing around? You lose a lot of power and that speeding semi behind you rolls over you and your 3 passengers.

• Cheap—don't be a ricer
• Fast—you know you want it
• Reliable—always important for safety
• Pick 2

[Robert91RS]

If you aren't right about FI, you could end up really hurting your car and maybe endangering your life or the lives of your passengers. Engines are underestimated in the danger category. What happens when your beam breaks and you have a rogue piston bouncing around? You lose a lot of power and that speeding semi behind you rolls over you and your 3 passengers.

Wow Blur you have kind of a dark outlook on things. lol-jk
But seriously I wouldn't be quite so dark and gloomy about it, if everyone was this cautios we wouldn't be drivin these crazy fast Automobile thinga-majigers at all. I have learned everything I know about cars by a balance of research, trial-error, and an ocassional question when I find somone "in the Know." Just be smart and safe when your trying something new.

[Congoman775]

yea... well is there something specfically that i should make sure that i have to support the added power of the FI? i mean i dont plan on blowing my engine so i WILL do the research into it, but is there something specific ud like to share?

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Congoman775

yea... well is there something specfically that i should make sure that i have to support the added power of the FI? i mean i dont plan on blowing my engine so i WILL do the research into it, but is there something specific ud like to share?

Depends on how MUCH you're going to be boosting the engine.

If you go high-boost, I (no expert) reccomend at least a stronger crank. But if you go all out it would be worth looking into full rotating assemblies (crank, rods, pistons), that give you a lower compression ratio than stock. At this point, it's smart to get an engine builder involved; and have some performance shop tune the engine....

On the safe side, though, stock engines can normally take 5-7psi of boost without starting to break things. That's good for about 40-50% increase in power, which is more than I think anybody would use out on the street.

[Beyond Limits]

Originally Posted by Congoman775

yea... well is there something specfically that i should make sure that i have to support the added power of the FI? i mean i dont plan on blowing my engine so i WILL do the research into it, but is there something specific ud like to share?

It really all depends on how much boost you want to run. You can usually run 7 to 10 pounds of boost (the ideal range for a stock motor imho is right where Dragon said between 5 to 7 lbs) on a stock motor without causing any damage. Anything more then that and you have to start considering things like a strengthened crank, stronger rods, better rings, cylinder wall thickness (really only an issue on blocks that have been overbored, but I don't know how thick of sleeves GM is putting on the LS3 and their new DI V6 blocks), and since you have the motor cracked open at that point you might as well put in some forged pistons and change out the camshaft. The other thing to consider too is once you start getting into that realm you have to start considering the impact on more then just the motor. Once you have a motor that is making over 650hp or so you now have to have your tranny rebuilt to handle the power and a new drive shaft. Depending on the rear end they put in there is also the possibility of having to change out the diff and axle shafts, but usually you dont have to mess with the rear end until you are north of the 700hp mark... (If there is one good thing that F*rd ever made it was the 9" rear end, although I have to admit the 12 bolt made by strange engineering is a really slick and bulletproof rear end...) Your point of failure is always your weakest link (duh) but I have been messing around with forced induction for enough years now to say without hesitation that it is one sure fire way to find that weakest point. I also have been doing it long enough to say I would not hesitate to put a mild supercharger (7 lbs max boost) on a stock motor without any concerns about stress failures.