Turbo or Supercharger?????

[Da Hose]

What are the differences between the two???? do you get basically the same effect from either? or is this just a personal prefrence thing?

[axis]

That depends on which SC you're comparing it to. A turbo is more closely related to the Procharger and Vortech SC's. Both of these provide a vastly different power curve than the top mounted twin screws. There are pros/cons to all three though. You need to decide what your plans for the car are and what you want from it down the road.

[Da Hose]

Originally Posted by axis

That depends on which SC you're comparing it to. A turbo is more closely related to the Procharger and Vortech SC's. Both of these provide a vastly different power curve than the top mounted twin screws. There are pros/cons to all three though. You need to decide what your plans for the car are and what you want from it down the road.

But for all intensive purposes...they force more air and gas into the cylinders right.... I guess what I'm getting at is, that is their main reason for being!!!

so I'm guessing that the different ways of doing that is what is producing the vastly different dyno numbers. I know a lot has to do with how much boost and so forth. Just curious if you had say 6 lbs of boost on a twin screw maggie might make 500 hp and 6 lbs of boost on a turbo or pro charger might make 580 hp...they are essentially doing the same thing right?

[speedster]

An engine is just a big air pump, so they are all about forcing air, hence FI - Forced Induction.

Try here to start:
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38022

This topic has tons of threads comparing them.

[Da Hose]

Originally Posted by speedster

An engine is just a big air pump, so they are all about forcing air, hence FI - Forced Induction.

Try here to start:
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38022

This topic has tons of threads comparing them.

Thanks man.....it's hard to wrap my head around either...there are pros and cons to each....I appreciate y'alls help!

[Cole@Fastlane]

Hey Ronnie, You can get pretty close in horsepower per lb of boost but i think you saw from looking at the dyno numbers there is no comparing the torque numbers.The turbo is far superior in that respect.

[Da Hose]

Originally Posted by Cole@Fastlane

Hey Ronnie, You can get pretty close in horsepower per lb of boost but i think you saw from looking at the dyno numbers there is no comparing the torque numbers.The turbo is far superior in that respect.

Agreed

[axis]

Originally Posted by Da Hose

Thanks man.....it's hard to wrap my head around either...there are pros and cons to each....I appreciate y'alls help!

As said before, a engine is basically an airpump. The more air you push through your engine, the more HP it makes. There are NUMEROUS ways to do this but FI gives the most gains. The different SC's and turbos vary in efficiency so that's where the variations in HP/tq come from. SC's are run off a pulley that creates drag on the engine. This is what it means to use power to make power since that drag will suck HP from the car. Just like turning on the AC but a SC sucks more HP. A turbo is run off the expelled exhaust so it doesn't take power away from the engine to make power. Top mounts produce near instant tq since there's litterally inches between the impellers and the heads. This can be a good thing or bad thing, depending on how badly you abuse your car. Instant tq will eat up a drivetrain but can be mad fun to have that much tq available that quickly. All of them produce a very similar HP curve, in terms of onset and rise. A properly sized turbo should make a tad more HP/boost since it's the most efficient and should be easier on the drivetrain since your Tq isn't instant. It does come on quickly though.

Originally Posted by Cole@Fastlane

Hey Ronnie, You can get pretty close in horsepower per lb of boost but i think you saw from looking at the dyno numbers there is no comparing the torque numbers.The turbo is far superior in that respect.

You have to define your parameters for superior. Superior as in more, maybe, but not in peak tq at lower rpms. You can't beat a topmount for insta-tq. Well, nitrous not included.

[Cole@Fastlane]

Originally Posted by axis

As said before, a engine is basically an airpump. The more air you push through your engine, the more HP it makes. There are NUMEROUS ways to do this but FI gives the most gains. The different SC's and turbos vary in efficiency so that's where the variations in HP/tq come from. SC's are run off a pulley that creates drag on the engine. This is what it means to use power to make power since that drag will suck HP from the car. Just like turning on the AC but a SC sucks more HP. A turbo is run off the expelled exhaust so it doesn't take power away from the engine to make power. Top mounts produce near instant tq since there's litterally inches between the impellers and the heads. This can be a good thing or bad thing, depending on how badly you abuse your car. Instant tq will eat up a drivetrain but can be mad fun to have that much tq available that quickly. All of them produce a very similar HP curve, in terms of onset and rise. A properly sized turbo should make a tad more HP/boost since it's the most efficient and should be easier on the drivetrain since your Tq isn't instant. It does come on quickly though.



You have to define your parameters for superior. Superior as in more, maybe, but not in peak tq at lower rpms. You can't beat a topmount for insta-tq. Well, nitrous not included.

Superior meaning SUPERIOR.you can split hairs all you want but anywhere in the useable (and i appologize in advance if useable is not understood here)rpm band a turbo is going to be superior meaning produce more torque when applied to the same cubic inch displacement engine.

When you can make 300 foot pounds at 3000 rpm and 550 at 3500 rpm 750 at 4000 and peak 920 at 4500 rpm.

Sorry but you and granatelli can have that 2500 rpm and under stuff

[DCrevenge]

At turbo will make more TQ and HP, you can control how much boost you run and use differnt turbos to achive your HP goal, it will also make more heat and may require additonal modifications. A supercharger will be easier and more cost effective but will have less of a fun factor.

[DGthe3]

First and foremost, a turbocharger is a supercharger. A supercharger is a device which compresses the air charge and feeds it into the engine. A turbo is a specific type of supercharger which is exhaust driven, while supercharger generally refers to just the mechanically driven type.

There are generally 3 types of mechanically driven superchargers. There are centrifugal type, which work much like a turbocharger in that there is a very high speed impeller compressing the air. Next is the twin screw type. These feature long screws which intermesh to compress the air. These are often highly efficient, yet are also somewhat expensive compared to the similar 3rd type, the roots style. Roots, or 'twin lobe' design opperates like a gear pump and has two long intermeshing lobes. This is what most people think of when talking of superchargers.

Turbo systems also come in threee main varieties. Single and twin. Sounds like just two, but there are two types of twin turbo: parallel and sequential. Single turbo is pretty self explanatory. A parallel system could be thought of as a true twin turbo. Both turbos are identical and can either feed into a common intake, or can feed into individual banks on V-type engines. A sequential system uses one small turbo and one large one. The idea is to minimize turbo lag and maximize top end power.

What is better? Depends on what you are looking for. You can get more power out of a single gigantic turbo than any other setup. But this isn't going to have the best characteristics for a daily driver. A twin turbo setup might be considered ideal ... until you have to do the plumbing yourself. A roots type blower is practically a bolt on, but there is a bit of a fuel economy hit vs most other setups. Screw's are good, but somewhat expensive.

[Da Hose]

thanks for all of the great info......

[cdigiovanni]

You guys are all caught up on dyno numbers... what about daily performance!
580hp 650hp 390hp really!

numbers dont mean a thing unless the car can throw down in the street or at the strip! hook up properly with a good reaction time. etc.
my best at the track in Englishtown Raceway NJ 58*degrees outside that night was
12.4 @ 112.6 mph w/ a 0.42 reation time.

which im very please with! (until some runs a 12.3 or lower ) happens all day!

[Archangel]

i have a question about weight...do they end up adding the same amount of weight to the car overall ( supercharger front weight, turbo plus all the piping, etc)? I am interested in force induction for a daily driver, but what would be more applicable for say autocross, where weight and handling play a part? first reaction is turbo cause it sounds like it would be lighter but less instant when you are coming out of a turn so then you would want a supercharger but that adds front end weight...am I wrong? i can't decide ...lol I don't even have my camaro yet..another question, when people mention turbo lag...how much lag are we talking about ... thousand 1, thousand 2, thousand 3 BOOST...or more, or shorter?