ZL1 Value

[GoldenBear]

I'm going to to purchase a 2012 ZL1. In fact, I've been wanting to purchase a high performance 5th Gen Camaro since the 2006 Detroit Auto Show. I've just been waiting for Chevrolet to produce the right 5th Gen Camaro for me, and the ZL1 is the right Camaro for me. However, at $50,000 or more, I began thinking a little bit about the value compared to the the value Chevrolet produced in the late 1960's.

My 1969 Z28, purchased from Guardian Chevrolet in Brea, CA, in June of 1969, sold with a MSRP of $4,168.75, which would be (according to the current CPI numbers, and I know that the government CPI is lower than actual real world inflation) $25,083.46 in 2011 dollars.

I may be living in the past, but a ~$50K ZL1 price is about two times the price of my 1969 Z28 in real dollars. I realize that the ZL1, with 40 plus years of technological improvements, is a considerably better and more technologically advanced car than my 1969 Z28, but still, twice the price is a hefty premium to pay.

I liked the idea that in the mid to late 60's the average muscle car aficionado could walk into a Chevy dealer and check the right RPO boxes and order the car of one's dreams without having to spend a king's ransom. IMHO, that was one of the great things about Chevrolet muscle in the 60's, it was affordable. Whereas, today it seems that to be able to afford the type of performance that was available to the average income earner in the 60's, one has to be relatively well off.

Maybe I'm just being nostalgic, and don't get me wrong, I think it's great that Chevrolet is offering a Camaro as impressive as the ZL1 is today. I'd just like to see the performance it offers be as affordable today as it was in the 60's so those of us who love Chevrolet performance are able to experience the exhilaration available today just as easily as we were able to experience it then. I love to see Chevrolet muscle on the road.

I do understand the differences between the costs of automobile manufacturing today and in the 1960's, and I am just dreaming here, but it's always fun to dream.

[Nine Ball]

That $25K ballpark puts you into a new V6 Camaro, which performs about the same as a stock 1969 Z28 does. And does so with better brakes, better interior, better safety, etc...

Just another perspective, from a fellow '69 Camaro owner

[OldJedi]

Everything is relative. In the sixties, gas was thirty cents a gallon and a loaf of bread was twenty-five cents. A little different from $3.00 per gallon of gas now. The past is gone and no one can bring it back other than memories. My 67 Vette will be no where near as sophisticated as the ZL1 that I will purchase at more than double what I paid for the Vette. But it will be nice to go out to the garage and ask, what car do I feel like driving today?

[mr02Z/28]

Obviously you can afford a 2012 Camaro ZL1 but back to basics, what happened to affordable performance ?? i guess that is a thing of the past too.......


Stop the Price Madness !!!!!!!!!!

[RickD]

Originally Posted by OldJedi

Everything is relative. In the sixties, gas was thirty cents a gallon and a loaf of bread was twenty-five cents. A little different from $3.00 per gallon of gas now. The past is gone and no one can bring it back other than memories. My 67 Vette will be no where as sophisticated as the ZL1 that I will purchase at more than double what I paid for the Vette. But it will be nice to out to the garage and ask, what car do I feel like driving today?

Your Corvette is gorgeous!

[LS7ss427]

Originally Posted by GoldenBear

I'm going to to purchase a 2012 ZL1. In fact, I've been wanting to purchase a high performance 5th Gen Camaro since the 2006 Detroit Auto Show. I've just been waiting for Chevrolet to produce the right 5th Gen Camaro for me, and the ZL1 is the right Camaro for me. However, at $50,000 or more, I began thinking a little bit about the value compared to the the value Chevrolet produced in the late 1960's.

My 1969 Z28, purchased from Guardian Chevrolet in Brea, CA, in June of 1969, sold with a MSRP of $4,168.75, which would be (according to the current CPI numbers, and I know that the government CPI is lower than actual real world inflation) $25,083.46 in 2011 dollars.

I may be living in the past, but a ~$50K ZL1 price is about two times the price of my 1969 Z28 in real dollars. I realize that the ZL1, with 40 plus years of technological improvements, is a considerably better and more technologically advanced car than my 1969 Z28, but still, twice the price is a hefty premium to pay.

I liked the idea that in the mid to late 60's the average muscle car aficionado could walk into a Chevy dealer and check the right RPO boxes and order the car of one's dreams without having to spend a king's ransom. IMHO, that was one of the great things about Chevrolet muscle in the 60's, it was affordable. Whereas, today it seems that to be able to afford the type of performance that was available to the average income earner in the 60's, one has to be relatively well off.

Maybe I'm just being nostalgic, and don't get me wrong, I think it's great that Chevrolet is offering a Camaro as impressive as the ZL1 is today. I'd just like to see the performance it offers be as affordable today as it was in the 60's so those of us who love Chevrolet performance are able to experience the exhilaration available today just as easily as we were able to experience it then. I love to see Chevrolet muscle on the road.

I do understand the differences between the costs of automobile manufacturing today and in the 1960's, and I am just dreaming here, but it's always fun to dream.

[OldJedi]

Rick, thank you very much! She is a lot of fun!

[porcupinekiller]

Originally Posted by RickD

Your Corvette is gorgeous!

+1.
C2 Vettes were responsible for my first cargazm. Lol

[Brokinarrow]

Originally Posted by mr02Z/28

Obviously you can afford a 2012 Camaro ZL1 but back to basics, what happened to affordable performance ?? i guess that is a thing of the past too.......


Stop the Price Madness !!!!!!!!!!

um... Camaro 1LT: $25,055 - I'd say that's fairly affordable for the performance you get out of it...

[htron50]

Humorous thread in an OLD GUY kind of way! (Yes, I too, must have a ZL1 but it won't be a discretionary purchase). It's like a necessity type purchase LOL. Thank God my wife is on board. Air sandwiches for a year anyone?

[radz28]

Originally Posted by RickD

Your Corvette is gorgeous!

Originally Posted by htron50

Humorous thread in an OLD GUY kind of way! (Yes, I too, must have a ZL1 but it won't be a discretionary purchase). It's like a necessity type purchase LOL. Thank God my wife is on board. Air sandwiches for a year anyone?

It'll be Top Ramen for this guy for a few years, LOL!


There were great points in the original post. I would've thought the rates were higher; regardless - it's very interesting.

While I certainly agree that I wished prices were lower, if one were to try to compare the technology these cars have, and put them into cars back then, I'm sure the prices would reflect that we're getting great value today.

What I wouldn't give for a $25K ZL1, lol

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by mr02Z/28

Obviously you can afford a 2012 Camaro ZL1 but back to basics, what happened to affordable performance ?? i guess that is a thing of the past too.......


Stop the Price Madness !!!!!!!!!!

Performance is just as affordable now as it was back then, there is just fewer choices. Sure, cars are more expensive than they used to be, but people also get paid a lot more too. Besides, its not as if the original ZL1 was any sort of bargin. Adjusted for inflation, a 1969 ZL1 would cost about $45,000 in todays money. Thats a little under what the 2012 ZL1 is expected to be but it was less of an improvement over base model Camaro's too. If the 2012 ZL1 were decontented down to a base LS Camaro (similar to what the original was like), it would probably be right at $45,000.

[GoldenBear]

Originally Posted by radz28

While I certainly agree that I wished prices were lower, if one were to try to compare the technology these cars have, and put them into cars back then, I'm sure the prices would reflect that we're getting great value today.

What I wouldn't give for a $25K ZL1, lol

Another way to look at the new ZL1 value is if we assume that a nicely equipped ZL1 will have a MSRP of about $55K, then the new ZL1 would have a price in 1969 dollars of $9,141.

For comparison here are some 1969 prices:

Base Camaro: -------------- $2,727
Camaro SS396 (L78) Conv: - $4,428
Shelby GT500 Fastback: ---- $5,565
Cadillac Eldorado: ---------- $6,711
9560 COPO Camaro (ZL1): -- $7,200
Ferrari 365 GTB/4: ---------$19,000

[radz28]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

Performance is just as affordable now as it was back then, there is just fewer choices. Sure, cars are more expensive than they used to be, but people also get paid a lot more too. Besides, its not as if the original ZL1 was any sort of bargin. Adjusted for inflation, a 1969 ZL1 would cost about $45,000 in todays money. Thats a little under what the 2012 ZL1 is expected to be but it was less of an improvement over base model Camaro's too. If the 2012 ZL1 were decontented down to a base LS Camaro (similar to what the original was like), it would probably be right at $45,000.

GREAT point. You know you've got something going on when the engine option is about as much as the car itself...