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Old 12-01-2008, 06:42 AM   #1
devildogcollier
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LS1 VS LT1

Q: exactly how much of a difference does having an ls1 instead of an lt1 make???

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Old 12-01-2008, 12:16 PM   #2
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25-75 hp, and about 10 million aftermarket mods worth of difference.
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Old 12-01-2008, 12:21 PM   #3
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I've had a '95 M6 LT1 and have an '02 A4 LS1 and there is a night and day difference. My LS1, even with a medium-sized stall, will pull up to and would pass 6K RPMs if it had a good valvetrain. My '02, with a lid and catback, had run a best of a like a 13.1 @ 108 when my '95 with some SLP mids', FIPK, and the same CB, ran a best of 13.7 @ 103. both were close to the same weight and I had a tougher time launching the '95 but the trap speed tells the tail of horsepower. Most OEM LT1s were right around 230 to 240 RWHP or so while OEM LS1s were right around 300 to 310. That 50 or 60 RWHP is right about in-line with the differences in trap speed.

The LT1 pulled really well down low but that defficiency has been made-up for, in my case, with the converter.

Don't get me wrong - you can build a great LT1. There's a bunch of stuff out there, but I think because the LS1 was made for longer, with variations in many more cars, there is just a bigger market. The LT1 had special heads, intake, water pump, distributor and a couple other things. Many of these were not compatable with SBC engines because of the reverse-flow cooling. A lot of what made this engine was the head design which did make the first truck Vortec heads a lot better.

Did you have a particular question in mind or just a general idea what the differences were, because aside from the bore spacing and lifters, the two pretty much share no similarities.
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Old 12-01-2008, 01:31 PM   #4
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would it be more beneficial to me to just put money into upgrades and such for my LT1 or would it be cheaper and better in the long run to drop an LS1 in the car with just a few upgrades????? on a budget here..
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Old 12-01-2008, 01:43 PM   #5
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I have an LT1 and an LS1. They are not even comparable. LS1 wins handsdown for reliability and upgradeability.
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Old 12-01-2008, 01:44 PM   #6
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Ouch - good question. Well, you'll spend a lot of money on a retro'. I'd say keep a look out for the current and next couple issues of GMHTP. They are swapping an LS3480 into an '01 Z28. They're replacing the wiring harness too because the previous owner swapped the OEM M6 for an auto and the Rick Jensen (the owner of the car and EAC of GMHTP) has swapped an M6 back in - though the harness was hacked by the previous owner.

For a quick answer, I think a swap would net you better results in the long-run but still cost more. The LT1 is plagued with that Optispark and water pump which are problematic unless you go with Petronix (?sp?) and retro' most of the ignition system. The LS1 doesn't have as big a problem as this although the springs and pushrods don't like going above 6K RPMs.

IMVHO, get the mag' and keep reading and see what they say. You can get a crate motor that's pretty complete and junkyard motors even cheaper and more complete. It might make a swap affordable if you can find the right deal and get all the parts for it.

Keep up posted! I LOVE techy' stuff
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Old 12-01-2008, 05:28 PM   #7
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wow... LS1 biasing lol

its not always easy to compare a 2nd gen motor to a 3rd gen motor. they are both great motors and they both have their downfalls.


the major thing that most people will tell you is that with the LT1 you have to watch out for the Opti-spark distributor. its located on the front of the motor, under the water pump, tho having a 95, you should have the later version of the opti that is vented to prevent failure from moisture. the water pump (when it goes out, which is a rare thing as they are built beefy as crap), has a weep hole on the bottom of it that drips onto the opti when the pump goes out. but the water pump is also driven off a coupling hooked to the cam instead of a regular belt so that in the event of a snapped belt, you can still drive a good distance without overheating the car.

one thing to remember with the opti, is that it can fail and when it does, it fails hard. but its also powered some monstrous motors as well.


that being said, there are ways around the opti terrors, while you can rig up a "retro" (i believe the phrase was) setup with a crank trigger wheel, you can also move forward with an LTCC setup that utilizes LS1 coil on cylinder setup
http://www.bailey-eng.com/LTCC.html

now to your questions....

Quote:
Originally Posted by devildogcollier View Post
would it be more beneficial to me to just put money into upgrades and such for my LT1 or would it be cheaper and better in the long run to drop an LS1 in the car with just a few upgrades????? on a budget here..

what is your budget?

I can tell you right now, it is not worth the trouble to swap to an LS1 in an LT1 car as there is a LOT to swap over. depending on your budget, you can build a mean screaming LT1 for the same price it would cost you to swap to an LS1. and then youd be stuck with a stock LS1 and have to spend even more to upgrade it.


just some things you'll need to swap:
LS1 and V8 Transmission (none of the F-body V6 Transmissions will work behind the V8)
V8 Front Suspension Crossmember (Each engine had different motor mount holes)
Computer
Wiring harness
V8 Heater Hoses
Requires high pressure fuel pump, 58 PSI, and return fuel line.
'97 - '98 Corvette LS1 has a pressure regulator and return line as part of the fuel rail while the Camaro LS1 has the pressure regulator in the tank and only the high pressure line going into the fuel rail.
The Camaro LS1 can be modified by using the '97 - '98 Corvette fuel rail and pressure regulator or by adding an aftermarket inline pressure regulator. A VSS is required for the engine to work properly.
A VATS simulator must be added for the computer to work.
LS1 suspension




just to name a few things...



what have you already done to the car?
what is your budget?
what are your goals?

answer those 3 questions for me and I can get you pointed in the right direction on what to do for your car.
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Old 12-02-2008, 03:02 AM   #8
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another thing i like is the LS1 is all aluminum, not iron. If i had the choice, i would go LS1. I saw a wicked 3rd generation Trans Am that had a stock LS1 under the hood from a 02 Z28. it also had the Z's transmission and rear end as well. He said going from an iron block 350 TPI with 245hp to a aluminum block 360 LSI with 300hp was huge, he said it was like putting nitrous on the TPI engine .
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Old 12-02-2008, 07:29 AM   #9
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what have you already done to the car?
what is your budget?
what are your goals?

right now my car is stock..just some new heads that came with the car. i was thinking that a new ignition, cool air intake and exhaust with a 150 wet shot would get me off to a good start, but like ive said before .... ive never used these engines before, and dont know if thats a good idea or not....i want the everyday driver reliability but i want to steam roll new vettes and stangs !!!! and id like to do it as cheap as possible with decent parts.

help?????????????
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Old 12-02-2008, 11:24 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by devildogcollier View Post
what have you already done to the car?
what is your budget?
what are your goals?

right now my car is stock..just some new heads that came with the car. i was thinking that a new ignition, cool air intake and exhaust with a 150 wet shot would get me off to a good start, but like ive said before .... ive never used these engines before, and dont know if thats a good idea or not....i want the everyday driver reliability but i want to steam roll new vettes and stangs !!!! and id like to do it as cheap as possible with decent parts.

help?????????????

check out www.shbox.com and www.projectlt10.com
to get some background info about the motor/car
stock LT1s can take a healthy dose of nitrous as long as its hooked up properly.

not to mention, what are you going to do when you drain the tank and a mustang rolls up next to you? lol


but for some ideas for consistent power....
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showpo...9&postcount=16
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Old 12-03-2008, 01:42 PM   #11
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uhhhhhhh.... shoot his tires out......duh
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Old 12-03-2008, 02:28 PM   #12
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uhhhhhhh.... shoot his tires out......duh
lmao... tire spikes in the car at all times.
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Old 12-03-2008, 03:08 PM   #13
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You guys are cutting down the LT1 which is wrong it is a great motor I know I owned a 1995 Pontiac Trans Am LT1 (3440 lb curb weight factory)for 10 years and it was a great car LOTS of TOURQUE down low more than the LS1 , I raced a 2003 Nissan 350Z it was a NEW car at the time and my car was 8 years old with 175.000 km on it , at a red light we raced , I was ahead a car lengths within 150 feet then we went up a steep hill and I was ahead at least 2 car lengths then I let go of the thottle because I was doing about 100 miles and hour and it was getting too risky with a corner comming up , anyways I`ll never forget that day , I looked over at the driver of the Z when I was pulling away form him and he couldn`t believe it , my car was bone stock exept for a K&N filter(not cold air type) and Flowmaster exhaust mufflers (only mufflers not full exhaust) then I thought WOW GM rules
My car was rated at 275HP from the factory but everyone knew they were underated since it was a Corvette motor it made closer to 300Hp 330ft tq , that was in 1995 quite respectable considering the Mustang Gts at the time made a weak 260hp , I also raced a Mopar Viper truck with that car but that`s another story ....

Last edited by gladiatoro; 12-03-2008 at 04:56 PM.
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Old 12-03-2008, 03:11 PM   #14
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^^ Nobody is saying the LT1 is bad, we're just saying the LS1 is better. Like I said, I have both and yes the LT1 feels faster but the traps don't lie!
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Old 12-03-2008, 03:15 PM   #15
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The Mustangs in GT form were only making 225 at the time.

The LT1 is a stout motor. Great bang for the buck. Other than a few easily solved factory problems they will go forever and a day, though you may need an intake gasket here and there. That being said, the LS1 is superior in almost every aspect. This is not an attack on the LT1, but a compliment. The LT1 was the predecessor the LS series learned and grew from.
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Old 12-03-2008, 03:21 PM   #16
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Quote:
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The Mustangs in GT form were only making 225 at the time.

The LT1 is a stout motor. Great bang for the buck. Other than a few easily solved factory problems they will go forever and a day, though you may need an intake gasket here and there. That being said, the LS1 is superior in almost every aspect. This is not an attack on the LT1, but a compliment. The LT1 was the predecessor the LS series learned and grew from.
I think you are wrong on that I`m pretty shure the GT made 260hp in 1995 and yes the LS1 is a exellent motor but it came later and at that time the LT1 was the KING motor of muscle cars and it must be respected even today
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Old 12-03-2008, 03:28 PM   #17
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The Mustangs in GT form were only making 225 at the time.

The LT1 is a stout motor. Great bang for the buck. Other than a few easily solved factory problems they will go forever and a day, though you may need an intake gasket here and there. That being said, the LS1 is superior in almost every aspect. This is not an attack on the LT1, but a compliment. The LT1 was the predecessor the LS series learned and grew from.
Actually we are both wrong I just checked on the net , they had 215 hp for a 1995 Mustang GT , that is PATHEDIC and it shows HOW FAR FORD WAS BEHIND GM AND STILL IS TODAY
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Old 12-03-2008, 03:31 PM   #18
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http://www.internetautoguide.com/199...816/index.html

My bad. I was off by ten. A scant 215hp. They didn't get 260hp with the two valve 4.6L until the '00-'04 model run.
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Old 12-03-2008, 04:25 PM   #19
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http://www.internetautoguide.com/199...816/index.html

My bad. I was off by ten. A scant 215hp. They didn't get 260hp with the two valve 4.6L until the '00-'04 model run.
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Old 12-03-2008, 05:50 PM   #20
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http://www.internetautoguide.com/199...816/index.html

My bad. I was off by ten. A scant 215hp. They didn't get 260hp with the two valve 4.6L until the '00-'04 model run.
Imagine - that's exactly HALF of what our SS will have!
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Old 12-04-2008, 08:30 AM   #21
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Imagine - that's exactly HALF of what our SS will have!
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Old 12-04-2008, 10:04 AM   #22
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Fast, cheap and reliable. U can only choose 2.
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Old 12-04-2008, 10:08 AM   #23
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nicely put
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Old 12-04-2008, 10:57 AM   #24
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I have an LT1 and an LS1. They are not even comparable. LS1 wins handsdown for reliability and upgradeability.
I have owned alot of small block fbodies and the LS1 is the best IMO.
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Old 12-04-2008, 12:30 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by BowtieGuy View Post
The Mustangs in GT form were only making 225 at the time.

The LT1 is a stout motor. Great bang for the buck. Other than a few easily solved factory problems they will go forever and a day, though you may need an intake gasket here and there. That being said, the LS1 is superior in almost every aspect. This is not an attack on the LT1, but a compliment. The LT1 was the predecessor the LS series learned and grew from.
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Fast, cheap and reliable. U can only choose 2.
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I have owned alot of small block fbodies and the LS1 is the best IMO.
I didn't mean to come off bashing the LT1 but it is just far superior being a from-scratch design. There are tons of Gen I stuff but not nearly as much Gen II stuff. There's probably at least 3-times as much Gen III aftermarket support as there is for Gen II but you can upgrade one very nicely I'm sorry to sound like I was bashing
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