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Old 12-02-2008, 10:54 AM   #35
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LOL, Sorry Blur, I couldn't resist.

Doesn't mean you will be out of a job, you could always teach.
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Old 12-02-2008, 11:23 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Robinson View Post
Isn't it ironic, Congress asks the three auto makers how they're going to straighten out their financial situation, but no one has the cajones to ask Congress how they intend to straighten out their's. When will we just get our heads out of our bums and drill the damn oil and drive the damn cars we want too! If I want a 430 HP Camaro and I can afford it then damn it I should be able to buy it.
I agree 100%. However, this "bailout" will give more leverage to the idiots in Washington to make the domestic auto industry slaves to Congress' wants and desires.....such as electric tricycles for all of us to drive. Say bye bye to what YOU want to drive and hello to what Congress says you SHOULD drive. What the hell is this...COMMUNISM? I'm beginning to think this country is already half gone, just waiting for the rest of the "fall of Rome".
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Old 12-02-2008, 11:25 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Robinson View Post
Isn't it ironic, Congress asks the three auto makers how they're going to straighten out their financial situation, but no one has the cajones to ask Congress how they intend to straighten out their's. When will we just get our heads out of our bums and drill the damn oil and drive the damn cars we want too! If I want a 430 HP Camaro and I can afford it then damn it I should be able to buy it.
True......but GM doesn't HAVE to build it.
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Old 12-02-2008, 11:45 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by camaro_corvette View Post
LOL, Sorry Blur, I couldn't resist.

Doesn't mean you will be out of a job, you could always teach.
Actually, I can't find anyone looking for a lobbyist, so I'll probably go into sales, assuming there's a business that isn't laying off all their salespeople. :(

I like the Malibu approach. It has been reviewed as superior to so many cars, given numerous awards, and delivers miles per gallon unlike much of the competition. It makes saying no to GM harder.
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Old 12-02-2008, 11:52 AM   #39
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Just reported by AP - "Ford is asking Congress for a $9 billion "stand-by line of credit" to stabilize its business, but says it doesn't expect to tap it.

Unless one of Detroit's other Big Three auto companies goes bust, Ford expects to have enough money to make it through next year, it said in a plan that projected the firm will break even or turn a pretax profit in 2011."

Sounds to me like Ford is trying to separate itself from the two mostly to "fail" and emerge as the only one of the Big 3 that deserves to survive.

Congress doesn't seemed inclined to want to help GM or Chrysler. Ford could be the "last man standing" when all is said and done.
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Old 12-02-2008, 11:54 AM   #40
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I don't think that economically it makes a lot of sense to drive from detroit to dc. Just hop on a regular plane...
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Old 12-02-2008, 12:00 PM   #41
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The Tahoe Hybrid gets 21mpg City / 22mpg Hwy. How does that qualify it as being among the most fuel efficient? The Aveo and Cobalt are among GM's best fuel efficient cars (~26 city / 34 hwy). I'm not sure pulling up in an SUV would send a message of "change" to Congress.
That answer is really pretty simple.

How many people fit into a Tahoe Hybrid versus an Aveo?

Once you figure the capacity of each vehicle into the equation, then the answer is a bit different. Let's take a shot at this.

Tahoe - Seats (assuming a front bench seat) 9 people at 22 mpg hiway you have - 9 x 22 = 198 passenger miles per gallon Hiway

Aveo- Seats 5 people at 34 mpg Hiway you have 5 x 34 = 170 passenger miles per gallon Hiway.

That's 16.4% improved fuel efficiency for the Hybrid Tahoe versus the Aveo.

Sure the numbers change depending on the number of passengers in each vehicle and how the vehicle is driven.

The capacity to move more people per mile is the defining number here.

So I would tend to disagree that a Hybrid Tahoe is not fuel efficient when loaded to capacity in comparison to the Aveo.
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Old 12-02-2008, 12:04 PM   #42
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What about a Malibu hybrid? That would be nice
Way to go Camaropete....you called it!
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Old 12-02-2008, 12:07 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diddiyo View Post
I don't think that economically it makes a lot of sense to drive from detroit to dc. Just hop on a regular plane...
Really? The Malibu Hybrid gets 34mpg (EPA) on the freeway. It should burn just over 15 gallons of gas to cover the 520 miles from Detroit to DC. At today's average regular gas price, that's about $28. How's that not cheaper than taking a plane?

Just think about this: You can drive a Malibu Hybrid from Detroit to DC on a single tank of gas (tank holds 16 gallons). 544 mile range.
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Old 12-02-2008, 12:10 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by rolnslo View Post
Really? The Malibu Hybrid gets 34mpg (EPA) on the freeway. It should burn just over 15 gallons of gas to cover the 520 miles from Detroit to DC. At today's average regular gas price, that's about $28. How's that not cheaper than taking a plane?
When was the last time you bought a last-minute plane ticket? I just did a search for pricing and came up with about 10 times the cost in pump gas.

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Old 12-02-2008, 12:40 PM   #45
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I was going to SAY MALIBU HYBRID......but the suburbans were lurking yesterday....I'm not one of "those guys"...
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Old 12-02-2008, 01:13 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by rolnslo View Post
Just think about this: You can drive a Malibu Hybrid from Detroit to DC on a single tank of gas (tank holds 16 gallons). 544 mile range.
what about the time a CEO is wasting in the car and not being able to work? Ok, now that his salary will most likely be $1 it doesn't really matter, but before that it's a point to think about imo.
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Old 12-02-2008, 01:53 PM   #47
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what about the time a CEO is wasting in the car and not being able to work? Ok, now that his salary will most likely be $1 it doesn't really matter, but before that it's a point to think about imo.
Actually, if he'd use his company supplied regular driver (who's getting paid whether he's sitting in Detroit or driving to DC) to drive him to DC, he'd have a full 9 hours to work. A cell phone and a wireless cellular card in his laptop would keep him connected. Or perhaps he could spend the time just thinking about the best way to turn the Titanic before it hits the proverbial iceberg.

Compare that to taking a regular flight on a airplane:
  1. Drive to airport - 30 minutes. (Time used 30 minutes)
  2. Arrive 1.5 hours early to check in and clear security - 1.5 hours wasted. (Time used 2.0 hours)
  3. Flight time from Detroit to DC - 1.5 hours. (No phone/internet) (Time used 3.5 hours)
  4. Taxi to gate, disembark, get to taxi stand - 30 minutes wasted. (Time used 4.0 hours)
  5. Take taxi from airport to the lions pit (Senate) - 30 minutes. (Time used 4.5 hours)

On his own plane, sure it makes more sense that he's wasting time if he drives but if you make him go on a regular flight....

Does it really matter anyhow? He's already in DC.
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Old 12-02-2008, 02:16 PM   #48
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I heard that the CEO's agreed to $1/yr if they get the loan. Any other updates?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rallysport View Post
I agree 100%. However, this "bailout" will give more leverage to the idiots in Washington to make the domestic auto industry slaves to Congress' wants and desires.....such as electric tricycles for all of us to drive. Say bye bye to what YOU want to drive and hello to what Congress says you SHOULD drive. What the hell is this...COMMUNISM? I'm beginning to think this country is already half gone, just waiting for the rest of the "fall of Rome".
Nope. Communism is (theoretically) everyone owning everything. What you describe is a totalitarian system. There are ways to have a totalitarian government without communism, for example: fascism.


Back on topic
GM CEO drives a Hybrid Malibu to D.C
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Old 12-02-2008, 02:17 PM   #49
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Mulally drove an Escape Hybrid.

Wagoner drove a Malibu Hybrid.
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Old 12-02-2008, 02:47 PM   #50
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Autoblog - http://www.autoblog.com/2008/12/02/m...r-federal-aid/

"Chrysler CEO Bob Nardelli was the only auto exec who readily offered to work for a buck if it meant securing federal aid from Congress in the form of bridge loans. Ford CEO Alan Mulally famously told the politicians sitting before him, "I think I'm OK where I am." We would be OK too with the tens of millions of dollars that Mulally has received as compensation so far from Ford. GM CEO Rick Wagoner was described as being "demur" when asked about lowering his salary to a $1.

Now it seems that the boy from Boeing and the Ricker are reconsidering their previous reluctance to take a pay cut. The Detroit Free Press is reporting that both CEOs are prepared to tell Congress on Thursday that they would be willing to work for $1 if it meant getting the approval of Congress for federal loans.

Congress had previously demanded the each of the Detroit 3 automakers submit a detailed plan to Congress outlining how they would use the federal loans to return to profitability and ensure the long term viability of their companies. Ford is the first to turn their homework in, which reveals the Blue Oval expects to be making money again in 2011 and will have an all-electric sedan on sale by then. All it's asking in return is a $9 billion slice of the $25 billion federal aid package that would only be used if necessary. Ford already has enough credit to survive through 2010 and only envisions needing the fed's money if something happens to either GM or Chrysler.

[Source: Detroit Free Press]"
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Old 12-02-2008, 02:59 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rolnslo View Post
Actually, if he'd use his company supplied regular driver (who's getting paid whether he's sitting in Detroit or driving to DC) to drive him to DC, he'd have a full 9 hours to work. A cell phone and a wireless cellular card in his laptop would keep him connected. Or perhaps he could spend the time just thinking about the best way to turn the Titanic before it hits the proverbial iceberg.

Compare that to taking a regular flight on a airplane:
  1. Drive to airport - 30 minutes. (Time used 30 minutes)
  2. Arrive 1.5 hours early to check in and clear security - 1.5 hours wasted. (Time used 2.0 hours)
  3. Flight time from Detroit to DC - 1.5 hours. (No phone/internet) (Time used 3.5 hours)
  4. Taxi to gate, disembark, get to taxi stand - 30 minutes wasted. (Time used 4.0 hours)
  5. Take taxi from airport to the lions pit (Senate) - 30 minutes. (Time used 4.5 hours)

On his own plane, sure it makes more sense that he's wasting time if he drives but if you make him go on a regular flight....

Does it really matter anyhow? He's already in DC.
I checked with a couple airlines and a first class flight from detroit on a 1 day notice (if the airline is not booked up) is aproximately $1,200.00. and you forgot that many times a flight is delayed or that to get the earliest flight you may have to change planes and have a layover. even more time delay.. so in a corporate world where time is very expensive to waste, a private plane is more important than saving a few bucks by using commercial airlines. BUT nothing says they can't downsize their jet to a smaller twin engine Cessna.... Flight time may take a little longer but it would be available at a moments notice.
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