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Old 08-21-2010, 02:17 PM   #1
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2010 Camaro ECM a Restricted Part

So 8 days ago my car had a big FAIL and was running on reduced power. I had it towed to a local dealership (Putnam in Burlingame, CA). They changed the throttle body but were unable to solve the problem.

They consulted the GM Engineers and were told to swap out the ECM. The maintenance person called me and told me it should be in within two days. I call back two days later and she tells me the part has not arrived. I call the next day and she tells me it is a restricted part and their own people needed to get permission from GM to order the part.

I am, at this point utterly disgusted and head down to the dealership to get my rental car issued. She tells me that they do not know when the part will arrive. I ask if it will be two weeks before I get my car and she says it may be that long.

I am driving a crappy HHR and seriously thinking of ditching the Camaro or an Infinity G37.

This is why I have not purchased an American made vehicle since 1989. Something told me to not do it but my love for the Camaro over rode my better judgment. Now I am stuck researching California Lemon Laws and I am thrilled to see I will have to get an attorney to get what is rightfully mine if GM continues to FAIL.
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Old 08-21-2010, 02:23 PM   #2
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Okay, now, how many times has this happened?

You have been given a vehicle to use in the mean time. How does this provide an undue hardship?

Sorry, about the initial problem. But, think straight about what is going on.

Threatening to play the " I need an attorney card." is a bit over reacting here.

Better the car protects the vitals than blowing up somewhere and really doing some major damage.
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Old 08-21-2010, 02:26 PM   #3
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Okay, now, how many times has this happened?

You have been given a vehicle to use in the mean time. How does this provide an undue hardship?

Sorry, about the initial problem. But, think straight about what is going on.

Threatening to play the " I need an attorney card." is a bit over reacting here.

Better the car protects the vitals than blowing up somewhere and really doing some major damage.

THIS.


S^%T happens OP. New cars break once and awhile. They will get it taken care of for you. (It does seem crazy they can't get a part before then)
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Old 08-21-2010, 02:28 PM   #4
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Restricted part just means they have to dial a phone number to order it. Shouldn't be that earth shattering. Too many dealer just throw ECMs at every electrical problem, so they make sure they are doing the diagnostics correctly before sending the part.
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Old 08-21-2010, 02:29 PM   #5
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This is the guys second thread on the same problem. No matter what happens, he will be in a G37, regardless.

Nothing they could do will be right. Sheesh.
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Old 08-21-2010, 04:24 PM   #6
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This is the guys second thread on the same problem. No matter what happens, he will be in a G37, regardless.

Nothing they could do will be right. Sheesh.
Don't get me wrong. The dealership was great at the outset. Friendly and helpful people who offered up a rental at the time. I declined but now that I am back to work (summer vacation is over) I need a vehicle.

My upset comes from the fact that I have owned eight cars since 1989 and none of them have had an issue like this one (Toyotas and Nissans). Further, every one of the service departments was able to get parts for the cars, and a few of them have needed ECMs replaced after being driven for over 50,000 miles.

The issue here is I have paid $48,000+ CASH for the car, owned it since early March and only driven it 2700 miles.

The dealership said they needed permission to request the ECM. That I get. What I do not understand is the length of time to receive the part. Then we still do not know if the replaced ECM will do the trick.

Additionally, I LOVE this car but I do not want to have a vehicle that is going to present itself as an issue. If you had a pair of shoes that were constantly malfunctioning/ defective and you paid a lot of money for them you would be upset and more than likely switch brands.

I truly hope the dealership can rectify the presenting difficulties. However, I also want to be prepared for the inevitability that the car cannot be repaired.
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Old 08-21-2010, 04:35 PM   #7
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You paid $48,000 for the car? Whoa. I've heard this story before from other people. Their Asian car is a piece of crap and it's ok because they were so smart for buying foreign. The buy a big 3 car, have a problem and are screaming mad and never buying American again. Every manufacturer of every product turns out a lemon now and then. 1 ECM issue does not a lemon make. Good luck with that lawyer and the massive depreciation from $48000 when you trade for your new car. Peace
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Old 08-21-2010, 04:38 PM   #8
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You can sell it to me for 25k and go get a new toyota
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Old 08-21-2010, 04:41 PM   #9
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$48,000???????????

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Old 08-21-2010, 04:43 PM   #10
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Don't get me wrong. The dealership was great at the outset. Friendly and helpful people who offered up a rental at the time. I declined but now that I am back to work (summer vacation is over) I need a vehicle.

My upset comes from the fact that I have owned eight cars since 1989 and none of them have had an issue like this one (Toyotas and Nissans). Further, every one of the service departments was able to get parts for the cars, and a few of them have needed ECMs replaced after being driven for over 50,000 miles.

The issue here is I have paid $48,000+ CASH for the car, owned it since early March and only driven it 2700 miles.

The dealership said they needed permission to request the ECM. That I get. What I do not understand is the length of time to receive the part. Then we still do not know if the replaced ECM will do the trick.

Additionally, I LOVE this car but I do not want to have a vehicle that is going to present itself as an issue. If you had a pair of shoes that were constantly malfunctioning/ defective and you paid a lot of money for them you would be upset and more than likely switch brands.

I truly hope the dealership can rectify the presenting difficulties. However, I also want to be prepared for the inevitability that the car cannot be repaired.
I don't blame you, I'd be pissed too.
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Old 08-21-2010, 04:46 PM   #11
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so you get 8 cars and no prob? then your doing fine..what if you had 8 american cars and no breakdowns...then 1 car..(lets say toyota) goes down...then would life be better?? good luck with your ecm..
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Old 08-21-2010, 04:49 PM   #12
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If you are REALLY interested in your Camaro, then be patient. Yes the ECM is a difficult part and swapping it out is a huge deal. If I understand it properly the car won't run by simply changing it. If you aren't happy with the dealers service, please feel free to call GM Customer Service at 1-866-509-9090. Get an SR number and if it isn't resolved, PM me and I'll be glad to escalate your issue internally.

But if you are simply upset that you over paid and want to blame GM, I can't help you. I would suggest that you zoom over to the enthusiast site for the Infinit and listen to how many perfect fault free cars they are talking about.

No excuses as we try to deliver cars that have no issues at all. That is our objective. Unfortunately the modern automobile is a hugely comlex mechanism and sometimes we don't meet our objective.

If you are a true Camaro enthusiast, give it a bit.

If you are just a guy who jumped on the coolest new car and overpaid to do it and want to scream GM/American car fail, then I can't help you much. But I did work for Nissan, I have friends that are still there and you know what? There cars have this same problem from time to time.

You've got 80 some posts, so I'm hoping you are an enthusiast, love the Camaro and will simply call the phone number I gave you above.
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Old 08-21-2010, 04:56 PM   #13
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If you are REALLY interested in your Camaro, then be patient. Yes the ECM is a difficult part and swapping it out is a huge deal. If I understand it properly the car won't run by simply changing it. If you aren't happy with the dealers service, please feel free to call GM Customer Service at 1-866-509-9090. Get an SR number and if it isn't resolved, PM me and I'll be glad to escalate your issue internally.

But if you are simply upset that you over paid and want to blame GM, I can't help you. I would suggest that you zoom over to the enthusiast site for the Infinit and listen to how many perfect fault free cars they are talking about.

No excuses as we try to deliver cars that have no issues at all. That is our objective. Unfortunately the modern automobile is a hugely comlex mechanism and sometimes we don't meet our objective.

If you are a true Camaro enthusiast, give it a bit.

If you are just a guy who jumped on the coolest new car and overpaid to do it and want to scream GM/American car fail, then I can't help you much. But I did work for Nissan, I have friends that are still there and you know what? There cars have this same problem from time to time.

You've got 80 some posts, so I'm hoping you are an enthusiast, love the Camaro and will simply call the phone number I gave you above.


I had a 2007 Audi that I traded in on my Camaro... My Audi went through oil like crazy, they said it was normal for the turbo.... (a quart a month)

The brakes were replaced twice, the ECM once, the entire AC unit replaced, and had to have the stereo replaced.... When the Audi was traded in it had 27,000 miles...
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Old 08-21-2010, 05:31 PM   #14
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I seen this personality type before. Lemme guess, your a doctor or a lawyer. Maybe a professor. You dollars are larger than everone elses. Your time is so much more valuable than everyone elses. And how dare they sell you a car that could possibly have a bad ECM (that was build by a subcontractor by the way). 1 in a 1000 failures( which is 0.1%) and you are ready to damn GM to utter failures as car designers.

Sounds like maybe Chevy and Toyato-mato may be very much beneath you. May I suggest BMW, Jag maybe?
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Old 08-21-2010, 05:32 PM   #15
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My honda van has had more warrantee repairs in three years than my dodge truck in seven.
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Old 08-21-2010, 05:36 PM   #16
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I waited 3 months for a Radiator and AC hoses. I know your pain. Follow this procedure

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71421

They helped me by escalating within internal departments. Also, make sure you have them open a SPAC case for the ECM.
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Old 08-21-2010, 06:10 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by dplyttle View Post
My upset comes from the fact that I have owned eight cars since 1989 and none of them have had an issue like this one (Toyotas and Nissans). Further, every one of the service departments was able to get parts for the cars, and a few of them have needed ECMs replaced after being driven for over 50,000 miles.
Hey man... I don't want you to think that I am trivializing your anger but take a step back, a deep breath, and realize it will be alright.

Every car today is so computer integrated that it does not take much for things to fail. Hell, if one component in your ecm ended up with a cold solder joint and broke loose it would cause the whole thing to fail. My guess would be if that is the case it was an exception, not the rule, they replace the unit and life goes on.

And seriously, you are only kidding yourself if you think that somehow an Infinity is any less prone to weird computer failures. I could blow your mind with how a computer problem on my friends G35 resulted in the dealership having to replace the entire transmission because of the level of computer integration. Or even better, I knew a guy who purchased an E55 when they were first released. Before he picked it up from the dealership he had the OEM Mercedes hands free car kit installed by the dealership. Because of something that happened during the install (no one ever fully figured out why but they suspected a short) they ended up having to replace every computer in the car including the brake controller because of the level of integration (which btw took 2 months just to get the parts out of Germany). Or look at what is happening right now with the Civic hybrids where as of now a bad computer program looks to be responsible for killing the battery pack. So it does happen to everyone.

So to say that this in any way means that American cars are less reliable is beyond a bit of a stretch. Especially since if it is in fact a computer related issue there are only a handful of ECU manufacturers out there that most car companies use (Delphi and Bosch being the largest) and most of the actual ECU's are made in china anyhow. The reality is there is a very good chance that the Infinity you want had a computer made in the same factory or compound as the ECU in your Camaro.

Also, do yourself a favor and back off on the Lemon law nonsense right now. GM has not failed yet as you put it. I know you are upset, but you don't qualify right now so don't even head down that road. If you start barking at the dealership (who seems to be trying hard to help you) about lawyers and lemons you are just setting yourself up for a road of pain. They will loose all desire to work with you because they will see you as difficult and confrontational, rather that reasonable and rational.

Oh, and if you have been purchasing Toyotas and Nissan's since the 90's there is a very good chance the cars you have owned were made in America.
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Old 08-21-2010, 11:22 PM   #18
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Don't get me wrong. The dealership was great at the outset. Friendly and helpful people who offered up a rental at the time. I declined but now that I am back to work (summer vacation is over) I need a vehicle. My upset comes from the fact that I have owned eight cars since 1989 and none of them have had an issue like this one (Toyotas and Nissans). Further, every one of the service departments was able to get parts for the cars, and a few of them have needed ECMs replaced after being driven for over 50,000 miles. The issue here is I have paid $48,000+ CASH for the car, owned it since early March and only driven it 2700 miles. The dealership said they needed permission to request the ECM. That I get. What I do not understand is the length of time to receive the part. Then we still do not know if the replaced ECM will do the trick. Additionally, I LOVE this car but I do not want to have a vehicle that is going to present itself as an issue. If you had a pair of shoes that were constantly malfunctioning/ defective and you paid a lot of money for them you would be upset and more than likely switch brands. I truly hope the dealership can rectify the presenting difficulties. However, I also want to be prepared for the inevitability that the car cannot be repaired.
Um what are you doing that has required a few ECM's? I change cars every time they hit about 100k and have one ECM issue. It was on my Prius and blew out with the bank of batteries. That was a 5k repair they tried to stick me with when the towtruck operator they sent when I called their road side assistance supposedly hooked it up backwards to try and jump it. He didnt by the way we both read the owners manual before hand. The tong shorted itself which is why it was dead to begin with. On the other hand I have owned 3 GM's. I had an air-conditioning compressor go at 75k on a Sonoma and I had a silverado that didn't need new brake pads until 90k and that was with towing a boat almost every weekend. My wife still drives a Toyota and we didnt have another problem with the prius. Its a crap shoot and sometimes you get a bad roll. If you look at actual repair stats GM is on par with Toyota and Honda. Nissan ie Infinity has a worse track record just so you know. Sorry for feeding
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Old 08-22-2010, 12:14 AM   #19
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If you are REALLY interested in your Camaro, then be patient. Yes the ECM is a difficult part and swapping it out is a huge deal. If I understand it properly the car won't run by simply changing it. If you aren't happy with the dealers service, please feel free to call GM Customer Service at 1-866-509-9090. Get an SR number and if it isn't resolved, PM me and I'll be glad to escalate your issue internally.

But if you are simply upset that you over paid and want to blame GM, I can't help you. I would suggest that you zoom over to the enthusiast site for the Infinit and listen to how many perfect fault free cars they are talking about.

No excuses as we try to deliver cars that have no issues at all. That is our objective. Unfortunately the modern automobile is a hugely comlex mechanism and sometimes we don't meet our objective.

If you are a true Camaro enthusiast, give it a bit.

If you are just a guy who jumped on the coolest new car and overpaid to do it and want to scream GM/American car fail, then I can't help you much. But I did work for Nissan, I have friends that are still there and you know what? There cars have this same problem from time to time.

You've got 80 some posts, so I'm hoping you are an enthusiast, love the Camaro and will simply call the phone number I gave you above.
Thanks for the information! I will definitely call the number you provided.

I am not upset that I paid the money for the car. I had it saved up and had planned for the expense. I am dismayed that the car I have planned on getting since the 5th Gen was debuted is in the shop for an undisclosed amount of time to fix an issue within the first 5 months of ownership.

My first car was a 1976 LT 350 and I love the Camaro. However, I find it highly unusual that the dealership can give me no time line whatsoever as to when they expect to take receipt of the ECM. That, more than anything, is what bothers me.

As for the other folks who, to paraphrase, say I should suck it up; I challenge you to hand your car over to the dealership with absolutely no time line for getting your car back and still be happy as two cousins in West Virginia!
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Old 08-22-2010, 12:44 AM   #20
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Thanks for the information! I will definitely call the number you provided.

I am not upset that I paid the money for the car. I had it saved up and had planned for the expense. I am dismayed that the car I have planned on getting since the 5th Gen was debuted is in the shop for an undisclosed amount of time to fix an issue within the first 5 months of ownership.

My first car was a 1976 LT 350 and I love the Camaro. However, I find it highly unusual that the dealership can give me no time line whatsoever as to when they expect to take receipt of the ECM. That, more than anything, is what bothers me.

As for the other folks who, to paraphrase, say I should suck it up; I challenge you to hand your car over to the dealership with absolutely no time line for getting your car back and still be happy as two cousins in West Virginia!
I have had the pleasure in having to deal with GM about getting a ECM for a Camaro. It's not GM that is causing most of the problem getting the ECM to you. It is more then likely the maker of it "Bosch". There is a LONG questionaire the dealer needs to do then that info will be sent to the engineer's over at Bosch. Like some have said alot of techs just replace ECM's and that never fixes the problem so they put stuff on a restriction to make sure EVERYTHING is checked and tested before a new ECM is shipped.
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Old 08-22-2010, 12:50 AM   #21
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I have had the pleasure in having to deal with GM about getting a ECM for a Camaro. It's not GM that is causing most of the problem getting the ECM to you. It is more then likely the maker of it "Bosch". There is a LONG questionaire the dealer needs to do then that info will be sent to the engineer's over at Bosch. Like some have said alot of techs just replace ECM's and that never fixes the problem so they put stuff on a restriction to make sure EVERYTHING is checked and tested before a new ECM is shipped.
He didn't buy his car from Bosch - and I've never had one issue with any Bosch product I've ever owned in terms of getting it fixed.

The OP has a legitimate complaint, why does everyone feel the need to take up for GM?
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Old 08-22-2010, 05:39 AM   #22
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I had an ecm problem like yours when i first got my car. Was one of the first batch camaros #5363

Took about a month to change out the ECM because there was no parts available because car was so new. They changed it and it ran great! Plus they paid one month of my car payment.
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Old 08-22-2010, 10:02 AM   #23
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Untill God gets into the car biz, things will happen. The best engineered, built and tested component in the world will still have a failure rate. Be patient, and in time you will forget that you had any problems.
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Old 08-22-2010, 11:05 AM   #24
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He didn't buy his car from Bosch - and I've never had one issue with any Bosch product I've ever owned in terms of getting it fixed.

The OP has a legitimate complaint, why does everyone feel the need to take up for GM?
I didn't say the car was bought from Bosch. The PART is made by bosch and they CAN put restriction on there parts.
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Old 08-22-2010, 11:12 AM   #25
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The dealership needs to be more transparent here. Ask them what, EXACTLY, the problem is with your PCM. If they get all shifty and act like it's over your head, you can bet that you need to be talking to another service dept because they are the ones causing your massive delay and lack of info.

If they do give a straight response and tell you that they are very sorry but they can't get the part, simply let them know that you are escalating the issue and hope to have a resolution as soon as possible. If you aren't happy with your rental, let them know! Tell them that you want a more comparable vehicle.

What you shouldn't do is go throwing around your 48,000 number. Just because you paid 10 grand too much for your car doesnt make it a more reliable purchase. That money went straight to your dealership.
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