Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com
 
Emblempros
Go Back   Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com > Members Area > General Automotive + Other Cars Discussion


Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 06-11-2007, 11:23 AM   #1
KILLER74Z28
MOD SQUAD
 
KILLER74Z28's Avatar
 
Drives: 2G1FT1EW9A9100666
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: West Michigan
Posts: 5,730
Toyota plant workers make case for unionization

Toyota plant workers make case for unionization
June 11, 2007

By JEFFREY McMURRAY

ASSOCIATED PRESS

GEORGETOWN, Ky. — Current and former workers at Toyota’s Kentucky plant shared stories Sunday about low wages and poor working conditions — rallying points many in the assembly line hope will ultimately lead to unionization.

About 200 people — many of them workers at the Georgetown plant that produces the Camry — attended the meeting of the Kentucky Workers’ Rights Board, a panel of religious and civic leaders pushing for better labor conditions.

Like foreign-owned auto companies across the South, Toyota is nonunion, but the leaders on the board sympathize with the workers, and many contend that should change.

“We are people of community, and part of our community has said to us that things are not exactly the way they need to be in the work situation at Toyota,” said the Rev. John Rausch, coordinator of peace and justice at the Catholic Diocese in Lexington. “We are not trying to tear Toyota down. We are trying to make it better and have a better partner in community.”

Two current employees and two fired ones described what they said were extraordinary steps taken by the company to prevent union organization.

Toyota officials didn’t immediately return calls seeking comment.

The Workers’ Rights Board, which includes Democratic state Reps. Reginald Meeks and Jim Glenn, has no influence over policy or personnel matters at Toyota.

However, after the hearing, it issued several recommendations — including changes in the peer-review process and a 90-day probation period for temporary workers, who would become permanent after that time.

A major focus of the hearing, which lasted more than two hours, was the company’s use of temporary workers, who some of the employees said were doing the same amount of work as the full-timers for half the pay.

“They’re trying to get a job there,” said Cornelia James, who has worked at Toyota for 19 years. “Full-time employment is dangled in front of them like a carrot, and they’re told, any missteps, and you’re out.”

Noel Riddell, who was fired this year after a decade of service at the plant, said he was disciplined after discussing with coworkers a document he found detailing a plan for wages. He was fired despite being backed by a peer-review process, Riddell said.

“What was my crime? Knowledge,” he said. “I will not go quietly.”
Others discussed alleged incidents of sexual harassment and workers being discharged after on-the-job injuries.

“Today, U.S. autoworkers are analogous to professional athletes,” said William Maloney of the University of Kentucky’s Center for Labor Education and Research. “You’re trading your body for a paycheck, and it’s not right.”

.
KILLER74Z28 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2007, 02:50 PM   #2
Silverado
GM Guy For Life
 
Drives: 2010 GMC Yukon XL
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Omaha, NE
Posts: 971
As much as I'm against unions (they have outlived their usefulness), and as much as it will give more power to the UAW, I kind of hope it happens...to Toyota and the other foreign car companies...then their costs will go up and the prices of their cars will have to go up.

Then, you will see better competition and much more of the "buy American" attitudes popping up. Good for American auto companies and good for America.
Silverado is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2007, 05:51 PM   #3
z28camaro2471
C5 Member #227
 
z28camaro2471's Avatar
 
Drives: Camaros
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: NY
Posts: 808
I agree. I hate unions. They served their purpose post industrial revolution when people had to work 12 hour days 7 days a week. But I'd damn love to see this happen to Toyota/Honda/Hyundai etc. Plus all the bad press this hopefully bring for the foreign manufacturers. Then all we need is lots of recalls and drops in quality surveys. This will be good for them! Go USA!!
z28camaro2471 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2007, 09:28 PM   #4
Mr. Wyndham
I used to be Dragoneye...
 
Mr. Wyndham's Avatar
 
Drives: 2014 1LE...Drove: 2012 ZL1
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Buffalo, NY
Posts: 28,002
Send a message via AIM to Mr. Wyndham
Personally, I think Unions still have their place here. Nowhere near as much as they did - but they are still needed i.e. UAW, United teachers association(I think it's called), and a select few others. Toyota can give crappy conditions because there is no large body(union) preventing them. It's time the foriegners learned how America was built - smack them right in the face the filthy, slimy, rats!
__________________
"Keep the faith." - - Read Twice Before You Post.
...Anxiously waiting to order a silver "Z"...

Mr. Wyndham is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2007, 10:41 PM   #5
Eisenhower
I drank what?
 
Eisenhower's Avatar
 
Drives: DANGEROUSLY
Join Date: May 2007
Location: check your back seat...
Posts: 416
Then what? They'll move to Canada, Mexico and Australia and build their cars there for sale in the U.S. Just like GM is doing. Everytime you look up, one of the big 3 is closing down a plant while the Japanese and other Asian automakers are opening up plants. Today, it's hard to say what is an "American" car and what isn't.

In 1968, you could buy a brand new Camaro, fully loaded for around $2800 and some change. Can't do that today. Unions are played out and force the price of the automobile sky-high. IMO
Eisenhower is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2007, 10:44 PM   #6
Mr. Wyndham
I used to be Dragoneye...
 
Mr. Wyndham's Avatar
 
Drives: 2014 1LE...Drove: 2012 ZL1
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Buffalo, NY
Posts: 28,002
Send a message via AIM to Mr. Wyndham
I can tell what's american, and what's not. DESIGN. GM designed the camaro, and all their other cars. MOST of their parts are built here, and MOST, if not all profits come back to their Hq in detroit. Regardless of where it's built, it's american still - what the future holds, well....
__________________
"Keep the faith." - - Read Twice Before You Post.
...Anxiously waiting to order a silver "Z"...

Mr. Wyndham is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2007, 01:37 AM   #7
TAG UR IT
www.Camaro5store.com
 
TAG UR IT's Avatar
 
Drives: 2014 ZL1 #705
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: SA, Texas
Posts: 26,570
Quote:
Originally Posted by KILLER74Z28 View Post
“We are not trying to tear Toyota down. We are trying to make it better and have a better partner in community.”
NOOOOO!!!! TEAR IT DOWN!!!!
TAG UR IT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2007, 09:52 AM   #8
Mr. Wyndham
I used to be Dragoneye...
 
Mr. Wyndham's Avatar
 
Drives: 2014 1LE...Drove: 2012 ZL1
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Buffalo, NY
Posts: 28,002
Send a message via AIM to Mr. Wyndham
Quote:
Originally Posted by TAG UR IT View Post
NOOOOO!!!! TEAR IT DOWN!!!!
__________________
"Keep the faith." - - Read Twice Before You Post.
...Anxiously waiting to order a silver "Z"...

Mr. Wyndham is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2007, 01:37 PM   #9
3whiterag
GM Powertrain Retired
 
3whiterag's Avatar
 
Drives: 67SS350, 87 IROC L98, 96SS ver
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Niagara, Canada
Posts: 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eisenhower View Post
Then what? They'll move to Canada, Mexico and Australia and build their cars there for sale in the U.S. Just like GM is doing. Everytime you look up, one of the big 3 is closing down a plant while the Japanese and other Asian automakers are opening up plants. Today, it's hard to say what is an "American" car and what isn't.

In 1968, you could buy a brand new Camaro, fully loaded for around $2800 and some change. Can't do that today. Unions are played out and force the price of the automobile sky-high. IMO
GM has been in Canada for a very long time! As a matter of fact, GM is made up of many Canadian car companies that were amalgamated to form GM. If you are confused as to what is American as in "North American", then I suggest you look at total North American content of the vehicle in order to establish it. Content made in North America and not just brought in and assembled here.
Back in 1968, people were lucky to be making $80.00 per week! If you compare the ratio of then and now, I bet they are pretty close!
3whiterag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2007, 01:43 PM   #10
3whiterag
GM Powertrain Retired
 
3whiterag's Avatar
 
Drives: 67SS350, 87 IROC L98, 96SS ver
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Niagara, Canada
Posts: 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by z28camaro2471 View Post
I agree. I hate unions. They served their purpose post industrial revolution when people had to work 12 hour days 7 days a week. But I'd damn love to see this happen to Toyota/Honda/Hyundai etc. Plus all the bad press this hopefully bring for the foreign manufacturers. Then all we need is lots of recalls and drops in quality surveys. This will be good for them! Go USA!!

I hate non unions! See how silly that sounds.
3whiterag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2007, 04:25 PM   #11
Eisenhower
I drank what?
 
Eisenhower's Avatar
 
Drives: DANGEROUSLY
Join Date: May 2007
Location: check your back seat...
Posts: 416
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3whiterag View Post
GM has been in Canada for a very long time! As a matter of fact, GM is made up of many Canadian car companies that were amalgamated to form GM. If you are confused as to what is American as in "North American", then I suggest you look at total North American content of the vehicle in order to establish it. Content made in North America and not just brought in and assembled here.
Relax. I'm not hating on Canada. GO CANADA! woot! woot! <--(see)

So as long as the product's "content" is, let's say... more than 50% made in America, it's North American! Or nothing less than 80%... maybe that'll do it? Or perhaps it doesn't have anything to do with "content", rather "citizenship". If you're an American that owns a company with a product, you could "outsource" the whole darn thing to be produced in another country and it would still be "American", just foreign made. Just ask some American businessmen coming back from China.

"Made in America" or "Assembled in America"... I guess it matters who's pockets its lining.
Eisenhower is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2007, 07:43 PM   #12
3whiterag
GM Powertrain Retired
 
3whiterag's Avatar
 
Drives: 67SS350, 87 IROC L98, 96SS ver
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Niagara, Canada
Posts: 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eisenhower View Post
Relax. I'm not hating on Canada. GO CANADA! woot! woot! <--(see)

So as long as the product's "content" is, let's say... more than 50% made in America, it's North American! Or nothing less than 80%... maybe that'll do it? Or perhaps it doesn't have anything to do with "content", rather "citizenship". If you're an American that owns a company with a product, you could "outsource" the whole darn thing to be produced in another country and it would still be "American", just foreign made. Just ask some American businessmen coming back from China.

"Made in America" or "Assembled in America"... I guess it matters who's pockets its lining.
"Made in America" or "Assembled in America"... I guess it matters who's pockets its lining.
I would venture to guess that it is safe to say, if it is assembled in North America, then the money is going elsewhere, out of the country.
Sorry if I came on too strong, but I do get more than a little defensive when talking about GM.
3whiterag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2007, 08:37 PM   #13
z28camaro2471
C5 Member #227
 
z28camaro2471's Avatar
 
Drives: Camaros
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: NY
Posts: 808
3whiterag, everyone is entitled to their opinions. I wasn't trying to offend you. I don't think your comment sounded silly. If I were in a union, I probably would be pro-union. From the outside looking in, it's pretty easy to see that unions helped put GM in the situation they are in now. From the inside looking out, you have obvious biases.

Yes, unions served a purpose and at one point were critical to establishing worker's rights, rights that even I as a non-union worker enjoy. However, unions got greedy. How else can you explain people who empty garbage cans and sweep floors for $20.00/hr? Or assembly quotas where people can get paid for 8 hours, but only work 4 hours and play cards the rest of the night? Right here at Delphi in Rochester, NY. Of course they sold the plant here given their lack of profitability.

I know people in unions, in fact I know people who currently work for GM.
I could share plenty of stories. But you don't need me to tell them to you, I'm sure you see them first hand.

Nothing personal man, but we both know that if they established unions at the Toyota plants it would be bad for Toyota, which would be good for GM, so I guess when it comes to them, I'm pro-union. Maybe I don't hate unions after all.

I think I'm going to have some apple pie and drive one of my Chevrolets. Two of which were assembled in our great neighbor to the North. Nothing sarcastic about Canada, how can't you love a place that has great hockey, beer and the best strip clubs in the world?

Have a good night! Oh and I do like your car collection by the way. Nice job!
z28camaro2471 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2007, 09:28 PM   #14
Eisenhower
I drank what?
 
Eisenhower's Avatar
 
Drives: DANGEROUSLY
Join Date: May 2007
Location: check your back seat...
Posts: 416
Quote:
Originally Posted by z28camaro2471 View Post
However, unions got greedy. How else can you explain people who empty garbage cans and sweep floors for $20.00/hr? Or assembly quotas where people can get paid for 8 hours, but only work 4 hours and play cards the rest of the night?
Haha! I used to work 3rd shift in the chip cellars for Anheuser Busch @ $22.01 p/hr. When I read that comment you just made I thought, "we used to do that!". I'd work for only 4 hours and the rest of the night, I'd be down in the cafe sleeping and/or playing dominoes along with the rest of the shift!!! Ahhh, good times!.... good times...

The thing with unions is it helps and it hurts. Sure they get you more money on the hour and better benefits along with more friggin' respect from your employer. But if you're paying your employees more, then naturally you have to charge more for your product. Then you have union dues and lets not forget about the strikers. If they strike, you strike, despite your bills & debts.

It's a double edged sword...
Eisenhower is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Toyota fears U.S. backlash over gains KILLER74Z28 General Automotive + Other Cars Discussion 6 02-14-2007 08:49 PM
Don't blame GM, Toyota exec says KILLER74Z28 General Automotive + Other Cars Discussion 0 12-20-2006 06:00 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:22 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.