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V8 and V6 Transmissions / Driveline (6L80 / 6L50 / TR6060 / AY6) Driveshafts | Differentials | Gears | Rearends | Clutch | Shifters

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Old 10-13-2010, 05:02 PM   #1
ducatisl
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Thumbs up ACT twin disk clutch install by Mike Norris Motorsports

Just thought I'd drop a line or two about the excellent work by Mike Norris on my car again. After spending Sunday running around the track at MTI Fest near Birmingham, Alabama, I continued on up to Indianapolis, Indiana where obviously my faith in getting my SS worked on lays , plus it gives me an excuse to visit old friends.

I hope Mike will elaborate on the technical details as my knowledge on twin disk clutches amounts to:

1. Better torque/hp holding capacity compared to single disk clutches, for the same disk material type.
2. Center plates need to be strapped to eliminate idle rattle.
3. ZR-1 assembly is the most common used.
4. Install a remote bleeder while the clutch is out.
5. The spacing between the pressure plate fingers and the throw-out bearing is important and at least with the ZR-1 clutch, taken up with a machined spacer.
6. The assembly usually comes with a flywheel.

Mike should elaborate on the install and others should definitely PM him if they have more detailed questions. From a driver's perspective, I find the clutch action:

1. Lighter
2. Shorter
3. About 1 to 1.5 inches off the floor, and growing as the clutch breaks in.

I rather like #3, since I can almost just toe-heel the clutch vs having to move my whole leg. In fact, it makes driving the car a bit easier and more...um...motorcycle'ish especially with a short throw shifter...everything is easier to shift now.

As an aside, I know it's crazy to drive all the way from the Florida panhandle up to Indianapolis just to get a car worked on, but it gives me a nice warm fuzzy knowing that Mike has gone thru the car and addresses any concerns I have. For example on this particular trip, I had a Disturbed Customs (Revxtreme design I believe) catch can that replaced my homemade catch can. "My" catch can design used perforated sheet metal disks and caught at least a teaspon of oil per week. The DC can...well...after a track day and easily 1000+ miles...maybe a teaspoon. I may take my chop saw to it and see if it actually has "any" sort of oil trapping mechanism inside. Also, the fitting for the remote oil line drain is not barbed, allowing the tube to easily fall off the catch can should things get hot and toasty. I think I dragged the drain line underneath my car from about Tennessee, thru Kentucky, and well into Indiana.

So I asked Mike if he had any of his catch cans left (given the hordes of V6 guys buying them up all the time) and he did, so I went ahead and bought his and had him install it along with the dual disk clutch and the remote bleeder.

Fyi, the ACT clutch part number is T1S-G01, and I bought it from the very customer friendly folks (Sean) at Stillen (those Nissan guys) for just over a grand with shipping (ridiculously cheap shipping was like $9 bucks...and it weighed around 44 lbs!) Oh, and the DC guys are very good as well on the customer side. I just don't believe their catch can design is effective "or" I got a bad can.

Back to the clutch, with over 900 mostly highway miles, maybe 40 city, the clutch is still breaking in. I'll report back after a few hundred commuting miles.

Again, if you're lucky enough to live in/near Indianapolis, I highly suggest you consider Mike Norris Motorsports for your Camaro work. (He did not pay me to say that, but if he should decide to give me a discount or a coupon for my next 1500 mile round trip that'd be really cool!) Now, I think those Yella Terra ultra light roller rockers are next....
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Last edited by ducatisl; 10-13-2010 at 07:16 PM.
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Old 10-13-2010, 06:48 PM   #2
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just wait till cooler months, mike does come south like the birds..lol
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Old 10-13-2010, 09:31 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by ducatisl View Post
Just thought I'd drop a line or two about the excellent work by Mike Norris on my car again. After spending Sunday running around the track at MTI Fest near Birmingham, Alabama, I continued on up to Indianapolis, Indiana where obviously my faith in getting my SS worked on lays , plus it gives me an excuse to visit old friends.

I hope Mike will elaborate on the technical details as my knowledge on twin disk clutches amounts to:

1. Better torque/hp holding capacity compared to single disk clutches, for the same disk material type.
2. Center plates need to be strapped to eliminate idle rattle.
3. ZR-1 assembly is the most common used.
4. Install a remote bleeder while the clutch is out.
5. The spacing between the pressure plate fingers and the throw-out bearing is important and at least with the ZR-1 clutch, taken up with a machined spacer.
6. The assembly usually comes with a flywheel.

Mike should elaborate on the install and others should definitely PM him if they have more detailed questions. From a driver's perspective, I find the clutch action:

1. Lighter
2. Shorter
3. About 1 to 1.5 inches off the floor, and growing as the clutch breaks in.

I rather like #3, since I can almost just toe-heel the clutch vs having to move my whole leg. In fact, it makes driving the car a bit easier and more...um...motorcycle'ish especially with a short throw shifter...everything is easier to shift now.

As an aside, I know it's crazy to drive all the way from the Florida panhandle up to Indianapolis just to get a car worked on, but it gives me a nice warm fuzzy knowing that Mike has gone thru the car and addresses any concerns I have. For example on this particular trip, I had a Disturbed Customs (Revxtreme design I believe) catch can that replaced my homemade catch can. "My" catch can design used perforated sheet metal disks and caught at least a teaspon of oil per week. The DC can...well...after a track day and easily 1000+ miles...maybe a teaspoon. I may take my chop saw to it and see if it actually has "any" sort of oil trapping mechanism inside. Also, the fitting for the remote oil line drain is not barbed, allowing the tube to easily fall off the catch can should things get hot and toasty. I think I dragged the drain line underneath my car from about Tennessee, thru Kentucky, and well into Indiana.

So I asked Mike if he had any of his catch cans left (given the hordes of V6 guys buying them up all the time) and he did, so I went ahead and bought his and had him install it along with the dual disk clutch and the remote bleeder.

Fyi, the ACT clutch part number is T1S-G01, and I bought it from the very customer friendly folks (Sean) at Stillen (those Nissan guys) for just over a grand with shipping (ridiculously cheap shipping was like $9 bucks...and it weighed around 44 lbs!) Oh, and the DC guys are very good as well on the customer side. I just don't believe their catch can design is effective "or" I got a bad can.

Back to the clutch, with over 900 mostly highway miles, maybe 40 city, the clutch is still breaking in. I'll report back after a few hundred commuting miles.

Again, if you're lucky enough to live in/near Indianapolis, I highly suggest you consider Mike Norris Motorsports for your Camaro work. (He did not pay me to say that, but if he should decide to give me a discount or a coupon for my next 1500 mile round trip that'd be really cool!) Now, I think those Yella Terra ultra light roller rockers are next....
Very cool. I just ordered the same clutch from Sean. Can you tell me if the clutch is noisy? I've heard twin disk clutches tend to clank around allot.
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Old 10-13-2010, 10:18 PM   #4
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The ACT is about as quiet as stock, probably due to the strapped center plate. The ACT also has adjusters to center the plate between the two disks which I would surmise has the benefits of even disengagement of the disks as well as less noise? With almost any manual car, I can hear a small tiny amount of noise in neutral that goes away when pressing the clutch pedal. This is no different than a single disk, and definitely not anywhere near what prior twins sounded like.

Now don't forget to install the remote bleeder....
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Old 10-14-2010, 07:34 AM   #5
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Just got my ACT from Sean yesterday. Looks BAAAAAAAAAAAAAd AAAAAAAAAAs.
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Old 10-14-2010, 11:24 AM   #6
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Just got my ACT from Sean yesterday. Looks BAAAAAAAAAAAAAd AAAAAAAAAAs.
Pics brother. Pics!!!!!
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Old 10-14-2010, 11:35 AM   #7
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I took one pic with my iPhone. honestly, it looks exactly like what's shown in the ACT pdf marketing flyer: yellow pressure plate, lightened flywheel, organic faced disks (no springs in the disks, but it's certainly not a grabby clutch). Nice, high quality feel/look to it. I'm driving down to Orlando tomorrow and might race it at the track down there. Will report back with any findings.
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Old 10-14-2010, 01:40 PM   #8
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The ACT is about as quiet as stock, probably due to the strapped center plate. The ACT also has adjusters to center the plate between the two disks which I would surmise has the benefits of even disengagement of the disks as well as less noise? With almost any manual car, I can hear a small tiny amount of noise in neutral that goes away when pressing the clutch pedal. This is no different than a single disk, and definitely not anywhere near what prior twins sounded like.

Now don't forget to install the remote bleeder....
Thanks for the feedback...I'm glad to know it's not noisy.

What is the remote bleeder? Is that something that comes with the clutch? If not where do I get it?
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Old 10-14-2010, 02:59 PM   #9
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Remote bleeders replace the stock bleeder fitting to accomodate a stainless line that runs up the firewall to the reservoir. This allows you to easily bleed the cluth without a person under the car. I developed my own kit that allows you to install it with the tranny in the car. All of the kits I have seen to date need to be installed with the trans out of the car. The downside is that if anything happens to the stainless line, you gotta pull the trans back out. You can see the details and PM me if interested. http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=101008

Sorry to threadjack. I also have ACT clutches in my Vet and Camaro, best clutch I have used, period. Zero chatter, almost zero break-in and near stock pedal pressure and noise. This is the 5th clutch in my Vet and hands down better than any of the other twins I have tried. I just pulled the trans out of my Camaro which has seen some hard use and numerous 700+whp dyno pulls and there is zero clutch dust in the bell housing. I am confident it will hold up to 900whp with ease.

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Thanks for the feedback...I'm glad to know it's not noisy.

What is the remote bleeder? Is that something that comes with the clutch? If not where do I get it?
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Old 10-16-2010, 12:05 AM   #10
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Okay, update here. I just got back from Orlando's Spinworld...er...Speedworld, and made a few passes and the clutch worked far better than the driver. The last run I was able to pedal the ACT clutch far better than I could with the stocker.

I think TheKid96 is onto something in that my ACT seems pretty much the same now as when I picked it up from Mike Norris' shop. I've got over 1300 mostly highway miles with maybe 150 urban miles.

The only issue seems to be in the morning where it seems hard to get into gear. But after about a minute, all is normal. Engagement point seems to have risen ever so slightly, but that is subjective observation, not measured. I suppose in retrospect, adding one more of those 0.020 shims would have helped, but I'll reserve that opinion for another 150 urban miles of disk wear, which given my short commute, is going to take a couple weeks.
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Old 10-16-2010, 08:17 AM   #11
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After reading your review of this clutch I decided to buy one (Model#: T1S-G01) and had it installed yesterday. My results so far are horrendous; I've driven it about 50 miles since having the clutch installed and I've got to say it has ruined the drivability of my car. The shudder when starting from a stop is unbearable; it even shudders when down shifting.

$1500 for the clutch and installation and I hate driving my car. I'm going to hammer ACT here and on other forums until this is resolved. This is complete BS.
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Old 10-16-2010, 08:46 AM   #12
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I scanned the ACT instructions and emailed them to Mike Norris two weeks before I brought the car to him. After the install, Mike described the disassembly/cleaning/reassembly of the ACT and then went over the all too critical pressure-plate-to-throwout bearing clearances (I saw his chicken scratched measurements on cardboard ) and how they fit in ACT's specs (don't ask me what they were, I'm over 40 with a correspondingly short memory!).

Since alot of equipment performance is dependent on installation, kinda like IT saying, "Problem exists between keyboard and chair", I'd really make sure your installer did everything correct. Maybe ACT can help you verify this. And like I said to you earlier, the strapped center plate adjustment probably is fairly critical.
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Old 10-16-2010, 08:59 AM   #13
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I scanned the ACT instructions and emailed them to Mike Norris two weeks before I brought the car to him. After the install, Mike described the disassembly/cleaning/reassembly of the ACT and then went over the all too critical pressure-plate-to-throwout bearing clearances (I saw his chicken scratched measurements on cardboard ) and how they fit in ACT's specs (don't ask me what they were, I'm over 40 with a correspondingly short memory!).

Since alot of equipment performance is dependent on installation, kinda like IT saying, "Problem exists between keyboard and chair", I'd really make sure your installer did everything correct. Maybe ACT can help you verify this. And like I said to you earlier, the strapped center plate adjustment probably is fairly critical.
The mechanic is ASE certified and installed the my gears w/o problems, so I'd be surprised if it's an installation problem. It's always fun asking a mechanic if they screwed up the installation, they ALWAYS point to the part as the problem :(
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Old 10-16-2010, 01:11 PM   #14
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Yep, I know what you mean! That's why I try to patronize shops that specialize in whatever car it is that i need work on if I'm not wanting to work on it myself.

Just curious, have you taken the car to the track with those new gears? Not to get of topic, but I've heard of some issues with the Richmond gears?
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Old 10-20-2010, 10:38 AM   #15
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Just an update: 2000+ miles, still no chattering, still engages just as smoothly as when Mike installed it, just replaced all the brake/clutch fluid and bled both systems (incorrectly at that, wrong caliper order as well as "there's a 2nd bleeder on each caliper?!"). What a difference! Guess the prior trackday really dorked up the brake/clutch fluid because now the clutch is almost stock-like. Still lighter throw, engagement is a little higher off the floor and with more engagement length (not so on/off). Shifts smoother, easier, and no issues getting into gear whatsoever in the morning. I'm going to have to change the brake/clutch fluid more often!
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Old 10-20-2010, 01:07 PM   #16
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Pics brother. Pics!!!!!
Car still stuck at dealers for the outout shaft re-placement.
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Old 10-24-2010, 12:30 AM   #17
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After reading your review of this clutch I decided to buy one (Model#: T1S-G01) and had it installed yesterday. My results so far are horrendous; I've driven it about 50 miles since having the clutch installed and I've got to say it has ruined the drivability of my car. The shudder when starting from a stop is unbearable; it even shudders when down shifting.

$1500 for the clutch and installation and I hate driving my car. I'm going to hammer ACT here and on other forums until this is resolved. This is complete BS.
Must be installed in correct. I put the first 100km on mine today. It's mint. No shuddering. It's butter soft. I love it.
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Old 10-29-2010, 03:35 PM   #18
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Must be installed in correct. I put the first 100km on mine today. It's mint. No shuddering. It's butter soft. I love it.
Mine is still shuddering pretty badly when launching at low RPM and when downshifting. The mechanic swears he installed it correctly, but who knows.
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Old 10-29-2010, 03:42 PM   #19
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Mine is still shuddering pretty badly when launching at low RPM and when downshifting. The mechanic swears he installed it correctly, but who knows.
Don't know what to tell you. Mine is mint. Love it. Ask your guy if he is sure that he didn't mix up the shims on the stands. Very important. If he did have an accident with the shims. The only way to fix it is follow ACT set up procedure. You did buy the clutch and flywheel as a set?

Failing that call Sean at ACT.

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Old 10-30-2010, 07:47 AM   #20
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Mine is mint too.

Anyone do the separate clutch reservoir mod? I'm almost thinking it might be easier just to keep the OEM setup since I rather like the idea of flushing out BOTH brake and clutch fluid several times a year after track day weekends.
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Old 10-30-2010, 08:09 AM   #21
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Mine is mint too.

Anyone do the separate clutch reservoir mod? I'm almost thinking it might be easier just to keep the OEM setup since I rather like the idea of flushing out BOTH brake and clutch fluid several times a year after track day weekends.
Not yet but the resovoir is on order.
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Old 10-30-2010, 11:16 AM   #22
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Aren't Canadian cars in storage by now?!

Just messin' with ya. Post some pics when you "git 'er done".


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Not yet but the resovoir is on order.
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Old 10-30-2010, 11:21 AM   #23
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I live 90 minutes north of Seattle WA right on the border. Same weather as Seattle. Yes I just parked Pumpkin til I leave for C5F II. Tons of stuff to do, have box's of BMR stuff to put on. What do you want to see pic' of?

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Old 10-30-2010, 04:00 PM   #24
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Just a pic or two of the new reservoir and how you plugged the OEM reservoir's clutch nipple.

I've put a ton of BMR stuff on my SS. If you're doing subframe bushings, keep a propane torch nearby. The front subframe hats will then drop right off if lightly heated.
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I live 90 minutes north of Seattle WA right on the border. Same weather as Seattle. Yes I just parked Pumpkin til I leave for C5F II. Tons of stuff to do, have box's of BMR stuff to put on. What do you want to see pic' of?

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Old 10-30-2010, 04:09 PM   #25
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Just a pic or two of the new reservoir and how you plugged the OEM reservoir's clutch nipple.

I've put a ton of BMR stuff on my SS. If you're doing subframe bushings, keep a propane torch nearby. The front subframe hats will then drop right off if lightly heated.
I think I'm just using the inserts on the subframe, but thanks for the tip. I'll keep it in mind. I have only installed strut brace, trailing arms, tunnel brace and driveshaft loop so far. Still got:

Sways
Toe Links
All the bushings front and back

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