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Old 01-15-2009, 10:44 AM   #26
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I have to imagine that with 304 and 400+hp on tap hills won't be as big of an issue as they are for stick-shift econoboxes.
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Old 01-15-2009, 10:52 AM   #27
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Here's a good vid that shows heel toe. I'll loook for another...





Antoher with double clutch down shift.



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Old 01-15-2009, 03:01 PM   #28
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Great vid. on the heel toe. I however will be buying an automatic tranny. I can drive anything, but after 10 years of driving a Tractor Trailor and owning a standard transmision vehicle, the thrill is GONE shiffting gears.
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Old 01-15-2009, 03:43 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irpq11 View Post
Great vid. on the heel toe. I however will be buying an automatic tranny. I can drive anything, but after 10 years of driving a Tractor Trailor and owning a standard transmision vehicle, the thrill is GONE shiffting gears.
LOL

fair enough!
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Old 01-15-2009, 04:10 PM   #30
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i tried rev matching and downshifting today, not even heeltoe, and the thing with this silly geo is merely bliping the throttle doesn't do much.
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Old 01-15-2009, 06:06 PM   #31
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blipping the throttle will make sense once you learn how to drive. It's kinda a feel thing to know how many RPM you will force.
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Old 01-15-2009, 07:40 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeeTwentyFour View Post
i tried rev matching and downshifting today, not even heeltoe, and the thing with this silly geo is merely bliping the throttle doesn't do much.
A blip for a metro is like revving halfway between your current and redline. =P It's all about the gearing though so every car is different.

Heel and Toe is used to do what you're doing while braking. That's the only time when all three pedals are needed.
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Old 01-15-2009, 07:44 PM   #33
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Aye I used to hate on steep hills when someone get's up close to your bumper. I have an 84 RX7 5 speed (yes still have it) and it's probably one of the easier sticks to pull off a brake to 1st uphill.
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Old 01-18-2009, 04:46 PM   #34
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Race cars used to have non-syncro trannies, so the drivers were pretty much forced to learn double clutching, and heel-toe techniques. Nowadays double clutching is just a novelty, even most truckers do it the lazy way and float gears...DON'T they PQ

Your pedals should be optimized for good heel-toe position, it makes it SO much easier. The throttle should be close to the brake (right to left) and when you're on the brakes, the brake pedal height should be the same as the gas pedal...A quick tap with the right side of your foot on the gas pedal and voila! rev and downshift!
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Old 01-18-2009, 04:56 PM   #35
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thanks guys great videos and advice
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top 10 reason why real men drive stick.

10. A manual transmission is the ultimate in control
9. You can use automotive jargon and not sound like a total tool
8. You can't spell "manual" without "man"
7. Manual transmissions prove you can do more than one thing at a time
6. You can't drift in an auto
5. You can't pull fancy moves in an automatic
4. You get better fuel economy with a stick
3. You’ll never look like a chump if you can drive stick
2. Manual transmission cars are faster
1. Women like a guy who is good with his hands.

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Old 01-18-2009, 05:31 PM   #36
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More heel and toe practice here....to be followed with a good banging of the shifter
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Old 01-18-2009, 05:45 PM   #37
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Might I recommend the forum specifically about manual transmissions?
http://www.standardshift.com

Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Blur View Post
Every time I read a thread about manuals, I come to the renewed conclusion that getting one will cause me to do more harm than good to my Camaro. Besides, I'm elated with the performance of the automatic tranny.
Why?

If you think you'll enjoy it more, go ahead and get it. You'll be fine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by N8dawg View Post
This is a very bad idea, I used to do the exact same thing..until I had to pay for another clutch, believe me, keeping your car from moving by keeping the clutch out just enough is extremely hard on your clutch/tranny.
I suppose if you're going to spend a whole red light it's a bad idea, but if you only do it for a split second during the launch it's no different from using the handbrake...either way it slips momentarily.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeeTwentyFour View Post
i tried rev matching and downshifting today, not even heeltoe, and the thing with this silly geo is merely bliping the throttle doesn't do much.
That makes it easier. You can stab it pretty hard and have better, more measured control. My VW's drive-by-wire throttle is jumpy and randomly sends it to redline no matter how consistent my blip foot is.
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Old 01-18-2009, 07:00 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NUCAR View Post
More heel and toe practice here....to be followed with a good banging of the shifter
ouchhhhhhhh
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top 10 reason why real men drive stick.

10. A manual transmission is the ultimate in control
9. You can use automotive jargon and not sound like a total tool
8. You can't spell "manual" without "man"
7. Manual transmissions prove you can do more than one thing at a time
6. You can't drift in an auto
5. You can't pull fancy moves in an automatic
4. You get better fuel economy with a stick
3. You’ll never look like a chump if you can drive stick
2. Manual transmission cars are faster
1. Women like a guy who is good with his hands.

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Old 01-19-2009, 09:05 AM   #39
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As far as your upshifts go doesn't the Camaro have no lift shift? GM seems to be dumping it on all their performance cars lately.
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Old 01-19-2009, 09:45 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djsnoflake View Post
As far as your upshifts go doesn't the Camaro have no lift shift? GM seems to be dumping it on all their performance cars lately.
no lift shift?
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top 10 reason why real men drive stick.

10. A manual transmission is the ultimate in control
9. You can use automotive jargon and not sound like a total tool
8. You can't spell "manual" without "man"
7. Manual transmissions prove you can do more than one thing at a time
6. You can't drift in an auto
5. You can't pull fancy moves in an automatic
4. You get better fuel economy with a stick
3. You’ll never look like a chump if you can drive stick
2. Manual transmission cars are faster
1. Women like a guy who is good with his hands.

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Old 01-19-2009, 12:15 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffny09 View Post
no lift shift?
You don't have to lift off the gas pedal when you push in the clutch. Kind of a computerized speed shift.
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Old 01-19-2009, 12:33 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gtahvit View Post
You don't have to lift off the gas pedal when you push in the clutch. Kind of a computerized speed shift.
Pfft, you don't need that to do a powershift, im sure everyone with a camaro will be doing it whether or not it comes with the no lift shift feature.
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Old 01-19-2009, 12:39 PM   #43
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^
LOL

I agree, but GM's been using it all over the place.
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Old 01-19-2009, 12:46 PM   #44
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Can a person shift more effectively than a machine. Aren't the main reasons for buying a standard tranny to be;
More affordable
Save on fuel
Just fun to do (shifting gears)
What is the benefit after those? Downshifting?
I geuss the ? should be what is the benefit as apposed to an automatic transm?
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Old 01-19-2009, 12:52 PM   #45
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what is the purpose for double clutch down shifting?

also when i am slowing to stop @ a light for example i usually just put it back in N roll to a stop and go from there is it wrong to do so and not down shift? there is no need..?
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Old 01-19-2009, 12:52 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irpq11 View Post
Can a person shift more effectively than a machine. Aren't the main reasons for buying a standard tranny to be;
More affordable
Save on fuel
Just fun to do (shifting gears)
What is the benefit after those? Downshifting?
I geuss the ? should be what is the benefit as apposed to an automatic transm?
Other than drag racing, (which I believe to be a toss up) a manual transmission is better for High performance applications. especially road racing. Seat of the pants sensors will always be better at keeping the car going fast around the track.

My personal opinion for drag cars (Not daily driver, weekend drag cars), real competitive drag cars, is that when geared to get the car to it's top speed at the end of a quarter mile with no traction loss etc., Autos are hard to beat. But can be beat by a real good manual driver.

FWIW.
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Old 01-19-2009, 12:56 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5th_GEN_SS View Post
what is the purpose for double clutch down shifting?

also when i am slowing to stop @ a light for example i usually just put it back in N roll to a stop and go from there is it wrong to do so and not down shift? there is no need..?
You are right for what you describe there is no need to double clutch or heel toe.

But lets say you wanted to be going as fast as you can up to the intersection, then go as fast as you can while making a left hand turn through the intersection? You'd be going way to fast when you got to the intersection, so you'd wait till the last second, brake hard and down shift with the above techniques. That way you are going as fast as possible and are in the correct gear to keep the engine in the power band through the turn....

Make sense? these techniques aren't really any good for daily driving.
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Old 01-19-2009, 01:05 PM   #48
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Is it seen as "ok" to feather the clutch (let off the clutch partially just enough to get the car rolling) when backing up or pulling into a parking spot, etc?
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Old 01-19-2009, 01:20 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irpq11 View Post
Can a person shift more effectively than a machine. Aren't the main reasons for buying a standard tranny to be; [...]
What is the benefit after those? Downshifting?
I geuss the ? should be what is the benefit as apposed to an automatic transm?
I've never understood why people think you can't downshift an automatic. Besides the fact that you can't AVOID downshifting when you step on the gas pedal, there's always those numbers on the other side of the 'D'; and modern cars (especially the Camaro) come with manual modes that are designed for you to select your gears.
/rant

Anyway, the manual is more fun for a lot of people (me), can get better fuel economy, and is less expensive to buy (as you said).

I think with an appropriate driver, the Camaro will be faster with the automatic than with the manual. People talk about manual-driving skill, but nobody ever talks about automatic-driving skill; most of the tricks you can do with a manual can be done with an automatic, and automatics have a few exclusive tricks of their own too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 5th_GEN_SS View Post
what is the purpose for double clutch down shifting?
Double-clutching can do two things:
- Get you into gear more quickly than a normal shift
- Reduce synchro wear (in case you were worried about it, which I'm pretty sure you shouldn't be)

Quote:
also when i am slowing to stop @ a light for example i usually just put it back in N roll to a stop and go from there is it wrong to do so and not down shift? there is no need..?
It's fine. Some people downshift through every gear on the way to a stop because they have superstitions either that you must use gears sequentially or that they'll suddenly need to accelerate to avoid an accident (and therefore fear neutral).
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Old 01-19-2009, 01:26 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UCF w00t View Post
Is it seen as "ok" to feather the clutch (let off the clutch partially just enough to get the car rolling) when backing up or pulling into a parking spot, etc?
Yes that is ok. Just don't rev the motor while "ridding" the clutch like that.

Bad news.
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