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Old 12-22-2010, 11:48 AM   #1
liquidsmoke
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This makes me sick

yet again. Whos next?

The gov really needs to do something about this type of crap. If there is a safety defect in your vehicle that can potentially kill someone it needs to be mandated by the law to be fixed asap and not left up to the manufacturer to get around to it when they feel like it.


http://jalopnik.com/5715961/ford-slo...ect-gets-rossd
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Old 12-22-2010, 12:45 PM   #2
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That is negligence at its finest ladies and gentlemen. I hope they sue the pants off Ford and get as much compensation as possible...although nothing can replace a family member.

If those roll bars weren't sticking 3 feet out from every corner of that van, that thing would have flipped numerous times...at that was only at 35 MPH? Let's see what happens at 60 MPH...Sickening.
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Old 12-22-2010, 01:20 PM   #3
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That is negligence at its finest ladies and gentlemen. I hope they sue the pants off Ford and get as much compensation as possible...although nothing can replace a family member.

If those roll bars weren't sticking 3 feet out from every corner of that van, that thing would have flipped numerous times...at that was only at 35 MPH? Let's see what happens at 60 MPH...Sickening.
In that video it looked to be a newer Freestar and not even a Windstar though.
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Old 12-22-2010, 01:32 PM   #4
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Every make is guilty of this. Until our government steps up this will continue.
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Old 12-22-2010, 01:46 PM   #5
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Every make is guilty of this. Until our government steps up this will continue.
unfortunately, very true.
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Old 12-24-2010, 10:16 AM   #6
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Why do we need the government to babysit us? The best solution for this kind of thing is for the government to stay the hell out of the way. The government can't do anything about this. What is the government going to do, mandate that as soon as a problem is found in ONE car you issue a recall for every car in the model line? Seriously if the government gets involved in every little freaking problem your 35K Camaro will eventually cost well over 100K. Why you ask will the price go up so much, simple car companies will not eat the cost of potentially recalling every mass produced automobile and will simple build that potential cost into the price of every car. So with hundreds of thousands of parts on any given car times hundreds of thousands of dollars in recall expenses your average car will be astronomically unaffordable by anybody and every car manufacturer will go out of business. Now is getting the government involved in this really such a good idea?
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Old 12-24-2010, 10:18 AM   #7
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I'm glad we don't drive a Ford van in my household.....not just for being non-safe but because they look dorky.
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Old 12-24-2010, 10:55 AM   #8
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Just put some firestone tires on it and really live on the edge!
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Old 12-24-2010, 11:31 AM   #9
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Just put some firestone tires on it and really live on the edge!
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Old 12-24-2010, 11:36 AM   #10
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Why do we need the government to babysit us? The best solution for this kind of thing is for the government to stay the hell out of the way. The government can't do anything about this. What is the government going to do, mandate that as soon as a problem is found in ONE car you issue a recall for every car in the model line? Seriously if the government gets involved in every little freaking problem your 35K Camaro will eventually cost well over 100K. Why you ask will the price go up so much, simple car companies will not eat the cost of potentially recalling every mass produced automobile and will simple build that potential cost into the price of every car. So with hundreds of thousands of parts on any given car times hundreds of thousands of dollars in recall expenses your average car will be astronomically unaffordable by anybody and every car manufacturer will go out of business. Now is getting the government involved in this really such a good idea?
The only positive way I can see the government getting involved with this situation is to mandate better safety inspections, or perhaps requiring a quick response time on all recall notifications (especially for ones that are potentially life threatening like this). Other than that, the judicial system is more than capable of handling the lawsuits that will not doubt result from this. Very tragic that the Bowman family received the recall notice a week too late.
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Old 12-24-2010, 11:51 AM   #11
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Just put some firestone tires on it and really live on the edge!
There were times when I was tempted to put Firestones on my old exploder. But I would have cheated myself out of 4500 bucks in trade so..
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Old 12-24-2010, 12:07 PM   #12
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Why do we need the government to babysit us? The best solution for this kind of thing is for the government to stay the hell out of the way. The government can't do anything about this. What is the government going to do, mandate that as soon as a problem is found in ONE car you issue a recall for every car in the model line? Seriously if the government gets involved in every little freaking problem your 35K Camaro will eventually cost well over 100K. Why you ask will the price go up so much, simple car companies will not eat the cost of potentially recalling every mass produced automobile and will simple build that potential cost into the price of every car. So with hundreds of thousands of parts on any given car times hundreds of thousands of dollars in recall expenses your average car will be astronomically unaffordable by anybody and every car manufacturer will go out of business. Now is getting the government involved in this really such a good idea?
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Old 12-24-2010, 02:46 PM   #13
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Ok, I am going to play the devils advocate here. So this affects windstars from 98 to 03. Which means the oldest one has been on the road 12-13 years depending on original sale date. So, in that 8-13 years the axle began to rust, not unexpected. Also, the recall is limited to northern states which use salt to combat icy roads. So, the implication is that the salt exacerbated the typical rust that one would expect.

Based on that one has to ask what happened to routine maintenance checks? I'm not saying everything would be caught there. What about those who see rust on the body, which is painted and sealed while axles are raw metal, was that dismissed? I read most of the comments in the article and the theme was that they noticed something before the axle broke, not 100% but most, such as their rear end going one direction while they were steering another or a loud sound which wasn't present before.

These cars clearly aren't new and have significant mileage on them. There have been no problems in the south reported. The axles aren't snapping at 40k... More like 100-140k.

Think about it as a whole.

Thoughts?
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Old 12-24-2010, 03:06 PM   #14
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Apparently we are going to have mandated backup cameras in all cars by 2015 (or so the rumor is) due to 225 or so people a year die from being backed over....yet cigarettes kill 500,000 a year and ....????? The Gov cannot regulate every aspect of our life (happy meals in CA?) but when they do shouldn't there be some common sense involved? THAT I would vote for.
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Old 12-24-2010, 06:42 PM   #15
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http://jalopnik.com/5716931/man-arre...yline=true&s=i
This was at the top of the page when I opened it. Idiots will be idiots, but what would we have to give us such a good chuckle. At least he didn't roll over or Chevy may recall Corvettes as they'd have a rollover potential at 195.
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Old 12-24-2010, 07:03 PM   #16
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I don't think that the government is the answer here... it never is.
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Old 12-24-2010, 11:36 PM   #17
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I don't think that the government is the answer here... it never is.
Sadly, it's the go-to entity these days.
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Old 12-25-2010, 12:27 AM   #18
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I don't think that the government is the answer here... it never is.
Let's not blame the government for how Ford designs a car. The government's domestic role, for the most part, is to deter crime, injustice, and disorder. Deterrence only prevents those issues when those who would cause crime, injustice, and disorder decide in a cost-benefit analysis that the cost of crime, injustice, and disorder exceeds the benefit. Ford decided to go ahead with a product that would not pass more stringent testing. Blame Ford, not the US government.
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Old 12-26-2010, 01:28 PM   #19
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I don't think that the government is the answer here... it never is.
Agreed. 100%
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Old 12-26-2010, 02:50 PM   #20
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So...

They are shocked real axles are rusting and breaking when they live in areas with heavily salted roads? Did these people ever bother to wash under the car and do basic work to prevent problems?

I'm guessing not
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Old 12-26-2010, 11:00 PM   #21
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Why do we need the government to babysit us? The best solution for this kind of thing is for the government to stay the hell out of the way. The government can't do anything about this. What is the government going to do, mandate that as soon as a problem is found in ONE car you issue a recall for every car in the model line? Seriously if the government gets involved in every little freaking problem your 35K Camaro will eventually cost well over 100K. Why you ask will the price go up so much, simple car companies will not eat the cost of potentially recalling every mass produced automobile and will simple build that potential cost into the price of every car. So with hundreds of thousands of parts on any given car times hundreds of thousands of dollars in recall expenses your average car will be astronomically unaffordable by anybody and every car manufacturer will go out of business. Now is getting the government involved in this really such a good idea?
The governments role is to protect the people(you know for the people, by the people etc). Businesses have one focus and that is to make money. If they know no one is watching they will take every short cut they can get away with. They cant sell lots of $100,000 cars so they need to make $30,000 cars. So how does government oversight pay off? Well if you take GM which will have over 11 million sales in North America and you have the guys with the MBA's asking the engineers where to cut costs. They listen when the engineer says "well going with the lower cost metal in the axle might save 50 cents per car but there is a high risk of failure" The MBA guy now does some bean counting and decides which is more costly. Folow the engineers advice and spend that extra 5.5 million or gamble with law suites and recalls. Law suites dont worry them much these days because they are settled out of court with non-disclosure binders. This makes it harder for the next person who has someone die to build a case. If you have government oversight then you have pressure that helps the MBA's make the right choice.
Who do you trust to look out for your best interests? The government of the people, by the people or the business of the dollar, for the dollar?
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Old 12-26-2010, 11:10 PM   #22
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Apparently we are going to have mandated backup cameras in all cars by 2015 (or so the rumor is) due to 225 or so people a year die from being backed over....yet cigarettes kill 500,000 a year and ....????? The Gov cannot regulate every aspect of our life (happy meals in CA?) but when they do shouldn't there be some common sense involved? THAT I would vote for.
Off topic but the happy meal thing is way over blown- They didn't outlaw a happymeal nor toys in them. They outlawed toys in unhealthy happy meals. It's a choice parents and Mc'ds must make now. Toy and healthy meal or unhealthy meal and no free toy. Have you seen the number of fat kids? Someone has to make people think about that choice. At current rates of childhood obesity pediatricians are going to have to get extra training on treating heart attack, coronary artery disease etc. They already have to bone up on type 2 diabetes management.
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Old 12-27-2010, 12:15 AM   #23
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So...

They are shocked real axles are rusting and breaking when they live in areas with heavily salted roads? Did these people ever bother to wash under the car and do basic work to prevent problems?

I'm guessing not
Most don't. My driveshaft was rusted through on the Exploder when I sold it. How it didn't shear I have no idea. But they took it for 4500 bucks and I got a Trans Am out of the deal with 29K miles at the time.

Win Win for me.

Only now I wash underneath the car and am (in the process of) getting it undercoated so crap like snapped rear ends and suspension components are limited to Track Day.
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Old 12-27-2010, 12:19 AM   #24
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One has to ask how long the manufacturer should be responsible for parts that wear out as a result of normal wear, age, and salt corrosion. I can understand if this was happening to newer vehicles, but the Windstar has been out of production for nearly 10 years now.

Should Ford be required to retro fit all remaining Model T's and A's with seat belts and air bags? Should GM today be required to retrofit all remaining Corvairs with new suspensions? Can I sue if a 15 year old serpentine belt breaks, and the resulting loss of power steering causes an accident? If you are driving a car with 200K+ miles and the shocks are worn out, or the brakes are shot, is the manufacturer responsible for that? Where should the cutoff be?

At some point, owners/drivers have to take on the responsibility for ensuring that their car is in good working order. The manufacturers can't drive the cars to the garage to ensure they are being properly maintained themselves, and it certainly isn't realistic to expect unlimited lifetime bumper to bumper warranties.
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Old 12-27-2010, 12:37 AM   #25
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So...

If I buy a car, never change the oil or take care of suspension upkeep..and the engine has a catastrophic failure and takes the front suspension with it...is it the companies fault? Or is it mine for failing to take care of my vehicle.
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