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Old 01-17-2011, 11:44 AM   #826
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...This stuff is just all new to me. I should have had a tuner already. The plan was to get it going with the maggie tune and drive it till I found a tuner...
well, you can always put a stock exhaust & intake back on it
just look through the classified threads - i'm sure there's some in there
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Old 01-17-2011, 11:54 AM   #827
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i think he has something more going on,, just the cai and headers will not cause the issues he is having,, it should still run and drive on the maggy tune,, if it has the correct injectors that came with the maggy,and all the sensors hooked up correct, some ecm data would tell the whole story,,

map reading , maf reading, IAT , LTFT / STFT numbers
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Old 01-17-2011, 02:14 PM   #828
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Does P0650 reset if you clear it and then restart and run the engine a couple times?

Is the check engine light working? With those 3 codes it should be on. It should also do a bulb check at first key on.

That MIL code means either there is a problem in the circuit to the MIL lamp, or an ECM problem.

If P0650 comes back after clearing, I think that's the key to whatever is wrong.
It came back on. Very odd.

I'm taking it to J-Ville this weekend. There are NO tuner shops here in lower Bama.
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Old 01-17-2011, 02:15 PM   #829
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I am spending the day today pounding the pavement to find a tuner here. If I can't, I'll have to go somewhere.
Good luck!
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Old 01-17-2011, 02:15 PM   #830
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well, you can always put a stock exhaust & intake back on it
just look through the classified threads - i'm sure there's some in there
Right'


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i think he has something more going on,, just the cai and headers will not cause the issues he is having,, it should still run and drive on the maggy tune,, if it has the correct injectors that came with the maggy,and all the sensors hooked up correct, some ecm data would tell the whole story,,

map reading , maf reading, IAT , LTFT / STFT numbers
I don't know how to data log. And I don't know who to send it to to read.
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Old 01-17-2011, 03:12 PM   #831
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The tuner is probably going to want to resolve the P0650 issue before tuning. That code means the ECM cannot contol the MIL lamp (check engine) at the proper voltage.

Could be the ignition feed to the ECM or the circuit to the MIL. Possibly one of those circuits got shorted or opened, or pulled out of the ECM connector. If there is no wiring issue, then a faulty ECM. When I googled that code, several sources said a wiring problem is most likely and that is a very rare failure mode for the ECM itself.

I'd suspect that could be related to it not running right. Even with intake and exhaust mods, I would think it should idle fine on a close tune. I've ran mine with open headers before and it idled perfectly on a tune that was done for full exhaust w/cats.

Last edited by Russell James; 01-17-2011 at 03:52 PM.
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Old 01-17-2011, 03:32 PM   #832
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When I googled that code, several sources said a wiring problem is most likely and that is a very rare failure mode for the ECM itself.
And if you search for it here on C5 the only result is this thread... go figure...

Found this thread over on corvetteforum.com, no clue if it will help at all but seems to be a bunch of diagnostic stuff for that code from some internal GM docs

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c5-t...e-problem.html
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Old 01-17-2011, 04:02 PM   #833
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I've got a few service manuals and they all show the MIL circuit as a brown and white wire. Mine are a Vette and Silverado manuals, but I'd suspect Camaro should use the same wire color coding.

I'd trace the wire bundles from the ECM and see if any of the wiring is near where you were working. Maybe a wire got pinched near the fuel rails, things are pretty tight in there. In all the wiring on the engine you touched during the install, see if you can see a brown and white wire. If you find that wire, see if it is pinched anywhere. Also check all the ECM/ignition/engine related fuses.

Maybe one of the ECM grounds lost connection. That main ground on the right head tight? An ECM ground or power feed may make more sense. If it were just a MIL circuit problem, only the code would be the symptom. With that code and an engine performance problem, an ECM problem, ECM ground, or ECM power feed seems to make more sense.

Last edited by Russell James; 01-17-2011 at 04:24 PM.
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Old 01-17-2011, 04:18 PM   #834
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isnt' that the wire color you splice into??? for the MAF IAT reading?

or was that blue?

crap... I forgot.
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Old 01-17-2011, 04:28 PM   #835
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Isn't J-Ville where GTA lives? Make sure he isn't paying the guy to sabotage your tune. Team LS3 might do that!

Good luck PQ. You are so going to love it when it's finished.
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Old 01-17-2011, 04:32 PM   #836
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Team LS3 might do that!
Nah, the LS3 doesn't need any advantages.
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Old 01-17-2011, 04:55 PM   #837
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Isn't J-Ville where GTA lives? Make sure he isn't paying the guy to sabotage your tune. Team LS3 might do that!

Good luck PQ. You are so going to love it when it's finished.
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Nah, the LS3 doesn't need any advantages.
Woudl I do that!!!!

I'm gonna make sure my good buddy gets a nice safe tune to ease his mind...

It's not my fault that safe = slow.....

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Old 01-17-2011, 04:58 PM   #838
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well... alright then...

you only have your friend's best interests at heart... what a guy!
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Old 01-17-2011, 05:05 PM   #839
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It's not my fault that safe = slow.....

Watch him like a hawk PQ! Watch your tuner even closer....
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Old 01-17-2011, 05:30 PM   #840
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...I'm taking it to J-Ville this weekend. There are NO tuner shops here in lower Bama.
i don't necessarily need the truck this weekend if you need it.

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Woudl I do that!!!!...
yeppers, you conniving little weasel!
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Old 01-17-2011, 05:41 PM   #841
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If one of the sensors got spliced into a brown and white wire, that would explain everything.
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Old 01-17-2011, 05:57 PM   #842
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i don't necessarily need the truck this weekend if you need it.
Why don't you come with me?

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I've ran mine with open headers before and it idled perfectly on a tune that was done for full exhaust w/cats.
That is a concern. But at any rate, since I'm gonna have him tune it anyway, I might as well let him figure it out.

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I've got a few service manuals and they all show the MIL circuit as a brown and white wire.
Maybe one of the ECM grounds lost connection. That main ground on the right head tight?
The brown and white wires I spliced together were in a loop with a blue and white one as well. And was part of the MAF system.

I can't find any pinched wires anywhere and everything is tight.

I can say for certain that everything is in order as far as install. The problem is either Tune, or a sensor is bad. Either way, the tuner will know when they get it on the computer.

Whatever the problem, I won't know from here. :(
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isnt' that the wire color you splice into??? for the MAF IAT reading?

or was that blue?

crap... I forgot.
Tan to white, Blue to white.

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Originally Posted by Darth_Emma View Post
Isn't J-Ville where GTA lives? Make sure he isn't paying the guy to sabotage your tune. Team LS3 might do that!

Good luck PQ. You are so going to love it when it's finished.
I'll be watching.

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Originally Posted by GTAHVIT View Post
Woudl I do that!!!!

I'm gonna make sure my good buddy gets a nice safe tune to ease his mind...

It's not my fault that safe = slow.....

Riiiiight.

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Originally Posted by CatiaJockey View Post
Watch him like a hawk PQ! Watch your tuner even closer....


Quote:
Originally Posted by Russell James View Post
If one of the sensors got spliced into a brown and white wire, that would explain everything.
It called for the MAF to have the tan and blue wires re-routed to the two white wires on the blower.
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Old 01-17-2011, 06:03 PM   #843
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Nothing done with a brown wire with a white stripe?
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Old 01-17-2011, 06:04 PM   #844
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Why don't you come with me?

That is a concern. But at any rate, since I'm gonna have him tune it anyway, I might as well let him figure it out.


The brown and white wires I spliced together were in a loop with a blue and white one as well. And was part of the MAF system.

I can't find any pinched wires anywhere and everything is tight.

I can say for certain that everything is in order as far as install. The problem is either Tune, or a sensor is bad. Either way, the tuner will know when they get it on the computer.

Whatever the problem, I won't know from here. :(
Tan to white, Blue to white.

I'll be watching.

Riiiiight.



It called for the MAF to have the tan and blue wires re-routed to the two white wires on the blower.
If I remember correctly, those two wires relocate the intake temp sensor location to the SC intercooler. I can look them up if you need me to.
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Old 01-17-2011, 06:23 PM   #845
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If I remember correctly, those two wires relocate the intake temp sensor location to the SC intercooler. I can look them up if you need me to.
Might want to double check and see if the wires were spliced on the correct end.Can not remember what side of the plug you splice into.
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Old 01-17-2011, 06:33 PM   #846
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The blue and tan wires in the harness to the MAF should now be going to the SC IAT sensor. The blue and tan wires coming out of the MAF should no longer be used/connected.

After snipping the wires you splice into the harness side, not the sensor/connector side. The ECM is now reading the S/C IAT instead of the MAF's built in IAT.
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Old 01-17-2011, 07:32 PM   #847
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Randy shot me a pic. It's all good the wiring is right as far as we can tell.

It's got to be either the tune or a bad sensor...

I spoke with the tuner today, he told us to get the ZR1 MAP sensor. that will help dial in the tune.

$30 part.. should be good to go this weekend.
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Old 01-17-2011, 07:35 PM   #848
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5..., 4...., Huummm Do I cut the red wire or the green wire, 3..., 2.....,
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Old 01-17-2011, 08:42 PM   #849
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Tune

There is one here in Ga. About 100 miles away from you inTifton. Has the Dyno to. They say he is real good.
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Old 01-17-2011, 09:22 PM   #850
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Why don't you come with me?...
cause Brooke's planning on being down here this weekend. she gets enough of me talking about cars - i'd hate to put her through a trip to a dyno (but she's very tolerant & understands that's my happy place )
we're gonna do the P'cola beach C5 cruize... you should come out & pull your car in the caravan!!

if that don't work out, i'll be there

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Randy shot me a pic. It's all good the wiring is right as far as we can tell.

It's got to be either the tune or a bad sensor...

I spoke with the tuner today, he told us to get the ZR1 MAP sensor. that will help dial in the tune.

$30 part.. should be good to go this weekend.
well that'd make sense - a factory boost sensor for the same size engine & blower

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5..., 4...., Huummm Do I cut the red wire or the green wire, 3..., 2.....,
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