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Old 03-06-2011, 06:43 PM   #86
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Originally Posted by JusticePete View Post
Aren't there many other factors? Including but not limited to the size of the front tire, the stiffness ratio of the sway bars, shock/spring rates?
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Old 03-06-2011, 07:40 PM   #87
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Xa coilovers are lighter than OE assemblies but the Supercar remotes reservoirs are about the same.

As long as we are speculating about what could be a Z28... On Leno's Garage his video says the Z28 will be a twin turbo direct injection six.

http://www.jaylenosgarage.com/extras...aro-sema-2009/

Would there be a weight reduction with the Leno setup?

How much less?
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Old 03-06-2011, 08:07 PM   #88
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Aren't there many other factors? Including but not limited to the size of the front tire, the stiffness ratio of the sway bars, shock/spring rates?
You can alter the dynamics of a vehicle many ways, but grip is grip. The more grip you have the better a car will handle. Wider is better except in the rain or snow. That isn't the question or challenge. Fitting the grip into a package is where the challenge is.

Selling a car is a package deal. The style takes priority over function. Muscle cars have a Muscle Car Rake. Muscle Cars have Larger rear Wheels. Look at the success we have had with our square track, wheel and tire setup with droopy rear ends.




If you check out what is at the track at NASA and SCCA for production vehicles on the track you'll see a lot of square setups. Why does a car push? The front has lost traction or the rear has more traction? Did the chicken or the egg come first? The more grip the front wheels have the less push a car will have. That is why all the elements of setup you mention are important. They all work better with more grip up front. We didn't invent this. We use it on street cars because it works. if Pedders were to do a Vette, you can expect we will try to fit more rubber on the front end. Not less in the rear. More in the front.
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Old 03-06-2011, 09:00 PM   #89
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Doesn't a larger rear tire create understeer?
EDIT: Whoops I meant understeer, sorry bud. Thanks for catching that. It depends on the front tire size vs. the rear and it also depends on where the under steer happens (turn in? mid corner? exit?). Oversized tires with throttle will usually push the front end unless it is staggered close. The Camaro uses 20" tires in front so right off the bat it is a nightmare but if snap under steer happens and you spin/slide, you can just let off the throttle and regain traction. A single size all around will have you sawing at the wheel. I haven't heard of any snap oversteer in the Camaro though...

Each characteristic in each car is different but a change of wheel/tire combo can fix stock issues... A 285-20" and 305-20" with the weight will under steer.. Weight could be heating your fronts up faster than the back and could also be bad

Most serious road racers will only stagger one size tire (say 275-285) at 1/2 an inch if they have to.. but an inch isn't out of the question... But again, road racers like to rotate tires and save money..

Edit: Both the Saleen and Camaro pictured above this post runs 305's all the way around which is awesome...

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Old 03-06-2011, 09:04 PM   #90
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Originally Posted by JusticePete View Post
You can alter the dynamics of a vehicle many ways, but grip is grip. The more grip you have the better a car will handle. Wider is better except in the rain or snow. That isn't the question or challenge. Fitting the grip into a package is where the challenge is.

Selling a car is a package deal. The style takes priority over function. Muscle cars have a Muscle Car Rake. Muscle Cars have Larger rear Wheels. Look at the success we have had with our square track, wheel and tire setup with droopy rear ends.




If you check out what is at the track at NASA and SCCA for production vehicles on the track you'll see a lot of square setups. Why does a car push? The front has lost traction or the rear has more traction? Did the chicken or the egg come first? The more grip the front wheels have the less push a car will have. That is why all the elements of setup you mention are important. They all work better with more grip up front. We didn't invent this. We use it on street cars because it works. if Pedders were to do a Vette, you can expect we will try to fit more rubber on the front end. Not less in the rear. More in the front.
I am gonna give your site a look in 3 hours, Steeda gave me a decent quote for a non-coil over Tokico package. Im interested in your suspension...

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Old 03-06-2011, 09:41 PM   #91
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Won't a thicker rear bar give more balance to a staggered set up?
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Old 03-06-2011, 10:05 PM   #92
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Originally Posted by 2cnd chance View Post
Won't a thicker rear bar give more balance to a staggered set up?
It should help. But by doing that, you're possibly compromising rear grip...it's somewhat counter-productive. Ideally, you'd want to increase front grip. I don't know how stiff the front bar is...but easing that up could help, but then you get increased body roll...

...Now I see what you're talking about, Pete...needed to think it out...
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Old 03-06-2011, 10:08 PM   #93
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I am gonna give your site a look in 3 hours, Steeda gave me a decent quote for a non-coil over Tokico package. Im interested in your suspension...
Our Mustang parts are AWESOME, but Mustang section of our website is terrible. Please call me with any questions you may have. 248.522.8021. As you are overseas, we can schedule a call at your convenience if you PM or email me your number and preferred time.

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Old 03-06-2011, 10:12 PM   #94
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Won't a thicker rear bar give more balance to a staggered set up?
Yes, it will. With the 5th gen rear suspension geometry combined with other vehicle factors we end up with a monster strong 32mm bar rear and 27mm bar front. Even with our squared setup we still like the 32mm rear bar. Having typed that, if you can fit a 305/30/19 in the rear and the front with no rubbing why not go square?
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Old 03-07-2011, 01:58 AM   #95
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Our Mustang parts are AWESOME, but Mustang section of our website is terrible. Please call me with any questions you may have. 248.522.8021. As you are overseas, we can schedule a call at your convenience if you PM or email me your number and preferred time.

PGB@PeddersUSA.com

Email sent, I can call you free of charge if you don't want to pay long distance...
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Old 03-07-2011, 02:15 AM   #96
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Sir,
I am interested in your suspension and have heard many good things about the company. I currently have a 2011 5.0 Mustang GT, although the car handles great, I have intentions on changing the factory setup for competition. The factory ride height needs to come down and I am looking into downsizing the wheels to 18x9's Enkei PF01 +35mm offsets with 275/40-18's boxed. I need to lower the ride height at least an inch fr, 1" 1/4 rr. I have talked to Frank Stoddard at Steeda about a coil over system but was quoted for the Tokico shocks and Steeda Sports. I am interested in the coil over system, however, based on the quick overview on your site, the magnitude of the upgrades you provide may disqualify me from the class I intend on running. I am keeping the GT N/A and do not plan on any engine/exhaust modifications until next season and I know the stock motor cannot push the car, at its current weight and power, to the limits of your suspension. I still need brakes, pads, wheels and comp tires for this season but desperately need to upgrade the suspension...

I need to watch my weight, I can only eliminate 130lbs from the stock curb. I have two questions, Is there a fixed shock/spring package you offer? and... How much weight does the Justice package add or lose?

I have a German number and a Pittsburgh number via Magic Jack

Pittsburgh: 412-XXX-XXXX
Germany: 0151-5250-1238
Bottom line, this is a SERIOUS upgrade. Without proper tires and brakes, tying my chassis together would either A.) Send me skipping like a stone on water through the turns without good rubber... or B.) Turn my Brembo's into metal shavings...

And honestly, its too much suspension for the power I am putting out... This is GT4 suspension!!!

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Old 03-07-2011, 10:01 AM   #97
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If you go with it, you're gonna LOVE Pete's stuff.

Even if I get the ZL1...chances are high I do the bushing/roll bar upgrade shortly after purchase to tighten things up...
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Old 03-07-2011, 10:13 AM   #98
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Pete,
What if any is the difference between the 2 Pedders Camaros beside the Xa coilovers Vs. Supercar coilovers?

Thanks!
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Old 03-07-2011, 10:27 AM   #99
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Full disclosure on Camaro5, email I sent to Pedders

Bottom line, this is a SERIOUS upgrade. Without proper tires and brakes, tying my chassis together would either A.) Send me skipping like a stone on water through the turns without good rubber... or B.) Turn my Brembo's into metal shavings...

And honestly, its too much suspension for the power I am putting out... This is GT4 suspension!!!
I have you PM and will call today.
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Old 03-07-2011, 10:33 AM   #100
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Pete,
What if any is the difference between the 2 Pedders Camaros beside the Xa coilovers Vs. Supercar coilovers?

Thanks!
Version I: Full Suspension with Xa coilovers, 305/30/19 Bridgestone RE-11s on Forgeline 19x10s all around, stock brakes with Colbalt Friction XR1 front and XR3 rear pads, ProCharger, fluid coolers

Version II: Full Suspension with Supercar coilovers, 305/30/19 Bridgestone RE-11s on Forgeline 19x10s all around, CTS-V brakes with Colbalt Friction XR1 front and XR2 rear pads, ProCharger, fluid coolers, Stage II intercooler, wrapped headers, plenum insulation removed, MAF moved to the intercooler.

Running laps, heat soak results in the computer pulling out timing and RWHP loss. We did everything we could with our setup to reduce RWHP loss on version two. It helped a bit. We found two seconds in the Supercars and brakes.
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Old 03-07-2011, 11:27 AM   #101
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Originally Posted by JusticePete View Post
Version I: Full Suspension with Xa coilovers, 305/30/19 Bridgestone RE-11s on Forgeline 19x10s all around, stock brakes with Colbalt Friction XR1 front and XR3 rear pads, ProCharger, fluid coolers

Version II: Full Suspension with Supercar coilovers, 305/30/19 Bridgestone RE-11s on Forgeline 19x10s all around, CTS-V brakes with Colbalt Friction XR1 front and XR2 rear pads, ProCharger, fluid coolers, Stage II intercooler, wrapped headers, plenum insulation removed, MAF moved to the intercooler.

Running laps, heat soak results in the computer pulling out timing and RWHP loss. We did everything we could with our setup to reduce RWHP loss on version two. It helped a bit. We found two seconds in the Supercars and brakes.
Pete - Have you guys done any work on CTS-Vs (2nd Generation)? I noticed in another thread in the ZL1 section where a V II owner lowered the car and used shorter struts for the ride sensors. The owner didn't comment on the manufacturer of the parts in that threar, but I was just curious of you could comment. I know you guys are getting a ZL1, and I believe Z28 would come with the MR shocks, too (so I'm stretching that further into Z28 development), so I figured you might be putting together a game plan, so-to-speak.

Thanks
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Old 03-07-2011, 12:11 PM   #102
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Pete - Have you guys done any work on CTS-Vs (2nd Generation)? I noticed in another thread in the ZL1 section where a V II owner lowered the car and used shorter struts for the ride sensors. The owner didn't comment on the manufacturer of the parts in that threar, but I was just curious of you could comment. I know you guys are getting a ZL1, and I believe Z28 would come with the MR shocks, too (so I'm stretching that further into Z28 development), so I figured you might be putting together a game plan, so-to-speak.

Thanks
We have a sunny day in Michigan. How is the weather in your area?
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