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Old 02-10-2009, 06:28 PM   #1
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GXP Dyno and Weight results..interesting

Hey, decided to check out the G8 boards. Was interesting to see the GXP rated at 415hp put down 370hp to the wheels..sounds pretty good. Also the weight is supposed to be 4000+...came in at 3992 with 85lbs of gas in it. So looks like the GXP's might be closer to 3900lbs dry. They might be a better comparison to the camaro than previously thought.

Dyno pics
http://www.g8board.com/forums/showth...228#post164228

Weight pics
http://www.g8board.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10703
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Old 02-10-2009, 06:38 PM   #2
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interesting weight info
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31000 for ss1 no options and who in the hell would buy a SS1 V6 for kids SS1 for girls LS3 the only way to go G8 Gxp 200lbs more my bad so lets think here 200lb more 27 less hp so 5 tenths slower now 373 gear now mabe 3tenths slower 4 door car sad so so sad
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Old 02-10-2009, 07:04 PM   #3
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at your sig... I remember that EPIC FAIL of a thread!!
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Old 02-10-2009, 07:47 PM   #4
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What does GM say the GXP weighs, and what do they say the Camaro weighs? I would think that they did not weigh the cars differently, so I would think if they show a weight difference, there is a weight difference. Can't say for fact, but it seems to make sense to me, and cars are like snowflakes when it comes to dynos. Same car, factory set-ups and you might get quite a difference in hp. Like I said I am no expert. I have seen from experience 2 cars same factory yrs and models pull a difference of 30 hp and 20 ft-lbs of torque. Just a thought. Great hp numbers anyways, don't know bout the weight thing for sure though.

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Old 02-10-2009, 08:01 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CDBiker220 View Post
Hey, decided to check out the G8 boards. Was interesting to see the GXP rated at 415hp put down 370hp to the wheels..sounds pretty good. Also the weight is supposed to be 4000+...came in at 3992 with 85lbs of gas in it. So looks like the GXP's might be closer to 3900lbs dry. They might be a better comparison to the camaro than previously thought.

Dyno pics
http://www.g8board.com/forums/showth...228#post164228

Weight pics
http://www.g8board.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10703
so only 11% loss of power?

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at your sig... I remember that EPIC FAIL of a thread!!
I think you mean epic fail of a poster.
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Old 02-10-2009, 08:09 PM   #6
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I posted this here: http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13027 a few days ago. But yes, its still quite impressive what the LS3 can accomplish. What do you think, 380rwhp for the SS M6?
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Old 02-10-2009, 08:43 PM   #7
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from what ive seen with the vettes, ranging from 375-390whp, i think 380whp is a realistic estimate for the camaro. Also in that dyno thread, note the tuner said timing was at only 15.5 degrees in the GXP whereas it was at 22 in the stock vette LS3's they dyno'ed....that they tuned to 25 degrees. I have a feeling the camaro timing lies somewhere inbetween those two. Seams that the differences in horsepower in the LS3's are all in the tune.
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Old 02-10-2009, 08:49 PM   #8
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If the 11% loss at the wheel stays true we are seeing 379HP at the wheel.
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Old 02-10-2009, 09:03 PM   #9
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Also i just wanted to note that he also mentioned his car is a sunroof car, so it has added weight there too, still coming in at 3909 with an empty tank, one without a sunroof might be closer to 3880. The official dry weight of this car is 4050. Someone mentioned that the camaro is likely weight the same way. Maybe it will come in at a lower actual weight too.
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Old 02-11-2009, 12:24 AM   #10
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I think we will see about the same 370 at the wheels because the GXP has the same IRS and Trans that we will be getting.

How big are the wheels on the GXP? Heavier wheels really do make a difference on the dyno and on the streets.

And that weight is pretty close to the SS weight which is discouraging because the GXP is a FOUR door car and ours is a coupe!!!!

EDIT: That is about 70 more RWHP than the 4th Gen Camaros with about 450 more pounds. With the common 100lbs=10 RWHP conversion, the SS should be about 25 RWHP faster than a LS1 Camaro, or about the same as a 4th Gen with a set of Long Tube headers and lid, which usually results in a car that runs mid to mid-low 12's in the quarter mile.
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Old 02-11-2009, 05:59 AM   #11
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There is nothing to indicate that the Camaro should put more to the wheels. Same drivetrain so it should be in roughly the same area. Keep in mind the vett will always put more power to the wheel's. The torque tube and rear end are more effecient than the zeta system.
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Old 02-11-2009, 08:48 AM   #12
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The GXP is rated at 415hp whereas our camaro is rated at 426. Probably all in the tuning...but still..that gives a good reason why it probably will put atleast alittle more to the wheels with the same tranny and IRS. Also if the GXP is lighter than the official spec than who's to say the camaro wont be lighter than the official spec?
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Old 02-11-2009, 09:32 AM   #13
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Great numbers, IMO. I can't help but wonder if GM is underrating the LS3 or if that powertrain and IRS that efficient. Either way, our SS is going to rock!!! Great find. I go there to snipe information too, LOL!
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Old 02-11-2009, 11:10 AM   #14
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Glad im not the only one that goes there to find out info. I was over there looking at the CAI that will be coming from Vararam for the G8 GT. Hoping there is one for the Camaro soon after release.
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Old 02-11-2009, 12:13 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CDBiker220 View Post
The GXP is rated at 415hp whereas our camaro is rated at 426. Probably all in the tuning...but still..that gives a good reason why it probably will put atleast alittle more to the wheels with the same tranny and IRS. Also if the GXP is lighter than the official spec than who's to say the camaro wont be lighter than the official spec?
... I would expect it will dyno slightly higher ..

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Old 02-11-2009, 12:26 PM   #16
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Has anyone dynoed an automatic GXP yet? I'm curious to see the difference in SAE rated HP and actual RWPH to get some idea of the divetrain loss in the auto. It looks like the new M6 is more effiecient than the old T-56, I wonder if the auto is too?
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Old 02-11-2009, 01:12 PM   #17
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Glad im not the only one that goes there to find out info. I was over there looking at the CAI that will be coming from Vararam for the G8 GT. Hoping there is one for the Camaro soon after release.
LOL I figured that place had to be one of the best to go to for any sort of rough comparison to what we could expect. There's a wealth of information there I haven't even been able to get into yet.

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Originally Posted by toehead93 View Post
Has anyone dynoed an automatic GXP yet? I'm curious to see the difference in SAE rated HP and actual RWPH to get some idea of the divetrain loss in the auto. It looks like the new M6 is more effiecient than the old T-56, I wonder if the auto is too?
I know that unlike the 4L60E there isn't a 1:1 gear in the 6L, so it'll probably show a little lower power because it's my understanding anytime you have gear reduction (like in a ring and pinion too) that you loose a little power. How much in this case, I couldn't tell you, but it'll probably read a little less than a 1:1 gear would.
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Old 02-11-2009, 04:11 PM   #18
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I'll put htis out there for you guys to mull over. just some facts.

My LS2 2006 GTO

Weighed in at 4150 with 1/2 tank and me in it. Taking out My weight of 175 at the time and the weight of gas at 7lbs per gallon for 7 gal. = 49lbs The car weighs about 3926 give or take a few lbs. 3900lb car she Dynoed bone stok on a Mustang dyno set to SAE measurement 346 hp 334 tq avg 3 pulls. Same day we took her 12 miles to another friends shop with a Dynamics Dyno it showed only 316 hp and 308 tq.

We did a tune on it and gained 18 hp and 14 tq with HP Tuners. We then decided to change the factory plugs to NGK 5.5s and believe it or not the heat range being cooler mad another 12 hp and 8 tq. For a total of 346 hp and 330 tq.

Both hP and TQ curves where smoothed out from stock and they actually increased from peak at 6200 HP to 6550 HP and 3800 to 4200 TQ.

THe car ran an avg of 8.9s in the 1/8 at 83 MPH before any tuning stock. After tuning I avged. 8.7s @ 86 mph This was incredile how much a good tune and a change to a cooler plug helps out.

I later did a cam change, CAI, LTs with 3" duals 3" X pipe and 3 in out Dynomax Magnums, 3.90 gears. The car made as a base with add ons 374 hp @6500 & 369 TQ @ 4100. So the tune worked to some extent with the addons. But it was showing very lean at 15 to 1 most of the pulls.

So richening her up and tuning the timing a little more netted us 426HP @6700 @ 413 TQ @ 4350 car ran a 8.02@88. This is all on factory stock radials with M6 tranny.

Point being All these cars are heavy and close to same weight. A difference in power stock means nothing because you can change them. Any two dynos wont read the same and a Dyno is only good to measure the change based on modifications made to the car on a given day.

Weather and altitude will drastically change how a car works in different locations. So comparing a dyno to a like or even the same car from Denver to Houston is useless.

Just some insight and facts I have from one of my LS based cars. It is not perfect and I did round the numbers to the closest number for the examples. I will be doing simular tests to my Camaro when I get it and posting those results as well.

Thanks
E
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Old 02-11-2009, 04:50 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RS/SSYellowJacket View Post
I'll put htis out there for you guys to mull over. just some facts.

My LS2 2006 GTO

Weighed in at 4150 with 1/2 tank and me in it. Taking out My weight of 175 at the time and the weight of gas at 7lbs per gallon for 7 gal. = 49lbs The car weighs about 3926 give or take a few lbs. 3900lb car she Dynoed bone stok on a Mustang dyno set to SAE measurement 346 hp 334 tq avg 3 pulls. Same day we took her 12 miles to another friends shop with a Dynamics Dyno it showed only 316 hp and 308 tq.

We did a tune on it and gained 18 hp and 14 tq with HP Tuners. We then decided to change the factory plugs to NGK 5.5s and believe it or not the heat range being cooler mad another 12 hp and 8 tq. For a total of 346 hp and 330 tq.

Both hP and TQ curves where smoothed out from stock and they actually increased from peak at 6200 HP to 6550 HP and 3800 to 4200 TQ.

THe car ran an avg of 8.9s in the 1/8 at 83 MPH before any tuning stock. After tuning I avged. 8.7s @ 86 mph This was incredile how much a good tune and a change to a cooler plug helps out.

I later did a cam change, CAI, LTs with 3" duals 3" X pipe and 3 in out Dynomax Magnums, 3.90 gears. The car made as a base with add ons 374 hp @6500 & 369 TQ @ 4100. So the tune worked to some extent with the addons. But it was showing very lean at 15 to 1 most of the pulls.

So richening her up and tuning the timing a little more netted us 426HP @6700 @ 413 TQ @ 4350 car ran a 8.02@88. This is all on factory stock radials with M6 tranny.

Point being All these cars are heavy and close to same weight. A difference in power stock means nothing because you can change them. Any two dynos wont read the same and a Dyno is only good to measure the change based on modifications made to the car on a given day.

Weather and altitude will drastically change how a car works in different locations. So comparing a dyno to a like or even the same car from Denver to Houston is useless.

Just some insight and facts I have from one of my LS based cars. It is not perfect and I did round the numbers to the closest number for the examples. I will be doing simular tests to my Camaro when I get it and posting those results as well.

Thanks
E
Excellent points to remember.

I too had similar experiences, in a way. When I had my car tuned, the final numbers were 366/371 RWHP/RWTQ to the tire. On the same dyno', about six months later, I was averaging about ten horse' lower, under similar conditions. It just goes to show the dyno' doesn't tell everything and there are so many variables that can effect performance.
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Old 02-11-2009, 10:37 PM   #20
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Old 02-11-2009, 11:20 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by RS/SSYellowJacket View Post
I'll put htis out there for you guys to mull over. just some facts.

My LS2 2006 GTO

Weighed in at 4150 with 1/2 tank and me in it. Taking out My weight of 175 at the time and the weight of gas at 7lbs per gallon for 7 gal. = 49lbs The car weighs about 3926 give or take a few lbs. 3900lb car she Dynoed bone stok on a Mustang dyno set to SAE measurement 346 hp 334 tq avg 3 pulls. Same day we took her 12 miles to another friends shop with a Dynamics Dyno it showed only 316 hp and 308 tq.

We did a tune on it and gained 18 hp and 14 tq with HP Tuners. We then decided to change the factory plugs to NGK 5.5s and believe it or not the heat range being cooler mad another 12 hp and 8 tq. For a total of 346 hp and 330 tq.

Both hP and TQ curves where smoothed out from stock and they actually increased from peak at 6200 HP to 6550 HP and 3800 to 4200 TQ.

THe car ran an avg of 8.9s in the 1/8 at 83 MPH before any tuning stock. After tuning I avged. 8.7s @ 86 mph This was incredile how much a good tune and a change to a cooler plug helps out.

I later did a cam change, CAI, LTs with 3" duals 3" X pipe and 3 in out Dynomax Magnums, 3.90 gears. The car made as a base with add ons 374 hp @6500 & 369 TQ @ 4100. So the tune worked to some extent with the addons. But it was showing very lean at 15 to 1 most of the pulls.

So richening her up and tuning the timing a little more netted us 426HP @6700 @ 413 TQ @ 4350 car ran a 8.02@88. This is all on factory stock radials with M6 tranny.

Point being All these cars are heavy and close to same weight. A difference in power stock means nothing because you can change them. Any two dynos wont read the same and a Dyno is only good to measure the change based on modifications made to the car on a given day.

Weather and altitude will drastically change how a car works in different locations. So comparing a dyno to a like or even the same car from Denver to Houston is useless.

Just some insight and facts I have from one of my LS based cars. It is not perfect and I did round the numbers to the closest number for the examples. I will be doing simular tests to my Camaro when I get it and posting those results as well.

Thanks
E
I agree.

There are so many forgotten variables such as tire width, wheel/tire weight, rotor weight, tire pressure, stickiness/resistance of the tire, how tight the straps were torqued down, engine temp, coolant temp, dyno fan location, ventilation of the facility, tire growth, driveshaft diameter, driveshaft weight, driveshaft length, axle size/length, rear end ratio, tranny oil, gear oil, engine oil, etc. etc.

the list goes on and on.

the same goes for comparing track times. No two tracks are comparable. Actually, in a lot of cases, not even the same track is comparable to itself.
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Old 02-12-2009, 05:51 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CDBiker220 View Post
Hey, decided to check out the G8 boards. Was interesting to see the GXP rated at 415hp put down 370hp to the wheels..sounds pretty good. Also the weight is supposed to be 4000+...came in at 3992 with 85lbs of gas in it. So looks like the GXP's might be closer to 3900lbs dry. They might be a better comparison to the camaro than previously thought.

Dyno pics
http://www.g8board.com/forums/showth...228#post164228

Weight pics
http://www.g8board.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10703
When I checked, the G8 GXP is supposed to weigh 4050, but that didn't include driver and I don't know if it was auto or manual.
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Old 02-18-2009, 11:40 PM   #23
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G8 GXP

I just went to the Ponitac website to see the engine on the G8 GXP and it doesnt matter if you choose automatic or manual you get the same engine.
6.2L SFI.
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Old 02-19-2009, 11:32 AM   #24
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I just went to the Ponitac website to see the engine on the G8 GXP and it doesnt matter if you choose automatic or manual you get the same engine.
6.2L SFI.
Yep, but you were getting hit with gas guzzler tax either way which is probably why they didn't go with an AFM L99 like the Camaro.
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Old 02-19-2009, 05:20 PM   #25
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gas guzzler tax

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Yep, but you were getting hit with gas guzzler tax either way which is probably why they didn't go with an AFM L99 like the Camaro.
So will the LS3 Camaro have a gas guzzler tax?
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