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Old 02-16-2009, 09:33 AM   #1
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GM's dropping Saturn, Pontiac to become niche brand

We got this information this morning at GMI...

http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/f...ly-dead-75492/

Quote:
GMI has been told by sources very close to the situation that management and the Board of Directors have approved closing the Saturn brand as part of the plan for viability. Several options were considered for the brand, as evident with the influx of statements from various GM executives as of late about Saturn. One option was to merge the brand into the Pontiac, GMC, Buick sales channel (as GMI broke several months ago). GM also looked into selling the Saturn brand to their Chinese joint-venture in order to get the brand out of the GM umbrella.
Goodbye Saturn...you've had a good, long run...

UPDATE: PONTIAC REPORTEDLY DEAD...SORTA

http://jalopnik.com/5155377/gm-to-of...ost-of-pontiac

Quote:
As far as Pontiac, it goes away as a division. The nameplate will live on on some vehicles — but we've got no idea what "niche products" they're talking about. More coming shortly.
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Old 02-16-2009, 09:56 AM   #2
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I'm a little disturbed that GM invested so heavily in the "rethink American" campaign and a whole new Saturn lineup when it is going away so soon.

The Sky is a wonderful car. That car should be redesigned as badged as a Chevy Stingray for heritage and style. Shoehorn the LLT in there for a performance V6.
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Old 02-16-2009, 09:56 AM   #3
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Eh, it was bound to happen. I think that GM had too many branches that weren't pulling in money and Saturn was one of them. GM should make it more simple and keep Chevy, Cadillac, Pontiac, GMC, and Buick, and keep some of the other stuff like Daewoo and Vauxhall.
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Old 02-16-2009, 10:26 AM   #4
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can't understand why they confirmed closing the door son Saturn before Hummer.
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Old 02-16-2009, 10:28 AM   #5
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can't understand why they confirmed closing the door son Saturn before Hummer.
Hummer is up for sale. Killing an independent brand is harder than killing a brand that can be rebadged as something else.
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Old 02-16-2009, 10:28 AM   #6
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can't understand why they confirmed closing the door son Saturn before Hummer.
Hummer sale talks are still in progress. Last I heard, a company in China was interested.
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Old 02-16-2009, 10:34 AM   #7
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Wow. Daewoo? I didn't even know that still existed. And what the heck is a Vauxhall?

I'm not one to spend much time studying all of the makes and models of the automotive industry but if I haven't even heard of it, can it be that good of a thing. Maybe we're just 'In a hole' in Alabama.

As far as Saturn, who cares? At this point it's time to trim fat. I agree with Blur though, the Sky is a great car. I know a few people who bought them and they have certainly not had anything bad to say. Chevy Sky would even be a good badge.
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Old 02-16-2009, 10:36 AM   #8
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Wow. Daewoo? I didn't even know that still existed. And what the heck is a Vauxhall?
GM Europe is divided mainly between Opel/Vauxhall. Mainland Europe gets Opels, the UK gets Vauxhalls. Basically same cars, just different brands and different locations.
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Old 02-16-2009, 10:42 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65 View Post
GM Europe is divided mainly between Opel/Vauxhall. Mainland Europe gets Opels, the UK gets Vauxhalls. Basically same cars, just different brands and different locations.

Thanx for the clarification. I don't even have to point out I had never heard of the Opel.

This is why I like this forum.
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Old 02-16-2009, 10:48 AM   #10
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Thanx for the clarification. I don't even have to point out I had never heard of the Opel.

This is why I like this forum.
Sure thing.

And Daewoo is GM's Korean subsidiary. It still exists in the US as the Chevy Aveo and Pontiac G3 ().

GM's Global Brands include...

Buick
Chevrolet
Cadillac
Pontiac
GMC
Hummer
Saab
Saturn
Holden (Australia)
Vauxhall (UK)
Opel (Europe, Asia)
Daewoo (Korea)
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Old 02-16-2009, 11:02 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65 View Post
Sure thing.

And Daewoo is GM's Korean subsidiary. It still exists in the US as the Chevy Aveo and Pontiac G3 ().

GM's Global Brands include...

Buick
Chevrolet
Cadillac
Pontiac
GMC
Hummer
Saab
Saturn
Holden (Australia)
Vauxhall (UK)
Opel (Europe, Asia)
Daewoo (Korea)
Why do they do that?
Do the foreign brands (Holden, Vauxhall, Opel, Daewoo) have the same bodys as say Chevy, Pontiac, or Buick?

And so I was right anyway. Alabama wont see many Vauxhalls.
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Old 02-16-2009, 11:07 AM   #12
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Well I guess my Sky will become an orphan.... Gonna hang on to it as long as I can. Who knows, It may be a collector car someday.

I think all GM needs to look at the Saturn customer service and emulate it. I never had one bad experience at my Saturn dealership. Usually they went above and beyond what I expected in the way of service.
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Old 02-16-2009, 11:11 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irpq11 View Post
Why do they do that?
Do the foreign brands (Holden, Vauxhall, Opel, Daewoo) have the same bodys as say Chevy, Pontiac, or Buick?

And so I was right anyway. Alabama wont see many Vauxhalls.
Not always. For the most part, North American designs are limited to the US/Canada. GMT-based trucks are almost NA exclusive, Lambdas are NA exclusive, a few American designs (CTS, Corvette) are sold in other countries, but for the most part, GM NA designs cars for North America only.

However, there are exceptions...

The Pontiac G8 is nothing more than a rebadged Holden Commodore imported from Australia.

The Saturn Vue, Saturn Astra, and Saturn Sky all have Opel counterparts, the Opel Antara, Opel Astra, and Opel GT.

Buick in the US and Buick in China will be sharing product in the future. For example, the Buick Regal in China, a rebadged Opel Insignia, will be brought stateside as the Buick Regal here.

Chevrolet's becoming a global brand, so expect to see Asian-designed Chevrolets on US soil soon, such as the upcoming Chevy Spark.
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Old 02-16-2009, 11:23 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65 View Post
Not always. For the most part, North American designs are limited to the US/Canada. GMT-based trucks are almost NA exclusive, Lambdas are NA exclusive, a few American designs (CTS, Corvette) are sold in other countries, but for the most part, GM NA designs cars for North America only.

However, there are exceptions...

The Pontiac G8 is nothing more than a rebadged Holden Commodore imported from Australia.

The Saturn Vue, Saturn Astra, and Saturn Sky all have Opel counterparts, the Opel Antara, Opel Astra, and Opel GT.

Buick in the US and Buick in China will be sharing product in the future. For example, the Buick Regal in China, a rebadged Opel Insignia, will be brought stateside as the Buick Regal here.

Chevrolet's becoming a global brand, so expect to see Asian-designed Chevrolets on US soil soon, such as the upcoming Chevy Spark.
\
OK, you've definately taught me something here today. I am going to educate myself more. I knew from going to car shows that this took place like on the Nissan 350Z in Japan is .... a Skyline or something like that and some of these car shows will have a car they selfimported and it's like a big deal. I've even seen cars that they just rebadged themselves to make it seem self imported. Kinda dumb to me but not to them and I don't judge. Some people think It's dumb, the amount of time I spend watching the OU Sooners and Buffalo Bills but each to their own.
Thanx.
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Old 02-16-2009, 11:29 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65 View Post
Not always. For the most part, North American designs are limited to the US/Canada. GMT-based trucks are almost NA exclusive, Lambdas are NA exclusive, a few American designs (CTS, Corvette) are sold in other countries, but for the most part, GM NA designs cars for North America only.

However, there are exceptions...

The Pontiac G8 is nothing more than a rebadged Holden Commodore imported from Australia.

The Saturn Vue, Saturn Astra, and Saturn Sky all have Opel counterparts, the Opel Antara, Opel Astra, and Opel GT.

Buick in the US and Buick in China will be sharing product in the future. For example, the Buick Regal in China, a rebadged Opel Insignia, will be brought stateside as the Buick Regal here.

Chevrolet's becoming a global brand, so expect to see Asian-designed Chevrolets on US soil soon, such as the upcoming Chevy Spark.
The Vue and Astra are Opel designs the Vue is built over here but the Astra is built in Austria and imported.
The Sky of course is an American design and imported Over in Europe as the Opel GT and in Korea as the Daewoo G2X all are built in Whilmington Del.
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Old 02-16-2009, 11:44 AM   #16
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GM Insider Reported that the Camaro would never be put in production right after GM said that they were putting the Camaro in production in 08, CAN YOU BELIEVE WHAT GM INSIDER SAYS???????????????? NOoo
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Old 02-16-2009, 11:47 AM   #17
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GM Insider Reported that the Camaro would never be put in production right after GM said that they were putting the Camaro in production in 08, CAN YOU BELIEVE WHAT GM INSIDER SAYS???????????????? NOoo
Maybe change the name?

'The GM Guesser'
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Old 02-16-2009, 11:57 AM   #18
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GM Insider Reported that the Camaro would never be put in production right after GM said that they were putting the Camaro in production in 08, CAN YOU BELIEVE WHAT GM INSIDER SAYS???????????????? NOoo
GMI also reported that the Buick Regal would be brought stateside from China.

In a few weeks, GM approved the Regal for NA.

Not to mention that a few people in the upper echelons of GM management know of us and apparently frequent the site...case in point, Mark LaNeve, Bob Lutz...
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Old 02-16-2009, 12:24 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65 View Post
GMI also reported that the Buick Regal would be brought stateside from China.

In a few weeks, GM approved the Regal for NA.

Not to mention that a few people in the upper echelons of GM management know of us and apparently frequent the site...case in point, Mark LaNeve, Bob Lutz...
Maybe Camaro5 should buy GM Insider's website and merge the forums since we have the superior inside informants.
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Old 02-16-2009, 12:27 PM   #20
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Maybe Camaro5 should buy GM Insider's website and merge the forums since we have the superior inside informants.
.....................
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Old 02-16-2009, 12:54 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65 View Post
Not always. For the most part, North American designs are limited to the US/Canada. GMT-based trucks are almost NA exclusive, Lambdas are NA exclusive, a few American designs (CTS, Corvette) are sold in other countries, but for the most part, GM NA designs cars for North America only.

However, there are exceptions...

The Pontiac G8 is nothing more than a rebadged Holden Commodore imported from Australia.

The Saturn Vue, Saturn Astra, and Saturn Sky all have Opel counterparts, the Opel Antara, Opel Astra, and Opel GT.

Buick in the US and Buick in China will be sharing product in the future. For example, the Buick Regal in China, a rebadged Opel Insignia, will be brought stateside as the Buick Regal here.

Chevrolet's becoming a global brand, so expect to see Asian-designed Chevrolets on US soil soon, such as the upcoming Chevy Spark.
So from this I hope all of those people saying "buy american" really are not. There really is no "big three" anymore. The big three have their fingers on other makers. Ford-mazda, jaquar, ford europe. GM-Opel, Saturn, Holden, Saab, Vauxhall. Dodge-Mercedes, ..........
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Old 02-16-2009, 01:34 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Blur View Post
...

The Sky is a wonderful car. That car should be redesigned as badged as a Chevy Stingray for heritage and style. Shoehorn the LLT in there for a performance V6.
I'm all for that! I love the Sky way more then the Solstice!
I think i would get Mallet to drop a nice LS3 and 6L80E or something, in it!
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Old 02-16-2009, 01:47 PM   #23
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I think this is a good thing. For GM to really be able to market its cars well and right-size itself for the new market conditions, it really needs to be down to pretty much Chevrolet and Cadillac. A mainstream and luxury brand is simply the easiest way to go to have clear market shares and differentiation. I understand keeping the BPG channel just because it is so expensive to kill a brand, but when cash flow improves it might be a good idea to cut them too.
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Old 02-16-2009, 01:50 PM   #24
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Quote:
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Wow. Daewoo? I didn't even know that still existed. And what the heck is a Vauxhall?
here's a couple pics for ya...
the first is an '04 GTO.
the second is an '04 Vauxhall Monaro VXR.
the third is an Opel Speedster.
Attached Images
   
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Old 02-16-2009, 01:52 PM   #25
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^ Right, the Holden Monaro was re-badged as a Vauxhall Monaro, and it was also sold as Opel I believe before it came stateside in 04 branded as the Pontiac GTO.

And the Opel Speedster is, was basically the pre-courser to the present day kappa platform that the Solstice, Sky are based off of...

Speaking of kappa's those too sadly won't be seeing the light of day in a couple years... :(

Only car from Saturn that I would ever consider owning would be a Saturn Sky Redline. But that's just the enthusiast in me speaking....

Thing with Saturn is that it competes with Chevy, and Pontiac hardcore. The only thing Saturn was good for was re-shaping the way most people thought of GM products especially in the service department. Have to admit from owning one Saturn their service was a lot friendlier and easier than all the Chevy's and Chevy dealers that i've been to. But that's personal experience mostly.

I personally won't be sad to see Saturn go, if Pontiac goes though then I'll be sad....
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