Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com
 
Go Back   Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com > Members Area > General Automotive + Other Cars Discussion

General Automotive + Other Cars Discussion Come chat about other cars.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 02-21-2009, 12:20 PM   #1
War Eagle
 
War Eagle's Avatar
 
Drives: 1969 Chevelle, Avanti, 2010 GT500
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Florida
Posts: 179
Effect of Ethanol on HP and Mileage

The local gas station I have been using has recently gone to a 10% ethanol mix in their gas. Does this have any effect on HP and mileage?


Steve
__________________

Back in a Chevelle after 41 years.
War Eagle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2009, 12:24 PM   #2
Chevyrocker
Weekend Rockstar
 
Chevyrocker's Avatar
 
Drives: Depends on the day...
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: West Palm Beach
Posts: 1,445
E85 ethanol has a higer octane level so it does increase horsepower and decrease fuel economy.
__________________
Shortcuts can slow you down...
Chevyrocker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2009, 12:25 PM   #3
kylepo
 
kylepo's Avatar
 
Drives: 2002 firehawk.....missing 02CE
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Midland MI/salamanca NY
Posts: 360
10%= no noticeable change. E85 gives you more HP more Ft LBs and less MPG
kylepo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2009, 04:55 PM   #4
CamaroSpike23
Mr. Nitpicky
 
CamaroSpike23's Avatar
 
Drives: anything I can get my hands on
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: anywhere and everywhere
Posts: 22,913
Send a message via Yahoo to CamaroSpike23
i dont believe he's talking about switching to e85. he's talking about how his gas station now has conventional gas with up to 10% ethanol added in..... like nearly every other gas station out there. its getting hard to find "pure" gas stations anymore. as for the effects, up to 10% i dont think would be noticable on either hp or mpg
__________________
Never race anything you can't afford to light on fire and push off a cliff
Quote:
Originally Posted by BowtieGuy View Post
Nobody makes CamaroSpike happy. You just disgust him a little less than other people.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bulldogwinters View Post
Read that link that Spike posted, it'll tell you everything you need to know.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WheelmanSS View Post
Post count is truly an accurate measure of how cool someone is on the Internet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Norris View Post
I piss excellence
and fart awesomeness
Quote:
Originally Posted by BowtieGuy View Post
Nobody makes CamaroSpike happy. You just disgust him a little less than other people.
"You can think I'm wrong, but that's no reason to quit thinking.”
Quote:
Originally Posted by Overflow View Post
But not all people were born awesome like you, Spike.
CamaroSpike23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2009, 07:27 PM   #5
MerF
Go Rays!
 
MerF's Avatar
 
Drives: 03 Trailblazer
Join Date: May 2007
Location: St Pete, Florida
Posts: 2,537
I truly believe the 10% thing is a gimmick...however it is DEFINITELY not good for engines not run regularly. Talk to a local outboard mechanic for proof...my dad's engine needed new seals and floats throughout due to the ethanol.

Daily driven cars are no issue, but if it's allowed to sit it does something to the engine...dunno what, but it's a real issue.
MerF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2009, 08:50 PM   #6
RonC
 
Drives: 2010 2SS - RS
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: NW Arkansas
Posts: 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by PoleCat2SSRS2010 View Post
Ethanol requires more fuel consumption always! Its attractiveness comes from the cost per gallon and higher octane (from running cooler). Racing ethanol by comparison to racing gas requires ~33% more consumption and a butt load of maintenance b/c it draws in water from the air. There is an additive but you still have to flush the system when you are done for the day.
As for E85 in comparison to pump gas, you will use more and in the end there is no real savings.
Also, ethanol in general will dry out the rubber seals in the pumps and hoses and cause break down. Not sure what has been engineered into the system and not sure if anyone is talking.

PoleCat is right about ethanol efficiency. It has about a third less BTU's per gallon than gasoline but is higher in octane. BTU's are the units of energy being released (power) and its higher octane rating helps reduce spark knock. 10% ethanol mix would have about 3% less BTU's than a gallon of gasoline, so in theory it would lose 3% in fuel mileage. If you got 23 mpg on gasoline you would get about 22.3 mpg on 10% ethanol mix. In my testing it on my 1500HD truck it averages about .5 mpg less than straight gasoline. For it to be an equal value the price would need to be 3% less and for people using E85, the price would need to be 33% less. I hope this helps you understand it better.
RonC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2009, 11:59 AM   #7
DGthe3
Moderator.ca
 
DGthe3's Avatar
 
Drives: 05 Grand Am GT
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Niagara, Canada
Posts: 22,193
Send a message via MSN to DGthe3
Quote:
Originally Posted by PoleCat2SSRS2010 View Post
Ethanol requires more fuel consumption always!
Not quite. Its been shown that midrange blends (20-30%) seem to have hit a sweet spot where they can provide better fuel economy than regular gasoline.
__________________
Note, if I've gotten any facts wrong in the above, just ignore any points I made with them
__________________
don't believe a thing you read about the next gen Camaro -- as history has proven time and time again:

WE DO NOT TALK ABOUT FUTURE PRODUCT PLANS PERIOD FbodFather
__________________

Camaro5 Fest sub-forum
DGthe3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2009, 03:57 PM   #8
CamaroSpike23
Mr. Nitpicky
 
CamaroSpike23's Avatar
 
Drives: anything I can get my hands on
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: anywhere and everywhere
Posts: 22,913
Send a message via Yahoo to CamaroSpike23
Quote:
Originally Posted by DGthe3 View Post
Not quite. Its been shown that midrange blends (20-30%) seem to have hit a sweet spot where they can provide better fuel economy than regular gasoline.
thats what the OP is asking about. how gas stations have converted to a "up to 10% ethanol" in their gasoline and its effects compared to "100% gasoline"
__________________
Never race anything you can't afford to light on fire and push off a cliff
Quote:
Originally Posted by BowtieGuy View Post
Nobody makes CamaroSpike happy. You just disgust him a little less than other people.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bulldogwinters View Post
Read that link that Spike posted, it'll tell you everything you need to know.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WheelmanSS View Post
Post count is truly an accurate measure of how cool someone is on the Internet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Norris View Post
I piss excellence
and fart awesomeness
Quote:
Originally Posted by BowtieGuy View Post
Nobody makes CamaroSpike happy. You just disgust him a little less than other people.
"You can think I'm wrong, but that's no reason to quit thinking.”
Quote:
Originally Posted by Overflow View Post
But not all people were born awesome like you, Spike.
CamaroSpike23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2009, 04:21 PM   #9
kylepo
 
kylepo's Avatar
 
Drives: 2002 firehawk.....missing 02CE
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Midland MI/salamanca NY
Posts: 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by DGthe3 View Post
Not quite. Its been shown that midrange blends (20-30%) seem to have hit a sweet spot where they can provide better fuel economy than regular gasoline.
source? Now can that mid range be put in a regular GAS er?
kylepo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2009, 11:32 AM   #10
Mr. Wyndham
I used to be Dragoneye...
 
Mr. Wyndham's Avatar
 
Drives: 2014 Camaro 1LE
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Buffalo, NY
Posts: 25,788
Send a message via AIM to Mr. Wyndham
I've been using 10% ever since I bought my car...and I did go for pure gasoline for a month...to test some theories....

The 10% actually gives me better mileage...and the stations who sell it (Sunoco) are always ~10c lower than everyone around them. It's a no-brainer for me.
__________________
"Keep the faith." - - Read Before You Post.
SIGN UP for 2014 Camaro5 HPDE @ Gingerman Raceway!
Mr. Wyndham is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2009, 11:48 AM   #11
CamaroSpike23
Mr. Nitpicky
 
CamaroSpike23's Avatar
 
Drives: anything I can get my hands on
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: anywhere and everywhere
Posts: 22,913
Send a message via Yahoo to CamaroSpike23
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragoneye View Post
I've been using 10% ever since I bought my car...and I did go for pure gasoline for a month...to test some theories....

The 10% actually gives me better mileage...and the stations who sell it (Sunoco) are always ~10c lower than everyone around them. It's a no-brainer for me.
theres about 1-2 stations down here within a reasonable driving distance that still sell pure gasoline. some of our guys will run it at the track and have picked up a few tenths... however, i am unaware of the track conditions on the different days so it could be a moot point.
__________________
Never race anything you can't afford to light on fire and push off a cliff
Quote:
Originally Posted by BowtieGuy View Post
Nobody makes CamaroSpike happy. You just disgust him a little less than other people.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bulldogwinters View Post
Read that link that Spike posted, it'll tell you everything you need to know.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WheelmanSS View Post
Post count is truly an accurate measure of how cool someone is on the Internet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Norris View Post
I piss excellence
and fart awesomeness
Quote:
Originally Posted by BowtieGuy View Post
Nobody makes CamaroSpike happy. You just disgust him a little less than other people.
"You can think I'm wrong, but that's no reason to quit thinking.”
Quote:
Originally Posted by Overflow View Post
But not all people were born awesome like you, Spike.
CamaroSpike23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2009, 11:58 AM   #12
Oracle
 
Drives: Ford Focus
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Phoenix, Az
Posts: 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by DGthe3 View Post
Not quite. Its been shown that midrange blends (20-30%) seem to have hit a sweet spot where they can provide better fuel economy than regular gasoline.
There was an article on a study that found that blends up to 30% ethanol showed infiticimal losses in fuel economy. sadly i cant quote that article because it was published by Chemical and Engineering news, which I only have in magazine form. Most areas blend ethanol when it is in season, a few areas blend year round. Ethanol is an oxygenate, used basically to make sure your fuel has enough oxygen to complete combustion in the cylinders and reduce harmful emissions. its there to displace other oxygenates that have been used in the past such as MTBE. MTBE (methyl tertiary butyl ether) was toxic and could contaminate water sources, making it a very dangerous addative. Ethanol is also a very clean solvent. it can actually clean the engine of grime, carbon buildup, gum buildup, ect ect ect.

As per Ethanols faults: it is a polar compound, making it a hydrophillic substance. that means it will pick up and carry water. all ethanol should be checked for water content before being blended with gasoline. once blended I would assume that the gasoline would be a stronger solute than water, meaning that the little bit of water in the ethanol would fall out. since this is done at the blending racks the water would be separated by the filters at the pump and would never make it into your gas tank. second is that if you have an older car with seals that are soluble in ethanol then they can be damaged by this. so if your thinking of putting any oxygenated fuel in your vintage 69 camaro.... dont... please. otherwise any vehicle less than 20 years old is fine because they use different materials.

The skinny: you wont see a drop in fuel economy or HP. if your fueling up your GT500 with it then it will actually do you good by acting as a detergent. so just keep on truckin
Oracle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2009, 12:51 PM   #13
bob2the2nd
 
Drives: CGM 2LT RS
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: newark, de
Posts: 542
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
There was an article on a study that found that blends up to 30% ethanol showed infiticimal losses in fuel economy. sadly i cant quote that article because it was published by Chemical and Engineering news, which I only have in magazine form. Most areas blend ethanol when it is in season, a few areas blend year round. Ethanol is an oxygenate, used basically to make sure your fuel has enough oxygen to complete combustion in the cylinders and reduce harmful emissions. its there to displace other oxygenates that have been used in the past such as MTBE. MTBE (methyl tertiary butyl ether) was toxic and could contaminate water sources, making it a very dangerous addative. Ethanol is also a very clean solvent. it can actually clean the engine of grime, carbon buildup, gum buildup, ect ect ect.

As per Ethanols faults: it is a polar compound, making it a hydrophillic substance. that means it will pick up and carry water. all ethanol should be checked for water content before being blended with gasoline. once blended I would assume that the gasoline would be a stronger solute than water, meaning that the little bit of water in the ethanol would fall out. since this is done at the blending racks the water would be separated by the filters at the pump and would never make it into your gas tank. second is that if you have an older car with seals that are soluble in ethanol then they can be damaged by this. so if your thinking of putting any oxygenated fuel in your vintage 69 camaro.... dont... please. otherwise any vehicle less than 20 years old is fine because they use different materials.

The skinny: you wont see a drop in fuel economy or HP. if your fueling up your GT500 with it then it will actually do you good by acting as a detergent. so just keep on truckin
Then explain to me why in my engines class I took in college last I was told and shown how and why engines lose both HP and fuel economy using ethanol?

Using a normal gasoline engine we went through every type of fuel you could think of (about 10) and went through the pro's and con's. Basically diesel came out best followed by gasoline (with biodiesel much lower). People mix in ethanol because it saves the manufactures a couple of cents for every gallon produced, while having only a slightly negative effect on HP and fuel economy... but it is there. If it wasnt we would be running pure ethanol engines.

As stated almost perfectly by RonC there are less BTU's in ethanol which cause the drop in efficiency.

Im just going to take a guess but I would have to think that the study you read probably had an engine adjusted for a ethanol/gas mix, thats the only way an engine is not going to see a performance drop. In engines that dont do that there will always be less HP and gas mileage.

edit: I also have to assume this is the difference between a mechanical and chemical engineering stand point. The chemical engineer is arguing why in a perfect world it works and the mechanical engineers are arguing that it isnt a perfect world thus it doesnt.
bob2the2nd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2009, 02:26 PM   #14
Oracle
 
Drives: Ford Focus
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Phoenix, Az
Posts: 71
Ethanol saves the manufactures a little bit of cash because of a tax waver for oxygenating the fuel. like i said before adding ethanol adds oxygen to the fuel resulting in a more complete burn of the gasoline. for engines that naturally run rich in fuel (not race engines, race engines are normally spot on in the tuning or actually run a bit lean. production motors are run rich to run cooler and increase their life expectancy) is where you will see the benefit. at the same time Ethanol has less potential energy, a negative side effect from short chain of ethanol, not leaving very much to be burned. so overall on a production engine you have less net potential energy but greater kinetic energy because more of the gasoline gets burned.

If you burned straight ethanol you will gain horsepower but lose a lot of fuel economy. thats because of two things, first everybody knows ethanol has a higher octane, allowing for greater compression and more aggressive tuning. the second is that because the molecule chain is so short it burns very very fast. to put this in perspective Diesel engines produce power very low because diesel fuel is a large molecule. that large molecule takes a long time to burn, hence the low RPMs give it the time to do that. you will also notice diesel power falls off very quickly at above 3000 rpms because your no longer burning all of the fuel. Ethanol has the opposit, reletively weak low RPMs because it doesnt need all that time to burn, so it wastes time after everything is spent. but once you rev up the motor to say 7k (just an estimate) rpms then your burning it all just about as quick as possible and will produce your best power in that range. Diesel provides better fuel economy because of two things: the molecule is larger so holds more PE, and friction increases exponentially with rpms, so it produces maximum power where frictional losses are minimal. Gasoline is kind of the middle child between these two fuels.

so overall when your talking about an all OEM engine that is tuned to run rich you wont be burning all that fuel, thus hurting your fuel economy. if you add ethanol your going to burn more of that fuel making up for its lesser BTUs up to, as the study shows, approx. 30%. from a chemical engineer standpoint it would say that adding ethanol is throwing away PE dont do it. from a Mechanical engineer standpoint you dont need to add oxygen to burn all your fuel, just tune the thing right. so dont do it. we do it to fix problems created by fixing problems.
Oracle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2009, 02:34 PM   #15
gto_in_nc
 
Drives: 1997 Jeep Wrangler -for now...
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Wilmington, NC
Posts: 67
Well-stated, Oracle. Thank you!
gto_in_nc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2009, 03:08 PM   #16
Mr_Draco


 
Mr_Draco's Avatar
 
Drives: 2SS/RS
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Western North Carolina
Posts: 6,352
...

*Scratches head*

For those that ain't well edumacated?
Mr_Draco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2009, 03:42 PM   #17
gto_in_nc
 
Drives: 1997 Jeep Wrangler -for now...
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Wilmington, NC
Posts: 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Draco View Post
...

*Scratches head*

For those that ain't well edumacated?
Ethanol has less chemical energy than gasoline but helps with oxygenation so gasoline burns more completely with a gas/alcohol blend, generally evening things out --especially with rich-running OEM tunes (which intentionally don't aim for complete combustion, preferring engine safety and unburned hydrocarbons over increased efficiency and oxides of nitrogen.)

Some forum members are reporting slight personal gains in fuel ecomony while others are reporting slight drops.

Make more sense?
gto_in_nc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2009, 03:50 PM   #18
CamaroSpike23
Mr. Nitpicky
 
CamaroSpike23's Avatar
 
Drives: anything I can get my hands on
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: anywhere and everywhere
Posts: 22,913
Send a message via Yahoo to CamaroSpike23
10% ethanol blend - helps clean the engine and its emissions
85% ethanol blend - possibility for more power but lower mpg
__________________
Never race anything you can't afford to light on fire and push off a cliff
Quote:
Originally Posted by BowtieGuy View Post
Nobody makes CamaroSpike happy. You just disgust him a little less than other people.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bulldogwinters View Post
Read that link that Spike posted, it'll tell you everything you need to know.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WheelmanSS View Post
Post count is truly an accurate measure of how cool someone is on the Internet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Norris View Post
I piss excellence
and fart awesomeness
Quote:
Originally Posted by BowtieGuy View Post
Nobody makes CamaroSpike happy. You just disgust him a little less than other people.
"You can think I'm wrong, but that's no reason to quit thinking.”
Quote:
Originally Posted by Overflow View Post
But not all people were born awesome like you, Spike.
CamaroSpike23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2009, 04:17 PM   #19
DGthe3
Moderator.ca
 
DGthe3's Avatar
 
Drives: 05 Grand Am GT
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Niagara, Canada
Posts: 22,193
Send a message via MSN to DGthe3
Let me know if I'm way out in left field on this:

Diesel burns very hot, gasoline burns hot, ethanol burns sorta hot. NOx requires high temperatures to form. In diesels, this is unavoidable. In gasoline engines, there is a NOx spike at the perfect stoich ratio. Traditionally, engines run rich to avoid this. Moderate amounts of cooler burning ethanol will offset the temperature enough to prevent excess NOx. This allows for less fuel to be used (since it no longer needs excess fuel).

Does this make sense to guys 'in the know'?
__________________
Note, if I've gotten any facts wrong in the above, just ignore any points I made with them
__________________
don't believe a thing you read about the next gen Camaro -- as history has proven time and time again:

WE DO NOT TALK ABOUT FUTURE PRODUCT PLANS PERIOD FbodFather
__________________

Camaro5 Fest sub-forum
DGthe3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2009, 06:56 PM   #20
knowitman
Camaro fan since birth
 
knowitman's Avatar
 
Drives: 2013 ZL1
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Possum Trot, KY
Posts: 467
Quote:
Originally Posted by PoleCat2SSRS2010 View Post
Ethanol requires more fuel consumption always!
In an engine truly designed for ethanol and not gasoline, you can get about the same gas mileage. Even though ethanol contains less BTU/gallon, it's higher octane rating/activation energy allows for a higher compression which helps the engine run closer to it's thermodynamic ideal efficiency meaning that a lower percentage of energy is lost as heat.
knowitman is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2009, 07:40 PM   #21
The_Stache
SoCal Race Team #13
 
The_Stache's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 1SS:RS:LS3:SW
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 1,730
Quote:
Originally Posted by knowitman View Post
In an engine truly designed for ethanol and not gasoline, you can get about the same gas mileage. Even though ethanol contains less BTU/gallon, it's higher octane rating/activation energy allows for a higher compression which helps the engine run closer to it's thermodynamic ideal efficiency meaning that a lower percentage of energy is lost as heat.
Exactly, the problem lies herein that there is no mass-commercially available vehicle designed to specifically run on e85.

(and running an e85 designed engine on gasoline is just as bad as running a gasoline designed engine on e85)
__________________
A.K.A - Diarmadhi (old handle) - So much to do.. So little money
Owner : Fast-Stache Industries LLC
The_Stache is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2009, 08:05 PM   #22
CamaroSpike23
Mr. Nitpicky
 
CamaroSpike23's Avatar
 
Drives: anything I can get my hands on
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: anywhere and everywhere
Posts: 22,913
Send a message via Yahoo to CamaroSpike23
Quote:
Originally Posted by diarmadhi View Post
Exactly, the problem lies herein that there is no mass-commercially available vehicle designed to specifically run on e85.

(and running an e85 designed engine on gasoline is just as bad as running a gasoline designed engine on e85)

I still say we should adopt Brazil's setup of 100% ethanol.... aka Gasohol
__________________
Never race anything you can't afford to light on fire and push off a cliff
Quote:
Originally Posted by BowtieGuy View Post
Nobody makes CamaroSpike happy. You just disgust him a little less than other people.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bulldogwinters View Post
Read that link that Spike posted, it'll tell you everything you need to know.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WheelmanSS View Post
Post count is truly an accurate measure of how cool someone is on the Internet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Norris View Post
I piss excellence
and fart awesomeness
Quote:
Originally Posted by BowtieGuy View Post
Nobody makes CamaroSpike happy. You just disgust him a little less than other people.
"You can think I'm wrong, but that's no reason to quit thinking.”
Quote:
Originally Posted by Overflow View Post
But not all people were born awesome like you, Spike.
CamaroSpike23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2009, 08:17 PM   #23
zebra
just can't seem to leave
 
zebra's Avatar
 
Drives: your mom wild!!
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: cold & windy
Posts: 11,604
^^ i almost converted my explorer to do that
__________________
zebra is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2009, 10:54 PM   #24
RonC
 
Drives: 2010 2SS - RS
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: NW Arkansas
Posts: 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by diarmadhi View Post
Exactly, the problem lies herein that there is no mass-commercially available vehicle designed to specifically run on e85.

(and running an e85 designed engine on gasoline is just as bad as running a gasoline designed engine on e85)
Some GM truck and car engines are designed to run on E85. Their computers are specifically setup to moniter the ethanol blend % in the tank and adjust the air fuel ratio required for that blend in the tank at the time. 100% gasoline AFR is set to 14.68 to 1 and 100% ethanol is 9.0 to 1 AFR. E85 is set at 9.7 AFR and 10% is 14.0 to 1 in the flex-fuel truck tuning. The 5.3L truck engines set up for flex-fuel use 36 lb per hour injectors vs. 24 lb per hour without FF. They have to flow much more fuel per hour to produce the same amount of energy (power) in the same length of time. Real world result; a truck that gets 15 mpg on gasoline gets about 11 mpg on E85. My real world results using 10% ethanol blend gets about .5 mpg less than 100% gasoline in my truck with it's computer optimized for best mileage with each fuel.
RonC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2009, 07:34 AM   #25
knowitman
Camaro fan since birth
 
knowitman's Avatar
 
Drives: 2013 ZL1
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Possum Trot, KY
Posts: 467
Quote:
Originally Posted by RonC View Post
Some GM truck and car engines are designed to run on E85. Their computers are specifically setup to moniter the ethanol blend % in the tank and adjust the air fuel ratio required for that blend in the tank at the time. 100% gasoline AFR is set to 14.68 to 1 and 100% ethanol is 9.0 to 1 AFR. E85 is set at 9.7 AFR and 10% is 14.0 to 1 in the flex-fuel truck tuning. The 5.3L truck engines set up for flex-fuel use 36 lb per hour injectors vs. 24 lb per hour without FF. They have to flow much more fuel per hour to produce the same amount of energy (power) in the same length of time. Real world result; a truck that gets 15 mpg on gasoline gets about 11 mpg on E85. My real world results using 10% ethanol blend gets about .5 mpg less than 100% gasoline in my truck with it's computer optimized for best mileage with each fuel.
What diarmadhi is saying is that a car designed to run specifically on E85 will have a higher compression ratio allowing it to run as efficiently as it can. Trying to use gasoline in one of these engines will cause it to knock and ping.
knowitman is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:29 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.