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Old 04-13-2011, 11:57 AM   #1
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Z28 release April 2012?

So I was reading this months Car and Driver magazine under '25 cars worth waiting for' ... then I read the ZL1 part which said to expect a release on Feb 2012 as the "horse power edition" ... it went on to say that GM will be matching fords every move and to expect a "track and performance pack edition" for April 2012 likely to be later named as the Z28 to match the Mustang Boss... and the performance pack edition will likely feature mostly improved handling and suspension

anyone else have information on this? My thinking is this, why get the ZL1 to to match the GT 500 when the 'Z28' is probably just around the corner. If GM matches fords mustang boss in its Z28, than the Z28 would have to have a 1/4 mile of at least 12.3 second and 0-60 in 4 seconds flat...

the ZL1 however, would likely be faster than that by what? ... 0.3 seconds in the 1/4 and maybe .2 seconds faster on the 0-60? ... Are these small time improvements on the ZL1 really worth having compromised suspension/handling compared to the Z28?

here is a very similar article to the one I read in the magazine:
http://www.caranddriver.com/features...l1_z28-feature
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Old 04-13-2011, 12:22 PM   #2
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Who knows. What really doesn't make sense, is why Chevy is going out of order of nameplates. The V6 RS, Z28, SS, ZL1...

Just wondering why the Z28 will be faster than the SS. It's always been the other way around.
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Old 04-13-2011, 12:23 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GbrilliantQ View Post
Who knows. What really doesn't make sense, is why Chevy is going out of order of nameplates. The V6 RS, Z28, SS, ZL1...

Just wondering why the Z28 will be faster than the SS. It's always been the other way around.
You're opening a big can "o" worms with that question.
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Old 04-13-2011, 12:35 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by GbrilliantQ View Post

Just wondering why the Z28 will be faster than the SS. It's always been the other way around.
its just the way it is lol
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Old 04-13-2011, 01:34 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by GbrilliantQ View Post
Who knows. What really doesn't make sense, is why Chevy is going out of order of nameplates. The V6 RS, Z28, SS, ZL1...

Just wondering why the Z28 will be faster than the SS. It's always been the other way around.
We dont know if the Z28 will be faster but the first gen Z28.....

ok ok im off topic i will just stop

Do a search and you will learn all about this can of worms
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Old 04-13-2011, 03:31 PM   #6
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It's nothing other than a marketing scam brought to you by GM (which I don't necessarily disagree with)! A "save the best for last" or "save the most buzzed about for last" sorta scheme.

The Z28 was being asked about before the first production cars were rolling off the line in '09!

I also like how GM played the "When the latest GT500 comes out, we'll grab one and build a performance car against it!" (ZL1). I have a feeling that they pretty much have a Z28 built, but want to get their hands on a Boss to put them together on the proving grounds and tweak their winner. And while I've been reading the reports on the Boss, it's evident that Ford built one hell of a track car! If the Z28 is in fact built to compete with the Boss, I'd seriously consider trading my SS for one!
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Old 04-13-2011, 04:01 PM   #7
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I know why, just thinking out loud sorry for the topicishness..

Hopefully if there is a Z, they can get the weight down for the Z to win against the Boss. Weight is the issue IMO
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Old 04-13-2011, 04:15 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GbrilliantQ View Post
Who knows. What really doesn't make sense, is why Chevy is going out of order of nameplates. The V6 RS, Z28, SS, ZL1...

Just wondering why the Z28 will be faster than the SS. It's always been the other way around.
You can't go by this rating!
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Old 04-13-2011, 05:01 PM   #9
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z28 ftw
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Old 04-14-2011, 03:03 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond View Post
I also like how GM played the "When the latest GT500 comes out, we'll grab one and build a performance car against it!" (ZL1). I have a feeling that they pretty much have a Z28 built, but want to get their hands on a Boss to put them together on the proving grounds and tweak their winner. And while I've been reading the reports on the Boss, it's evident that Ford built one hell of a track car! If the Z28 is in fact built to compete with the Boss, I'd seriously consider trading my SS for one!
That is a great observation. If this is possibly the case, I would look for GM to reverse engineer the Z28 engine from their Grand Am GS car. Let me do some research into the GS LS3 engine and I will get back to this thread on what I find. Not saying that this engine is in the works right now and its out there racing. It would give us a benchmark of what to expect at a minimum and, information about the current setup will be well known to Z28ist in this thread any any abrupt engine changes in Grand Am would tell us that "This is it".

Be Right Back...
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Old 04-14-2011, 03:50 AM   #11
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If the Z28 is to be reverse engineered from the Camaro GS in Grand Am, here are some disqualifying factors that have to be taken into consideration. This is kind of a long post but the "QUOTES" are taken from the 2011 Grand Am Rule Book and can be read in its entirety here: http://www.grand-am.com/news/index.cfm?cid=13517&rr=no
Be sure to scroll down to the Continental Tire Sports Car Challenge section

First, the minimum production rate.
Quote:
Eligible cars will ordinarily be those described in manufacturer’s catalogs, produced at a
minimum rate of 500 units per year, and available for purchase through normal dealer outlets 30 days or more prior to competing in an event. Exemption from minimum production requirements must be approved by GRAND-AM.
and...
Quote:
3-3.1 GRAND-AM may use any legitimate forms, publications, original components and vehicles describing the production OEM (original equipment manufacturer) specifications of the eligible makes and models in order to verify compliance with these regulations.
GRAND-AM may require a competitor to furnish factory specifications prior to competing.
3-3.2 GRAND-AM may establish specifications that are not per the original manufacturer specification.
3-3.3 Each car must conform to the standard configuration as delivered to U.S. consumers by the manufacturer except where these regulations allow or require modifications.
The CTS-V or ZL1 braking system cannot be migrated over to the Z28. Those braking systems are for heavy vehicles anyway and since the Z28 is aiming to be at the SS's weight, they would be useless. The ZR1/Z06 Carbon Ceramic might be eligible but only the disc, not the calipers. Most of these Grand Am cars use smaller disc brakes over the stock. I have a simple formula that can determine a vehicles required braking system requirements.
Quote:
GRAND-AM may allow a brake upgrade for specific models. If allowed, only one two-piece (split into two halves) caliper of aluminum alloy with a maximum of four pistons and two pads per wheel permitted.
It is safe to assume that the engine will not be forced induction of any type. This actually takes a lot of pressure of the independent teams to do so.
Quote:
7-6.1 All forced induction vehicles will be assessed an additional fee when registering for the season. This is to offset the cost for data collection equipment for these cars. Forced induction teams will also be required to purchase (from GRAND-AM) and install the following sensors:
ST453 Boost sensor with DSP ST543 IR Lap Time Rx
The boost sensor may be collected by GRAND-AM at any time to verify calibration and accuracy. Replacement for sensors damaged in use will be the responsibility of the team.
The data acquisition modules will be randomly assigned by GRAND-AM. Only a GRAND-AM official may access the information on the unit. These units must be returned to at the conclusion of each event.
Engine specifications:
Quote:
7-8.1 Engine management systems may be replaced with non-OEM systems with GRAND-AM approval. Effective 01/01/08 all GS and 05/01/08 all ST Continental Tire Sports Car Challenge cars that choose to use an aftermarket ECU must use the GRAND-AM specified ECU and wiring harness. Spec ECU and wiring harnesses cannot be modified in any way.
7-8.2 The following components may be tooled enough for balancing only - pistons, rods, crankshaft, harmonic balancer, flywheel and clutch.
7-8.3 The lightest rod and piston must remain unaltered.
7-8.4 The crankshaft and harmonic balancer may weigh no less than the OEM specification.
7-8.5 Aftermarket pistons may be used provided they remain identical in weight, dimension and form.
7-8.6 Allowed to overbore block up to .030 maximum.
7-8.7 The oil pan and oil pick up may be modified (not the pump)
7-8.8 Engine oil Accu-sump system and valve is permitted.
7-8.9 All pushrod engines may use aftermarket blueprinted or adjustable length pushrods, provided
they are of the same material and configuration of the original.
7-8.10 Other items that may be replaced include cam gears, sprockets and chains. 7-8.11 The airbox and air filter are free on normally aspirated cars unless otherwise specified by
GRAND-AM. Ram air induction is not permitted.
7-8.12 GRAND-AM will provide restrictors when required. Teams will be responsible for gaskets and bolts to attach the restrictors. Return of the restrictors is mandatory following each event or fines will be imposed.
Here is the exact Camaro requirements and regulations page.
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Old 04-14-2011, 04:13 AM   #12
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For those of you who do not know this, Grand Am is becoming a very BIG deal. It was purchased by NASCAR on September 4, 2008 and since then has become a breeding ground for competition sport coupe's just like the Trans Am days of old. BMW came over from SCCA in 2005, trying to destroy the American sports coupes. BMW is the enemy here and since coming to Grand Am, interest in the sport grew considerably. This is where the GT vs. M3 battle originated from.
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Old 04-14-2011, 09:41 AM   #13
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So basically only some parts may come from other models? No brake calipers from zo6/zr1 and no FI... no magnetic ride control and much less weight .... suspension will be based off grand am?
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Old 04-14-2011, 08:29 PM   #14
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So basically only some parts may come from other models? No brake calipers from zo6/zr1 and no FI... no magnetic ride control and much less weight .... suspension will be based off grand am?
The Boss 302 IS the Grand Am car. Last year in Grand Am GS, Multimatic ran the only Boss 302 and was had Ford factory support. The Boss didn't do good at all last year, it never broke down.. it had some electrical problems. Much like the 1969 Boss 302, it ran but the entire field other than the factory backed car was still running the 289ci Mustangs in that class (The heavier class was running the big block but that class went away). This year, the Boss covers the entire field with the exception of a few GT's still running. The NEW Grand Am rules state that the vehicle must be a production model and there is a limit to how old the model and engine can be. This is the reason Ford doesn't run the FR500C "Boy Racer" anymore (the FR500S and FR500GT4 are ineligible). The FR500C production is basically limited to the teams that are still running them now so they can continue to run until the production rule is in full effect.

That means the Camaro GS WILL have to be replaced very soon by either an SS or something of another caliper (PUN POINTS!!!). The Camaro is the only entry right now that doesn't use a factory nameplate. This might be why we see a 4SS coming this year because the Camaro is struggling and most of that has to do with the suspension setup (and some other things, but it is not the drivetrain). If I remember correctly, there was no 2010 FR500C, S or GT4 so that means season '10 and season '11 so far has been run with the FR500C and these are usually teams that are independent and are always strapped for cash. Grand Am may make an exception for these teams because it would shrink the field down to a very small amount of cars. If anyone here remembers the 2007 ALMS GT1 class that had two Dodge Vipers and two Corvettes that ran the class. In 2008 the GT1 class had two Corvettes (team mates) that remained in the class and Corvettes won the championship, in 2009 they dropped down to GT2. Grand Am, now controlled by NASCAR, is insuring that bleeding teams of their money to conform to quickly changing rule book doesn't happen.

I would predict the 2012 Camaro 4SS will be the stand in model until the Z28 is ready. I will be watching the races closely and try to dig up info month by month as the FE4 SS see production in these coming months to see if any changes are made. We can continue to watch Grand Am GS to see if the announcers make any mistakes like they did with the Boss 302 waaaaay back before it was officially made public, 29 July, 2010.. check it out:


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