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Old 04-13-2011, 01:04 PM   #1
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New engine, Goodbye all 3.6l DI mods :(

looks like wre gonna be forgotten now = /
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Old 04-13-2011, 01:20 PM   #2
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Old 04-13-2011, 01:26 PM   #3
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I was two phone calls away from being a test mule for a TT for the V6. I'm glad I didn't now.

I'm speaking just with FI, if you're going to spend that much time and money on an FI for the V6, why not just get the SS? Thats what I'm planning on doing now. More options for the V8's and after all the mods you can do with the V6, it still won't add up to the SS.

Don't get me wrong, I love my 1LT RS! I wish I could be driving it right now.
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Old 04-13-2011, 01:59 PM   #4
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I was two phone calls away from being a test mule for a TT for the V6. I'm glad I didn't now.

I'm speaking just with FI, if you're going to spend that much time and money on an FI for the V6, why not just get the SS? Thats what I'm planning on doing now. More options for the V8's and after all the mods you can do with the V6, it still won't add up to the SS.

Don't get me wrong, I love my 1LT RS! I wish I could be driving it right now.
In what respect? I'm putting out the same HP at the crank as a LS3 on only 4.5 psi. The difference between the 1SS and an LS is about the same as a turbo kit for the LS. Then it doesn't cost anything to turn up the boost (until you break something). You would have to do full bolt ons and a cam to get the LS3 in a range where it puts out more power than the LLT at 9-10 psi. Then you can spend the money you would have spent on those parts lowering the compression ratio and getting forged pistions and bigger fuel pump for the LLT and up the boost some more. Basically, if money is the issue you have to be shooting for > 700+ HP at the crank before the LS3/L99 become the more cost effective route. Until then it isn't a big enough difference to worry about.
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Old 04-13-2011, 02:00 PM   #5
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perhaps he means the new LFX:

http://media.gm.com/content/media/us..._camaro_engine

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Old 04-13-2011, 02:07 PM   #6
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Yeah, I think that's what he was talking about.

Do you guys think this is the nail in the coffin for possible superchargers for the LLT? Or maybe the two engines will be similar enough to share the same mods?
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Old 04-13-2011, 02:10 PM   #7
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it only puts out 11 more hp, a CAI and exhaust can match that. The LFX engine should be tuned to 350 to make it a worthwhile upgrade. These measly hp #s game between Ford and GM is starting to get old. If you're going to bump up the #s(HP/torque), make it substantial(50 @ a time, imo)...up the ante a little more
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Old 04-13-2011, 02:27 PM   #8
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Head swap maybe??? Won't work for me with the turbos (as is), but then we also use the new intake manifold and lose some weight to boot. What do you guys think?
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Old 04-13-2011, 03:10 PM   #9
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Huh...

The displacement is still the same and just guessing form the picture, the placement is the same too... That said, any turbo kit built for this should work for the engines in our cars too... Not to mention that with the v6 you still have less weight and better mileage then the v8 (even better if you turbo it). So chin up my friend... something better always comes along, you gotta learn to be happy with what ya got . I think TT kits are not coming to us quickly enough not because a new engine is coming out, but because on average v6 camaro owners dont have the money to install one. If they did, they prolly would have bought an SS lol. If you purchased your v6 in the hopes that a TT kit costing 4k with install would come out... then you prolly should have saved a little more and picked up the SS. Just my 2 cents.
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Old 04-13-2011, 03:14 PM   #10
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The question is, how different will the computer be? That's the problem most people are seeing when it comes to the LLT.
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Old 04-13-2011, 03:16 PM   #11
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The displacement is still the same and just guessing form the picture, the placement is the same too... That said, any turbo kit built for this should work for the engines in our cars too... Not to mention that with the v6 you still have less weight and better mileage then the v8 (even better if you turbo it). So chin up my friend... something better always comes along, you gotta learn to be happy with what ya got . I think TT kits are not coming to us quickly enough not because a new engine is coming out, but because on average v6 camaro owners dont have the money to install one. If they did, they prolly would have bought an SS lol. If you purchased your v6 in the hopes that a TT kit costing 4k with install would come out... then you prolly should have saved a little more and picked up the SS. Just my 2 cents.
Except for the integrated exhaust manifolds. I'm not saying you couldn't modify a current TT setup to work (still has to have a pipe), but what we have right now for the TTs won't just bolt on to the LFX.
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Old 04-13-2011, 03:21 PM   #12
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I love my 2010 RS. I would not change a thing. I do wish it got better gas mileage in town. My Red Camaro still turns heads... MS.05 (Pronounce Miss 05, my stock car number in dirt track racing)
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Old 04-13-2011, 03:25 PM   #13
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I love my 2010 RS. I would not change a thing. I do wish it got better gas mileage in town. My Red Camaro still turns heads... MS.05 (Pronounce Miss 05, my stock car number in dirt track racing)
Welcome aboard!

Any word on them opening up the road course in Memphis. I'm glad the 1/4 mi. is open again, but it is a pain to drive to Tulsa or Dallas for the road course!
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Old 04-13-2011, 03:42 PM   #14
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Except for the integrated exhaust manifolds. I'm not saying you couldn't modify a current TT setup to work (still has to have a pipe), but what we have right now for the TTs won't just bolt on to the LFX.
Thats true... I didnt see the integrated exhaust manifold. That could be problematic. Well... it seems like there is nothing we can do now... I think cheap bolt-on TT kits are gonna be out of the question. But there is still hope for SC kits.
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Old 04-13-2011, 04:27 PM   #15
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lol... gawd, why are so many ppl qq'ing over the new engine. I think it's a good thing GM keeps coming up with new stuff.
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Old 04-13-2011, 05:07 PM   #16
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In what respect? I'm putting out the same HP at the crank as a LS3 on only 4.5 psi. The difference between the 1SS and an LS is about the same as a turbo kit for the LS. Then it doesn't cost anything to turn up the boost (until you break something). You would have to do full bolt ons and a cam to get the LS3 in a range where it puts out more power than the LLT at 9-10 psi. Then you can spend the money you would have spent on those parts lowering the compression ratio and getting forged pistions and bigger fuel pump for the LLT and up the boost some more. Basically, if money is the issue you have to be shooting for > 700+ HP at the crank before the LS3/L99 become the more cost effective route. Until then it isn't a big enough difference to worry about.
How many LLT's are at 9-10 psi? Wouldn't mind seeing some track numbers from a few.....
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Old 04-13-2011, 05:16 PM   #17
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I wonder what the performance numbers will be for the 2012. The LFX has 11 more HP, but supposedly TQ is the same. I think someone said the gearing is different to allow better gas mileage. So I'm thinking we might actually have the better setup (esp. with mods)?
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Old 04-13-2011, 05:25 PM   #18
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lol... gawd, why are so many ppl qq'ing over the new engine. I think it's a good thing GM keeps coming up with new stuff.
ENJOY your car. This buyer's remorse thing is getting old FAST!!
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Old 04-13-2011, 05:35 PM   #19
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As mentioned before, it is still a 3.6L DI engine. Looks like they just took the next iteration in the cycle of this engine family. The only thing that would make me wonder about future supercharger mods from said companies who said they would to not to...would be that they do mention the reinforcing the engine block along with stronger, lighter pistons (not worred about this though) which means it can handle more stress than the current LLT engine block. Which could affect after-market FI options on which engine they will end up being for. Which means when the LFX comes out and shops start doing FI on them make sure to specify LLT in bold in email so they don't try to sell you the wrong part. Case in point, when I emailed DT about their shortie header gains I mentioned I had a 2010 Camaro RS and they emailed me the dyno graph for the SS

But then again, one has to consider how much strength they added to the block (meaning how much more pressure can it handle over the current block without overstressing/excessive wear)? And with the larger valves for the heads it does sound like they have been purusing the V6 forums as I do recall another member porting and polishing the heads and intake manifold for increased power output. Would be curious about the new intake manifold though, and if they will have a new ECM for the 2012 model year that would make it tuner friendly, meaning all of us LLT guys with enough patience to tinker and spend some money could end up making a kickass LLT engine build based on what has been done currently as well as on the LFX.

And that's my .02 rant!
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Old 04-13-2011, 05:44 PM   #20
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I wonder how much the engine alone would cost or say the engine block itself, depending on how much of it is dimensionally the same as the LLT as far as connection points for various parts. Would be intersting to be able to swap out engine parts and create a monster V6, depending on how well this LFX truly is over the LLT.
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Old 04-13-2011, 06:16 PM   #21
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How many LLT's are at 9-10 psi? Wouldn't mind seeing some track numbers from a few.....
Just Z-maddness. I hope to be there this summer. Orange5thGen will probably get there before me. MyWorld is finishing up some stuff on his and may also get there before me.

Rumor has it there's on in Puerto Rico running 20+ psi, but I'm sure that engine has been built. I just haven't been able to find details.
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Old 04-13-2011, 10:48 PM   #22
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In what respect? I'm putting out the same HP at the crank as a LS3 on only 4.5 psi. The difference between the 1SS and an LS is about the same as a turbo kit for the LS. Then it doesn't cost anything to turn up the boost (until you break something). You would have to do full bolt ons and a cam to get the LS3 in a range where it puts out more power than the LLT at 9-10 psi. Then you can spend the money you would have spent on those parts lowering the compression ratio and getting forged pistions and bigger fuel pump for the LLT and up the boost some more. Basically, if money is the issue you have to be shooting for > 700+ HP at the crank before the LS3/L99 become the more cost effective route. Until then it isn't a big enough difference to worry about.
The problem with the V6 (more so with the AUTO) is keepin that HP on the ground.The SS does a lot BETTER job with that,i wouldnt mind a TT but wana be able to get the power to the ground and not just spin tires.When i was at Tracys getting a catch can thats what he was telling me is an issue (not as much with manuals) but with no LS on the AUTO's i kinda think TT'S is a waste of $ Just cant make use of the added power from a launch.Unless the 9in kit can be installed but then again ur puttin in a lota $ for a V6 i think at that point id go SS
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Old 04-14-2011, 08:55 AM   #23
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The problem with the V6 (more so with the AUTO) is keepin that HP on the ground.The SS does a lot BETTER job with that,i wouldnt mind a TT but wana be able to get the power to the ground and not just spin tires.When i was at Tracys getting a catch can thats what he was telling me is an issue (not as much with manuals) but with no LS on the AUTO's i kinda think TT'S is a waste of $ Just cant make use of the added power from a launch.Unless the 9in kit can be installed but then again ur puttin in a lota $ for a V6 i think at that point id go SS
Yes, traction on the A6 is an issue (open differential). Trailing arms and better tires will help. You will find that the SSs have their own issues as well. They have pretty bad wheel hop and some are getting broken axles. They would need to add trailing arms as well. Again, it's a wash. And most SSs putting 425-450 to the ground willl be having traction issues, so new rubber will be in their future.

Not trying to convince you, just giving you my experience. I don't plan to drag mine that much, want to do the road course, but I'm really worried about the traction issue. Ultimately I think we will need to replace the differential or get a LSD kit made. Either would work for the road course, but I think the differential replacement would be the only way to go for the drag strip.

End the end I think most people won't notice the Open Diff in the V6 because they want the power but they really don't race.
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1/8 mile -- 7.158 @ 102.10 (20psi); old build
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Old 04-14-2011, 09:04 AM   #24
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I have to disagree with the traction issue... look at the 60' on some of the N2O cars... and those cars are autos with open diffs.... If you want traction at the drag strip you simply need a better tire setup... IMHO...
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Old 04-14-2011, 09:27 AM   #25
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I have to disagree with the traction issue... look at the 60' on some of the N2O cars... and those cars are autos with open diffs.... If you want traction at the drag strip you simply need a better tire setup... IMHO...
Yep, the A6 guys do well at the track.

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