2012 vette and ZL1? What is the story?

[Ciscokid]

Alright, no flames...I'm just trying to get a better understanding how the vette and the camaro match up to each other. I purchased a 2011 3.6 camaro and I already regret it. My next purchase will be the ZL1, however, I'm trying to understand where the vette fits into the market.

I'm trying to understand how GM plans to market these cars? Granted there are folks that are die hard vette fans and will always get a vette, however, if the ZL1 has more HP and IMO looks better, why get the vette?

If you go to the Z06, you're getting less HP than the ZL1 and paying more for the vette. I went to the dealer today to try and place a preorder on the ZL1 (dealer not taking preorders at this time) and I looked at the 2011 vette, I have to say I'm not entirely impressed with the interior, let alone waiting for a 2012 with less HP than the ZL1.
The camaro's interior looks way better, just my opinion.

I asked the sales person if he could explain the market position between the ZL1 and the vette and he was loss for words, he doesn't know what's going on between the vette and camaro market posiition.

According to blogs the 2012 vette will have less HP than the ZL1 and you get less room in the vehicle, see below...

The 2012 Chevrolet Corvette coupe is a favorite of Chevrolet dealers, experts, and current owners alike.
The 2012 Chevrolet Corvette is a 2-door sports car which comes in three versions: coupe, convertible and Z06. The coupe and convertible models of the Corvette are powered by a 6.2 Liter V-8 engine that is rated at 430 horsepower. If one gets the engine with a performance exhaust then the power increases to 436 horsepower. The Z06 is powered by a 7.0 Liter V8 engine that is rated at 505 horsepower. All versions of The Corvette are equipped with a six speed manual transmission.
The 2012 coupe and convertible models are equipped with a roof that is fixed and rigid, xenon headlights, keyless start, satellite radio, CD player, the OnStar System, glare reducing mirrors, leather seats, and a power 6-way adjustable driver seat. The Z06 has a wider tire size, and more aerodynamic body. Optional on the 2012 coupe and convertible models is a navigation system, a transparent roof, a memory driver's seat, and a Bose music system with seven speakers. Options on the Corvette Z06 are the same as that of the coupe and convertible minus the roof option.

[SSmoked]

power to weight ratio > horsepower

the vette and camaro are in completly 2 different markets.

[Ciscokid]

Originally Posted by SSmoked

power to weight ratio > horsepower

the vette and camaro are in completly 2 different markets.

So, even though the ZL1 has more HP, the vette is faster on the track due to power to weight ratio. That makes sense, still think more heads turn with the camaro over the vette.

[KarFan]

ZL1 and base Vette will be in roughly the same price range. While they may be cross shopped it's safe to say there will be a lot more Vettes available than ZL1's.

[Blackdevil77]

The 505 hp Z06 will probably trounce the ZL1 in a race, whether it be in the corners, or in a straight line. Its under 3200 lbs!!! The Z06 is more of a week-end, street legal speed machine, while the ZL1 is a bit more practical for street use (compared to a vette) The Vette guys want nothing but pure performance, and more often then not, don't drive their corvette every day and have another car as a daily driver.

As for the looks/interior, the C6 Vette has been around for a while now and is going to be redesigned very soon. Probably by late 2012/2013. That is one of the biggest reason Id take a ZL1 over a Z06 vette. I don't want to get the vette and spend all that money on it, then in a year or two, I see these brand new, redesigned corvettes rolling around which would make me feel obsolete lol.

[TheClassicCarKid]

A 427 small block with 505 horsepower not enough for you after coming from a 2011 V6?

[midgard]

A 550 plus HP Camaro will be at least equal to the CTS-v.....and be at least a 4.0 0-60 (probably 12.0 to 12.2 in the 1/4 at worst)......this probably means it actually BEATS the base vette in a 1/4.

[Weezerj]

Originally Posted by midgard

A 550 plus HP Camaro will be at least equal to the CTS-v.....and be at least a 4.0 0-60 (probably 12.0 to 12.2 in the 1/4 at worst)......this probably means it actually BEATS the base vette in a 1/4.

[Ron66Vette&10SS]

Originally Posted by TheClassicCarKid

A 427 small block with 505 horsepower not enough for you after coming from a 2011 V6?

I'm kind of wondering the same thing

[truth411]

Originally Posted by midgard

A 550 plus HP Camaro will be at least equal to the CTS-v.....and be at least a 4.0 0-60 (probably 12.0 to 12.2 in the 1/4 at worst)......this probably means it actually BEATS the base vette in a 1/4.

Which is why the C7 is right around the corner, it is expected to be 200-300lbs lighter than the C6, and will have the Gen V LT1 V8. I bet $500 the C7 vette will be an 11 sec. car bone stock.

[sed34]

lets get real. The corvette is getting an update. The Stingray. This is how the camaro came into being. The zl1 will be able to keep up with most vetts right now (0-60 around 3.5s and 1/4 in 11.5); and that's stock. The model line (6th gen)has been out since 2005 and the body style itself is from 1997. The stingray will be the flagship when it comes out. So when people say that chevy wouldn't put out something that will beat their flagship line...well the flagship is changing.

[chewy8]

dont forget about the zr1 the zl1 not going to beat that

[lbls1]

Aside from the zr1, there isn't a lot out there that would make me miss a Camaro ZL1. The combination of the timing of the release, the well integrated updates, and in general the nicely executed 5th gen camaro spells a winning combination for me. Personally I've never been keen on corvettes (for a lot of reasons, starting with the once obvious fact that I couldn't afford one). Although right now I am able to afford one, with the presence of a camaro and all of the potentially exciting updates that's in store for it, I do not see a corvette in line as my next car over the zl1.

Now, after the zl1....that's another story yet to unfold.

[sed34]

Originally Posted by chewy8

dont forget about the zr1 the zl1 not going to beat that

yep. it would just be the zr1. every other version would struggle. until the stingray comes out. I wonder what it would do.

Originally Posted by lbls1

Aside from the zr1, there isn't a lot out there that would make me miss a Camaro ZL1. The combination of the timing of the release, the well integrated updates, and in general the nicely executed 5th gen camaro spells a winning combination for me. Personally I've never been keen on corvettes (for a lot of reasons, starting with the once obvious fact that I couldn't afford one). Although right now I am able to afford one, with the presence of a camaro and all of the potentially exciting updates that's in store for it, I do not see a corvette in line as my next car over the zl1.

Now, after the zl1....that's another story yet to unfold.

[kiteman]

i would urge you to go test drive a vette and ss in the same setting at the dealership one day. the difference between an ls3 vette and an ls3 camaro is astonishing--the vette is so much faster. don't let the numbers fool you, the z06 will outperform the zl1 in most categories, albeit a zl1 will probably be closer to the vette in terms of raw acceleration than it ever has been before.

[Blackdevil77]

Originally Posted by kiteman

i would urge you to go test drive a vette and ss in the same setting at the dealership one day. the difference between an ls3 vette and an ls3 camaro is astonishing--the vette is so much faster. don't let the numbers fool you, the z06 will outperform the zl1 in most categories, albeit a zl1 will probably be closer to the vette in terms of raw acceleration than it ever has been before.

Close to the base vette, or a Z06?

[Rich1]

I am fortunate to have both. I have 2005 C6 vert. I have done mods to the Vette: headers, cam, exhaust, CAI, and tune. Even without those mods the Vette smokes my SS. I do love both cars though...

[kiteman]

Originally Posted by Blackdevil77

Close to the base vette, or a Z06?

i feel pretty confident the base vette won't be a match for a zl1. the z06 will be closer than you think.

[sik68]

Using the GT500 as a reference point to the ZL1, here are 2 good articles:

Grand Sport vs. 2011 GT500
http://www.roadandtrack.com/tests/co...d-shelby-gt500

Grand Sport vs. 2010 GT500
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...d_sport_page_3

[lbls1]

Pretty impressive match and numbers. The Grand Sport barely held off the gt500. If the GT500 were lighter than it would've certainly dominated. The skidpad g's were impressive as well.

The zl1 has to be within 3900lbs in order to compete IMO. The caddy held off the gt500 with 4240 lbs (Motor Trend), but the zl1 has to expect a rebuttal from Ford.

[Blackdevil77]

Originally Posted by lbls1

Pretty impressive match and numbers. The Grand Sport barely held off the gt500. If the GT500 were lighter than it would've certainly dominated. The skidpad g's were impressive as well.

The zl1 has to be within 3900lbs in order to compete IMO. The caddy held off the gt500 with 4240 lbs (Motor Trend), but the zl1 has to expect a rebuttal from Ford.

That was only due to traction. The GT500's trap speed was actually higher. If the GT500 was able to hook, it would of beat the CTS-V

[lbls1]

Ok makes sense since its 400lbs lighter. The zl1 vs. gt500 is looking to be a nail biter match.

[ffrcobra_65]

Originally Posted by TheClassicCarKid

A 427 small block with 505 horsepower not enough for you after coming from a 2011 V6?

kid is too hooked on hp and forgetting a major factor in going fast, WEIGHT! The Corvette guys will always think the Corvette is superior and the Camaro guys will akways hope the vette guys can be proven wrong. Not gonna happen as long as there is a Z06, ZR1 around.

[Mr. Wyndham]

LS < SS < Base Vette < GS < ZL1 < Z06 < ZR1

There will always be overlap. It's inevitable when you get to these levels...not to mention it would be foolish to hold yourself back (you being GM, in this case) just because of another car in the showroom that also happens to be in a completely different class of automobile.

Not to mention....the Corvette is due for a new generation anytime, now........

I'm glad the guys in charge at Chevy/GM didn't restrict the Camaro team's potential due to the Corvette's existence.


EDIT: I'd argue the Camaro is a bit more valuable as a 'halo' car to Chevy dealers than the Corvette...Tom Henry or Becky from Rogers, or someone can correct me if I'm wrong.......when I talk to non-car-people...the consensus seems to be that the Corvette is unaffordable, impractical, and more of a pedestal "I know it's cool, but I know I can't have it" kinda car....whereas the Camaro is viewed as being affordable, somewhat practical, and new.

I'd think the Camaro attracts more 'commoner' traffic than the Corvette.

[upheval]

Vette vs Camaro, apples and oranges and different strokes for different folks. Different situations call for a different car. DD vs Weekend vs family. Wow, lots of SPECULATION and lots of OPINIONS here. Cant wait for the ZL1 to come out. I will have cash in hand. It will be nice to add it to the stable. Cant wait to see the new Vette too. GM gets lots of my money, lol.