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Old 07-13-2011, 11:27 AM   #1
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Even if the camaro puts out 570+ HP, would you wait for its answer to Ford?

When the 2010 Mustang was out, it was embarassed by the 2010 camaro, until Mustang came back in 2011 and matched camaros numbers.

I've been seriously considering a ZL1 and I'm worried that the same thing is going to happen to Chevy- Ford will come out with the 650 HP powerplant that keeps being discussed, and the 570+HP Camaro will be the runt... then in 2013 Camaro will have to match Fords output and historically, the 2012 ZL1 will be the laughing stock of the muscle car wars just like the 2010 mustang is today.

So I guess the real question is, who thinks Ford really is talking 650 HP? If they are, it's got to be 2012/2013, as 2016 the new CAFE standards are taking place and there is no way they will be popping a 650 HP motor out close to that unless they just revolutionized motor design...
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Old 07-13-2011, 11:31 AM   #2
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Don't worry about being the top dog as we all know .. there is always someone with more power or someone faster etc .....

I'd say get what you want and what makes you happy .....

Hopefully if both cars come out about the same time, we will know the full specs on them about the same time ..

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Old 07-13-2011, 11:37 AM   #3
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There is a lot more to buying a sports car than advertised horsepower.
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Old 07-13-2011, 11:38 AM   #4
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It wouldn't bother me because the high HP Mustangs just plain dont "hook" as well as the Camaro. Besides, I intend to have my ZL1 pumped up to 750 HP so what do I care if Ford cranks out a 650. Hey, I figure that I am only going to do this once so I may as well do it right!
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Old 07-13-2011, 11:41 AM   #5
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I guess the idea is that in 2013 the camaro ZL1 would push 650+ hp also, in which case I could probably suck it up and wait a year?

although I said I was going to wait for the convertible camaro, and I couldnt wait more than a month before I bought my SS... haha...
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Old 07-13-2011, 11:43 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by BumblebeeAmigo View Post
the 2012 ZL1 will be the laughing stock of the muscle car wars just like the 2010 mustang is today.

Dont think that will ever be an issue..

plus, keep in mind if ford were to build a 650 hp car the price would probably go up quite a bit putting it in a different bracket than the factory pony car monsters...
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Old 07-13-2011, 11:47 AM   #7
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Mod it.
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Old 07-13-2011, 11:48 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BiggFoot View Post
It wouldn't bother me because the high HP Mustangs just plain dont "hook" as well as the Camaro. Besides, I intend to have my ZL1 pumped up to 750 HP so what do I care if Ford cranks out a 650. Hey, I figure that I am only going to do this once so I may as well do it right!
Well, the mustang will probably come out a year after the Zl1.
Then it will take gm 1-3 years to answer.
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Old 07-13-2011, 11:49 AM   #9
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Mod it.
Thats the only reason I'm planning on getting a ZL1 is because over the past 2 years I saved up 20k to mod the camaro, but I keep running into warranty issues and I won't touch it... So take that 20k + Loaded camaro SS and that should just about = ZL1... its like most the camaro mods I wanted but it still maintains it's warranty...
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Old 07-13-2011, 11:50 AM   #10
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Well, the mustang will probably come out a year after the Zl1.
Then it will take gm 1-3 years to answer.
2016 is going to be a brick wall to the muscle car world I believe, it'll be a repeat of the 70s although not as intense...
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2010 Camaro SS modified extensively. I stretched the body to make it a 4 door, but I swapped in the 3.6L DI V6 for fuel economy. Then I picked up a corvette body around the V8. I also swapped the body for a C2 Z28. (In short I traded it for three cars, a Corvette Z06r, a C2 Camaro Z28, and a Cadillac CTS Summer Performance package 3.6L DI with Aisin 6spd.)
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Old 07-13-2011, 12:07 PM   #11
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So if you mod you may run into "some" factory warranty issues such as engine and drivetrain but the remainder of the car should still be covered by warranty. Who does the mod is where it get's sticky and you have to do your homework to get it right. I am sure if you asked 10 people you would get 10 different answers as to who is the best, but all you have to do is take a hard look at the warranty offered by the performance shop to tell who means business and backs their product. Additionaly, an internet search of the company for complaints may turn up some interesting info to consider. If you want to play it absolutely safe then keep it stock as you intend, but for me, life is too short so live it to the fullest
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Old 07-13-2011, 12:32 PM   #12
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Unfortunately Comrade Obama may make the 550+ hp ZL1 the pinnacle of high horespower modern musclecars:

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/opinion/opedcolumnists/subsidymobiles_rLZ5ZXFvAWUvE7yxshCpLM
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Old 07-13-2011, 12:36 PM   #13
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ZL1 - no waiting

.

I've never been a fan of mustang styling. Even when they came out with the retro version my response was "meh." The 77 and thereabouts Mach 1s were an exception. They had the sinister moxy going on to a degree, but for the most part mustangs are just too soft and curvy looking, bubbly, ovoid, and well, girly-sportscar looking. (Apologies to our lovely ladies of Camaro, you're the hotter kind of girl that is more fun to be around. I wasn't talking about you.)

Camaro, and especially ZL1 looks fierce like a cross between a pitbull and a rocketship. That's the car for me.

We have loads of new tech going into this baby, and factory HP that eclipses anything made on this scale - even the legendary original ZL1s.

I hope they push the HP right to the edge where going further would compromise dependability, and I have faith that they're doing it oh so very right with ZL1.

Yeah, easy question to answer in my case. My finger is on the trigger and getting twitchy already.

ZL1 - no waiting.

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Old 07-13-2011, 12:54 PM   #14
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Not going to wait life is to short so live it to the fullist, if I need more HP i'll mod it.
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Old 07-13-2011, 12:59 PM   #15
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Unless you plan on taking this thing to the track every week, there is no need or no place to be able to use that much HP on the road. And if you do use it on the road, well then you're just looking to get in trouble or an accident.
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Old 07-13-2011, 01:04 PM   #16
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Unless you plan on taking this thing to the track every week, there is no need or no place to be able to use that much HP on the road. And if you do use it on the road, well then you're just looking to get in trouble or an accident.
Why do people think you have to have the go fast pedal to the floor to enjoy driving a fast car?
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Old 07-13-2011, 01:15 PM   #17
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Why do people think you have to have the go fast pedal to the floor to enjoy driving a fast car?
What I'm trying to say is what's the difference between driving a 550+ HP car and a 650 HP car on the road. You're never going to use it's full potential on the road, unless you plan on racing every car you come across.

Or you can have bragging right of being able to get to the speed limit faster than you can. LOL!
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Old 07-13-2011, 01:19 PM   #18
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Why do people think you have to have the go fast pedal to the floor to enjoy driving a fast car?

Personal experience?


Just kiding - (mostly.) .


I ALWAYS try to be safe and don't do stupid stuff in traffic, but sometimes you just have to "get on it" a bit.


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Old 07-13-2011, 01:22 PM   #19
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What I'm trying to say is what's the difference between driving a 550+ HP car and a 650 HP car on the road. You're never going to use it's full potential on the road, unless you plan on racing every car you come across.

Or you can have bragging right of being able to get to the speed limit faster than you can. LOL!
I heard that argument when I drove a 300 HP 3000GT from the guys who drove the 222 HP N/As... I now hear that argument from V6 drivers of camaros and mustangs about the 426 HP Camaro, and now I'm hearing it about the 550 vs 650 hp.... I also hear that argument with my bike, the 650 CC guys vs. the 1000 cc...

And I'm guessing the answer is going to be the same. Damn was I glad I had 300 HP over the 222. Damn am I glad I have the 426 over the 317, damn am I glad to have the 1000 over the 650, and damn would I be glad I had 650 over 550. Where do you draw the line? simple- there is no line.

and I don't speed.
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Old 07-13-2011, 01:24 PM   #20
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Performance>HP. By most reliable accounts, mustangs begin to see negative returns on performance past the 550 HP mark. My $ is on the ZL1.
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Old 07-13-2011, 01:24 PM   #21
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So if you mod you may run into "some" factory warranty issues such as engine and drivetrain but the remainder of the car should still be covered by warranty. Who does the mod is where it get's sticky and you have to do your homework to get it right. I am sure if you asked 10 people you would get 10 different answers as to who is the best, but all you have to do is take a hard look at the warranty offered by the performance shop to tell who means business and backs their product. Additionaly, an internet search of the company for complaints may turn up some interesting info to consider. If you want to play it absolutely safe then keep it stock as you intend, but for me, life is too short so live it to the fullest
How about burning 4 quarts of oil an oil change (and having both dealers you bring it to say thats deemed normal) and being on your 3rd transmission and having it grind in gears. Would you be modding??? lol...
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Old 07-13-2011, 01:27 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Billy O'Brien View Post
Unfortunately Comrade Obama may make the 550+ hp ZL1 the pinnacle of high horespower modern musclecars:

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/opinion/opedcolumnists/subsidymobiles_rLZ5ZXFvAWUvE7yxshCpLM
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Old 07-13-2011, 01:31 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by BumblebeeAmigo View Post
I heard that argument when I drove a 300 HP 3000GT from the guys who drove the 222 HP N/As... I now hear that argument from V6 drivers of camaros and mustangs about the 426 HP Camaro, and now I'm hearing it about the 550 vs 650 hp.... I also hear that argument with my bike, the 650 CC guys vs. the 1000 cc...

And I'm guessing the answer is going to be the same. Damn was I glad I had 300 HP over the 222. Damn am I glad I have the 426 over the 317, damn am I glad to have the 1000 over the 650, and damn would I be glad I had 650 over 550. Where do you draw the line? simple- there is no line.

and I don't speed.
I went with the V6 not because I couldn't afford the V8, but the better gas millage of the V6 as It's a daily driver. I went with the Camaro over the Mustang because it looks so much better IMO.

Not once have I said I wish I got the V8 over the V6 either.

But like I said before once you get up to 550+ HP you are never going to be able to use it's full potential (legally) on the road.
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Old 07-13-2011, 01:39 PM   #24
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Unless they fix the GT500 traction issues, a 650 HP GT500 is not going to do them much good if it can't get the power down. From what we know of the ZL1, it should be glued to the road pretty well.
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Old 07-13-2011, 01:55 PM   #25
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What I'm trying to say is what's the difference between driving a 550+ HP car and a 650 HP car on the road. You're never going to use it's full potential on the road, unless you plan on racing every car you come across.

Or you can have bragging right of being able to get to the speed limit faster than you can. LOL!
I have only added maybe 50-60 hp to my car and it is TONS more fun just driving around everyday, I'm sure going from 550 to 650 would be a similar improvement.

Obviously you won't get the FULL potential out of your car unless you go WOT, but that doesn't mean it's not funner to normal everyday drive it with more power.

It's just a pet peeve of mine when people don't understand why most of us car guys want more power and mod our cars. I mod my car because I love to see how it progresses and I love how every mod changes how the car drives and feels a little.
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