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V8 and V6 Transmissions / Driveline (6L80 / 6L50 / TR6060 / AY6) Driveshafts | Differentials | Gears | Rearends | Clutch | Shifters

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Old 04-03-2009, 12:42 AM   #51
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Hey guys I never had gears installed before but interested in the performance gain : how reliable are they ? How critical is the quality of instalation ? For example Is a 3.73 stonger than a 3.90 ? etc ...
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Old 04-03-2009, 09:28 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeInNePa View Post
Keep in mind that the G8 (Commodore VE, Zeta) has been sold in Aus since '06. There are a lot of them out there. There are no companies making gears for them.

This is the same (essentially) chassis.

Just don't be surprised if there is a biiiiggggg lag in aftermarket support for certain items.


And the vast majority of them were V6's. There will be nearly as many 2010 SS Camaro's sold as V8 powered Commodores since 2006. Plus, I don't know how much the Aussies like to modify their cars. But I'd guess that they aren't as into is as Camaro owners will be. So the market will be bigger for all performance items on the Camaro vs the Commodore (and other Zeta sedans). Thats my reasoning at least. But there will be a lag for certain items, like you said. I just think it won't be much of a lag for most of those items.
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Old 04-03-2009, 11:15 AM   #53
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Originally Posted by HeavyRightFooT View Post
Hey guys I never had gears installed before but interested in the performance gain : how reliable are they ? How critical is the quality of instalation ? For example Is a 3.73 stonger than a 3.90 ? etc ...
You will notice a seat-of-the-pants difference...the car will seem more responsive too. The installation is extremely critical for gears...you should only get them done by a shop that knows what they're doing and does it often. A smaller number will provide a stronger gear, but as was posted earlier, I doubt that will be an issue with the rear end in these cars, and certainly not at near-stock power levels.
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Old 04-03-2009, 12:04 PM   #54
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OK Here we go.... gear whine: correct install,backlash,pinion depth,etc will assure NO whine,Gear ratio selection 3.73 to 4.56 will be very popular you will see,with concerns of what power adders will be added,those 20" tires and 6 gears will LOVE the deeper gears,and if you like the sensation of your chest caving in then you will want the 4.56's ,And if you want to better your chances of no whine get a GM gear I've always had better service out of'em ,and they will be available sonner or later they alway's are I have an automatic car and will be probably going with 4.30's,choose wisely......
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Old 04-03-2009, 01:20 PM   #55
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I'm looking at 3.73 myself but could go for 3.90.
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Old 04-03-2009, 03:25 PM   #56
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...I have an automatic car and will be probably going with 4.30's,choose wisely......
Why 4.30's? What do you have planned for your car and how do you expect the gears to affect performance?

If my car were a 1/4 queen I'd get a stall and big gears, but what if you want to do a little conrer carving? Would a stall and big gears adversely effect performance on a road course?
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Old 04-03-2009, 03:31 PM   #57
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not not really bc when youre on a road course you ussually keep the rpms way up anywas so its pass the stall speed of the converter
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Old 04-03-2009, 03:37 PM   #58
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A day on a road course will only be once or twice a year for fun so I probably don't need to worry too much. I'll check out SCCA site though, it's alway good to learn.
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Old 04-04-2009, 04:51 PM   #59
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And the vast majority of them were V6's. There will be nearly as many 2010 SS Camaro's sold as V8 powered Commodores since 2006. Plus, I don't know how much the Aussies like to modify their cars. But I'd guess that they aren't as into is as Camaro owners will be. So the market will be bigger for all performance items on the Camaro vs the Commodore (and other Zeta sedans). Thats my reasoning at least. But there will be a lag for certain items, like you said. I just think it won't be much of a lag for most of those items.
I hope so, I'm in the market for gears now. My choices, right now, are 3.27s and 3.45s. 3.70s are , in my opinion, way too steep for the gearing in the auto.
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Old 04-04-2009, 04:57 PM   #60
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OK Here we go.... gear whine: correct install,backlash,pinion depth,etc will assure NO whine,Gear ratio selection 3.73 to 4.56 will be very popular you will see,with concerns of what power adders will be added,those 20" tires and 6 gears will LOVE the deeper gears,and if you like the sensation of your chest caving in then you will want the 4.56's ,And if you want to better your chances of no whine get a GM gear I've always had better service out of'em ,and they will be available sonner or later they alway's are I have an automatic car and will be probably going with 4.30's,choose wisely......
You do realize that with the gearing in the A6, 1st through 3rd with the 2.92s are like having 4.56s in a Turbo 400 car, right?

6L80
4.03 x 2.92 = 11.76
2.36 x 2.92 = 6.89
1.53 x 2.92 = 4.46

Turbo400
2.48 x 4.56 = 11.30
1.48 x 4.56 = 6.74
1.00 x 4.56 = 4.56



With 4.xx gears 1st and probably 2nd gear will be useless.
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Old 04-04-2009, 05:56 PM   #61
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Do you know the gearing for the stock M6?
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Old 04-04-2009, 06:06 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by GeorgeInNePa View Post
You do realize that with the gearing in the A6, 1st through 3rd with the 2.92s are like having 4.56s in a Turbo 400 car, right?

6L80
4.03 x 2.92 = 11.76
2.36 x 2.92 = 6.89
1.53 x 2.92 = 4.46

Turbo400
2.48 x 4.56 = 11.30
1.48 x 4.56 = 6.74
1.00 x 4.56 = 4.56



With 4.xx gears 1st and probably 2nd gear will be useless.
With the tire height and how high the engines rev, 1'st MIGHT be hard to handle, but 2nd will be very usefull.
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Old 04-05-2009, 05:15 PM   #63
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Some food for thought for those of you who have not done a gear change before. I did 4.10's on my '99 SS M6. The performance improvement was noticable and fun. However, after living with it for awhile, I am not sure I will do it again. First, I was lucky and never had gear whine from my car, but at LEAST half the people I knew at the time who changed gears did. Second, I just got sick of shifting it so much! The change in rear end gearing causes you to move through each gear faster, and during normal driving, means that you have to shift more often. Don't get me wrong, I love rowing my own gears (all of my Camaros have had manual transmissions) but it was kind of irritating.

I will drive the car for awhile before making any changes, but if I do change them, I won't go for the more extreme gear ratios...maybe 3.73 or 3.90.
It is true enough that you will get thru the gears more quickly with a lower axle ratio (higher numerically)... but on the other side of the coin, I don't find that I'm necessarily shifting more often with the 4.10s in my '98 SS. With that gear ratio, it is so very easy just to skip a gear, since you have so much torque available! In city traffic, I'm actually shifting less, since I can go 1-3-5 without any trouble at all, or even start in 2nd and go into 4th.

As far as fuel economy is concerned, I can tell you that there is no appreciable difference in everyday driving with the 4.10s, as opposed to the stock 3.42s. You just end up one gear higher than you would be with the stock ratio and engine RPMs really don't change at a given speed. For example, if I'm driving at 40 mph in 4th with 3.42s, I'd be in 5th with the 4.10s. There is a slight penalty on the highway - I dropped to 29.5 MPG (Canadian gallon) from 31.5 MPG when I put in the 4.10s. A very small price to pay for the added fun!

The only drawback with the 4.10s for me is on my favourite road course (Mosport), I run out of 4th gear on the long Andretti straight too soon and have to shift into 5th. Being an overdrive, the car loses its ability to accelerate dramatically. It basically falls flat on its face! With the 3.42s (or 3.73s for that matter!) I'd be able to stay in 4th significantly longer, and have better acceleration in the higher speed ranges. As it stands now, I'm hitting between 135-140 MPH in 5th at the top of that straight before I have to jump on the brakes, so I'm not gonna complain too much!

And yes, proper installation is extremely important in keeping the noise down. I have absolutely NO gear whine with my 4.10s.

And yes, the lower the gear (higher the number) the more teeth there are in the same space, so the smaller they are which makes them weaker. You would definitely be looking to come home on a flatbed from the dragstrip with a 6 speed manual, 4.10 gears, and drag radials on a modded engine!

Best regardSS,

Elie
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Old 04-05-2009, 05:24 PM   #64
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Well it's about time you chimed in here Elie! Based on the fact you are running 4.10's in the '98 SS (17 inch wheels), would you consider 4.30 or higher for a 2010 Camaro since it is running 20 inch wheels? Also, did you have the 4.10's in the car when you drove down to Indy?
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Old 04-05-2009, 05:48 PM   #65
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This is going to be my daily driver, so am leaning towards the 3.73 (wife is also going to drive occasionally), but some 3.9's wouldn't be too bad either. I won't go over that though, so 4.10's are out of the question for me right now.
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Old 04-06-2009, 06:14 AM   #66
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Well it's about time you chimed in here Elie! Based on the fact you are running 4.10's in the '98 SS (17 inch wheels), would you consider 4.30 or higher for a 2010 Camaro since it is running 20 inch wheels? Also, did you have the 4.10's in the car when you drove down to Indy?
I don't think I'd want any more gear than what I've got now with the 4.10s. Running the #'s for comparison, taking into account not only wheel size, but tire profile as well in order to get an accurate comparison of wheel diameters. I believe the wheel diameter for 275/40/17 on the 4th gen cars is 25.66" and 28.66" for the 5th gen. (275/40/20). That's about an 11% difference. 4.30 vs. 4.10 is less than a 10% difference, so the 4.30s would be OK for me.
Definitely had the 4.10s in the car for the Indy trip - had them for years. Lots of trips to Bowling Green, Mars, PA etc with great fuel economy and no probs!

Best regardSS,

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Old 04-06-2009, 07:28 AM   #67
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Anyone know what the "sweet spot" rpm range is for the LS3?

varies between 1700-2200rpm from what a couple of Vette guys have told me
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Old 04-06-2009, 08:42 AM   #68
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Do you know the gearing for the stock M6?
If we're talking the SS's Tremec:
1st: 3.01
2nd: 2.07
3rd: 1.43
4th: 1.00
5th: 0.84
6th: 0.57
Final: 3.45

If we're talking the Aysin in the V6 models:
1st: 4.48
2nd: 2.58
3rd: 1.63
4th: 1.19
5th: 1.00
6th: 0.75
Final: 3.27
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Old 04-10-2009, 08:21 AM   #69
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Everybody's gonna be doing different things with their cars,but for me,I LOVE HARD EXCELLERATION,car will be weekend toy,so deep gears for me...4.30,s = FUN,Again choose wisely for your needs and want's,Been doing this for many years so I know what I want
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