Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com
 
Hellion Power Systems
Go Back   Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com > Technical Camaro Topics > Suspension / Brakes / Chassis

Suspension / Brakes / Chassis All suspension, brakes and chassis discussions.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 09-16-2011, 09:45 PM   #1
ducq
 
ducq's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 1SS/RS LS3 blck w/ IOM
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 575
BMR Subframe bushings installed successfully

Edit* title should read subframe bushing inserts

Got them installed, the whole install took about 3 hours. I was a little hesitant to start this install after reading some horror stories. Everything was pretty simple though. The hardest part was definitely the front washers. I used the two hammer method, well I had a hammer and a rubber/plastic mallet thing. Each front washer took me maybe 15 minutes, the rears maybe 3 minutes each. It wasn't until the last washer (front) that I realized if I hit it with the hammer a few times, then take a pry bar and pry down from the opposite side, then go back and hit it with the hammer a few more times, it takes the washer out in like a minute or two.

Dropping the cradle, I couldn't clear enough space to fit the insert. I would have to drop it another 2 inches and I wasn't trying to take down my catback and all that. I cut the rear top insert. Just put 1 slice in it to get around the dowel thing that was in the way. Should work just fine even with this cut. The other inserts went in fine. I couldn't push the front top inserts in all the way but once I bolted everything bak up, the inserts pushed themselves in.

I read the cradle bolts are torqued to 130 ft lbs. I used my 3/8 torque wrench that only goes to 75 ft lbs. Then I took my breaker bar and tightened it till I almost couldn't anymore. I used blue threadlock on the bolts too so I think they'll be fine?

It's hard for me feel a difference. I put on sway bars 2 days before this and felt a huge difference in handling and steering sensitivity. I'm not sure what to look for. I guess when I take an aggressive start off a red light, it feels a bit more solid. I havnt driven too much today though since installing them. Feels good diving into an install not too confident, being in the middle of it thinking "this isn't so bad" (while repeating to myself that the washers will come out slowly but surely), and completing the install successfully.

Other than welding on my axle back magnaflows, every install has been a DIY project and I consider myself a complete newb to this stuff. I would never have done any of this stuff without the help of camaro5 and the friendly and helpful members here. Thanks all


__________________
TSP 229/236 cam .Magnaflow Comp axleback .KOOKS LT w/ high flow cats .magnapack bullets. C.A.I. Vmax ported TB. Dyno tuned 452hp / 422tq.
ducq is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2011, 09:48 PM   #2
Squintz Palladoris
 
Squintz Palladoris's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 IOM 1SS M6
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: NC
Posts: 566
Feels good to do it for yourself doesnt it?
Squintz Palladoris is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2011, 10:54 PM   #3
Ventmaster

 
Ventmaster's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro RS 1LT M6
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Utah
Posts: 1,625
Nice job ducq! I'm just like you, there have been many mods I wouldn't have attempted without the help of C5!

I think you'll notice a difference first as you take your daily drives: several of the bumps the car used to absorb you'll feel now-not harsh, just a little more firm.
I think you have to be pushing pretty hard to see the real benefit of the inserts.
While this topic is fresh, when I installed mine I heard the # was 74lb/ft of torque on those subframe bolts (felt like 130 getting them out!). Don't worry, I used plenty of blue threadlock too, but does anyone have a more official opinion on this? Thanks.
Ventmaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-17-2011, 10:26 AM   #4
caverman


 
caverman's Avatar
 
Drives: '69 SS Convertible
Join Date: May 2009
Location: DFW, TX
Posts: 7,066
How was the install of the front inserts? I had a heck of a time trying to get them flush. Actually, I couldn't get them flush. Were you able to and if so how did you do it?
__________________
-2010 Camaro 2SS | M6 | VR w/White Stripes | 1 3/4" KOOKS - 3" Magnaflow | LPE 3.91 gears | ADM tuned | Halltech w/ADM Scoop | Spohn/BMR Trailing Arm/Toe Rod | BC Coilovers| Pedders FE4 ZL1 swaybars | Cradle/Diff/Radius Rod bushings | VMax TB | Morimoto Projectors | MGW shifter | Red Calipers
Build Journal
caverman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-17-2011, 11:31 AM   #5
ducq
 
ducq's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 1SS/RS LS3 blck w/ IOM
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 575
I put a thin layer of that grease on the sides of the top front inserts. That grease they supplied is actually kinda sticky and pasty. I put the insert in and pushed down with a scree driver. Then I raised the diff. up some to close the gap and pressed as much more as I could. The top inserts on both sides would not go flush inside, they stuck out maybe 3/4" ? But once I raised the differential back and tightened up all the cradle bolts, the pressure pushed them in flush and I no longer could see them.
__________________
TSP 229/236 cam .Magnaflow Comp axleback .KOOKS LT w/ high flow cats .magnapack bullets. C.A.I. Vmax ported TB. Dyno tuned 452hp / 422tq.
ducq is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-17-2011, 10:51 PM   #6
caverman


 
caverman's Avatar
 
Drives: '69 SS Convertible
Join Date: May 2009
Location: DFW, TX
Posts: 7,066
That's kind of what I saw. I used the grease as well and tried to get them in flush but didn't have any luck. One of mine ended up going in sideways and I couldn't do anything with it.

I don't think pushing the cradle up makes them go flush. I think they just fold over to the side and get compressed. The reason I think that is that if you were to pull the cradle down again that 3/4" would still be there. If they were to have been pushed in by lifting up the cradle then then they should still be flush when you lowered the cradle again. It probably doesn't matter and I still felt a difference in the firmness of the car when I put in those inserts but it bugged me enough that I couldn't get them flush that I removed mine.

I was just curious if you had issues getting those inserts in flush like I did.
__________________
-2010 Camaro 2SS | M6 | VR w/White Stripes | 1 3/4" KOOKS - 3" Magnaflow | LPE 3.91 gears | ADM tuned | Halltech w/ADM Scoop | Spohn/BMR Trailing Arm/Toe Rod | BC Coilovers| Pedders FE4 ZL1 swaybars | Cradle/Diff/Radius Rod bushings | VMax TB | Morimoto Projectors | MGW shifter | Red Calipers
Build Journal
caverman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2011, 01:05 AM   #7
ducq
 
ducq's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 1SS/RS LS3 blck w/ IOM
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 575
Hmm that got me thinking. It's possible they could have bent maybe. When I initially unscrewed the bolts, I saw a gap in the top front bushings area. That is about the amount of rubber I could see sticking out after lifting the cradle back up with the floor jack.

Once the rubber inserts were all in, both sides of the top front inserts were sticking out and I remembered your post about not being able to push them in all the way. I thought, hmm I'm gonna have the same problem. After raising the cradle and seeing the rubber push itself in some, I brought it back down some to see how much went in. I would say the rubber still sticking out was about that of a finger nail. As I was tightening the cradle bolt I could see it pushing in, I was watching carefully and I think I woulda seen if it was bending any which way. If it did end up bending on either side, it wasn't very much so I'm okay with it. Everything looked and feels good. Here's a picture of the fronts.

__________________
TSP 229/236 cam .Magnaflow Comp axleback .KOOKS LT w/ high flow cats .magnapack bullets. C.A.I. Vmax ported TB. Dyno tuned 452hp / 422tq.
ducq is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2011, 01:08 AM   #8
caverman


 
caverman's Avatar
 
Drives: '69 SS Convertible
Join Date: May 2009
Location: DFW, TX
Posts: 7,066
Cool....they should work out just fine. Like I said, even with the issues I was having I could still feel the firmness.
__________________
-2010 Camaro 2SS | M6 | VR w/White Stripes | 1 3/4" KOOKS - 3" Magnaflow | LPE 3.91 gears | ADM tuned | Halltech w/ADM Scoop | Spohn/BMR Trailing Arm/Toe Rod | BC Coilovers| Pedders FE4 ZL1 swaybars | Cradle/Diff/Radius Rod bushings | VMax TB | Morimoto Projectors | MGW shifter | Red Calipers
Build Journal
caverman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2011, 11:15 AM   #9
Bay Area SS
 
Bay Area SS's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 rs/2ss
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: ca bay area
Posts: 669
cool. I need to do this as well. Overall impressions with the end results? Any difference in the feel of the car?
__________________
1 7/8 long tubes full XS Power exhaust no cats, Rotofab CAI, PowderPro Ported TB, Hurst short throw, TSP 231 236 cam, tuned by Synergy Motorsports 454RWHP, 440 RWTQ. More to come!
Bay Area SS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2011, 06:07 PM   #10
ducq
 
ducq's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 1SS/RS LS3 blck w/ IOM
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 575
Well I put on sway bars first then the next day I put on these inserts so it's hard to tell. I do feel like the rear is a bit stiffer when taking off aggressively from a stop. Some bumps are felt just a bit more than before but nothing uncomfortable or annoying. I'm curious to see what the pedders inserts look like. I hear they are harder material and that the pfadt ones are even stiffer. I feel these softer rubber ones are good for a daily driver. I feel the other much stiffer bushing inserts might make daily driving too bumpy.
__________________
TSP 229/236 cam .Magnaflow Comp axleback .KOOKS LT w/ high flow cats .magnapack bullets. C.A.I. Vmax ported TB. Dyno tuned 452hp / 422tq.
ducq is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2011, 10:36 AM   #11
BMR guy


 
BMR guy's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 1SS
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 1,097
Yeah, it will be a little difficult to feel after just swapping sway bars. Sway bars make such a huge improvement that other mods tend to pale by comparison. If you would have done the inserts first you definitely would have felt them more but rest assured, they are doing their job.

I noticed that you mentioned several times that our inserts were made from rubber. I am not sure where you heard this from but they are not rubber, they are made from 88 durometer polyurethane. I am fairly certain that the Pedders/Whiteline inserts are similar, 75-88 durometer but may be wrong, they do not publicize their durometer ratings. If anybody has this data, please post it, it definitely helps to have all the facts before making a purchasing decision.

Last edited by BMR guy; 09-19-2011 at 11:01 AM.
BMR guy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2011, 02:35 PM   #12
ducq
 
ducq's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 1SS/RS LS3 blck w/ IOM
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 575
I'm sorry, I knew that they are made from polyurethane so I dunno why I was saying rubber. I guess cause they have a little bit of flexibility to em. If it wasn't for that flexibility I woulda had to remove my catback and maybe more to get more clearance :P
__________________
TSP 229/236 cam .Magnaflow Comp axleback .KOOKS LT w/ high flow cats .magnapack bullets. C.A.I. Vmax ported TB. Dyno tuned 452hp / 422tq.
ducq is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2011, 10:59 AM   #13
BMR guy


 
BMR guy's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 1SS
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 1,097
No biggie,, just didn't want to confuse people. Glad the install went well and enjoy your wiggle-free cradle
BMR guy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2011, 07:40 PM   #14
jsharp
NOW CAMMED & SUPERCHARGED
 
jsharp's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 2SS/RS Black w/ IOM
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Ar
Posts: 2,334
So bmr guy what is your outlook on the "smashing" discussed here of the front inserts
__________________
Livernois Motorsports: Maggie 2300 7psi, Livernois 2C cam/L99 to LS3 Conversion, Ported TB, Rotofab w/adm race scoop, adm trans cooler,Kooks headers no cats, Kooks 3" exhaust. METCO breather. Precision 2400 Vigilante TC. Eibach Lowering Springs & Swaybars. BMR Trailing arms, BMR Rear Cradle Bushings, BMR Toe Rods, BMR Differential bushings. Vossen CV3 20's w/ 305 Nitto 555R@25psi. Zl1 front bumper. OE Zl1 Hood and matte black insert. 556RWHP/500RWTQ L99
jsharp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2011, 01:02 AM   #15
BAWLZ SS

 
BAWLZ SS's Avatar
 
Drives: '10 Camaro LS3 2SS/RS, 1968 Nova
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: California
Posts: 970
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsharp View Post
So bmr guy what is your outlook on the "smashing" discussed here of the front inserts
+1
__________________
Performance- Kooks Headers w/HF cats, ZL1 Corsa exhaust, VMax, CAI Inc. CAI, MGW shifter, RX CC Suspension - KW V3 Coilovers/ Full PFADT & BMR suspension Appearance - ZL1 Fascia/Sides/ Diffuser, AAC Afterburners, RK Sport 3pc Spoiler, SLP Black out Kit
BAWLZ SS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2011, 09:03 AM   #16
Ventmaster

 
Ventmaster's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro RS 1LT M6
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Utah
Posts: 1,625
Still hoping for an opinion on torque specs for the subframe bolts...anyone?
Ventmaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2011, 10:01 AM   #17
Synner


 
Drives: 2011 2SS/RS M6
Join Date: May 2011
Location: overseas
Posts: 3,535
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ventmaster View Post
Still hoping for an opinion on torque specs for the subframe bolts...anyone?
Tighten them to the right torque spec not a number you feel is enough. Its that number for a reason.
Synner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2011, 10:09 AM   #18
caverman


 
caverman's Avatar
 
Drives: '69 SS Convertible
Join Date: May 2009
Location: DFW, TX
Posts: 7,066
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ventmaster View Post
Still hoping for an opinion on torque specs for the subframe bolts...anyone?
From what I remember finding they are supposed to be 130 ft/lbs which is alot. I think I got mine at 120 and struggled to get that.
__________________
-2010 Camaro 2SS | M6 | VR w/White Stripes | 1 3/4" KOOKS - 3" Magnaflow | LPE 3.91 gears | ADM tuned | Halltech w/ADM Scoop | Spohn/BMR Trailing Arm/Toe Rod | BC Coilovers| Pedders FE4 ZL1 swaybars | Cradle/Diff/Radius Rod bushings | VMax TB | Morimoto Projectors | MGW shifter | Red Calipers
Build Journal
caverman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2011, 11:50 AM   #19
BMR guy


 
BMR guy's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 1SS
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 1,097
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsharp View Post
So bmr guy what is your outlook on the "smashing" discussed here of the front inserts
I have heard that people had this issue before but have never experienced it myself. We had inserts in and out of our car plenty of times before we went to the full bushings but I never saw the individual inserts folded over. In fact, it is difficult to get them out once they have been in for a while.

I will be the first to admit that line of sight is an issue when installing these. It is difficult to get them lined up when you can't see where to guide them into the reliefs of the rubber bushings. The best thing to do is get the cradle as low as possible, use plenty of lube and rotate the bushing around while pushing downward. You will usually feel the individual inserts slide into the reliefs. You will never get the bushing all the way in by hand but it is important that the inserts are lined up before drawing the cradle down.

Last edited by BMR guy; 09-27-2011 at 11:39 AM.
BMR guy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2011, 11:57 AM   #20
BMR guy


 
BMR guy's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 1SS
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 1,097
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ventmaster View Post
Still hoping for an opinion on torque specs for the subframe bolts...anyone?
We recently revised our instructions to 110 ft/lbs instead of 130. With a little blue Loctite, 110 is sufficient. It's not very fun pulling on a torque wrench trying to get 130 ft/lbs with a car teetering on jack stands
BMR guy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2011, 06:53 PM   #21
Ventmaster

 
Ventmaster's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro RS 1LT M6
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Utah
Posts: 1,625
Quote:
Originally Posted by BMR guy View Post
We recently revised our instructions to 110 ft/lbs instead of 130. With a little blue Loctite, 110 is sufficient. It's not very fun pulling on a torque wrench trying to get 130 ft/lbs with a car teetering on jack stands
Thank-you!
Ventmaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2011, 09:31 AM   #22
jsharp
NOW CAMMED & SUPERCHARGED
 
jsharp's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 2SS/RS Black w/ IOM
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Ar
Posts: 2,334
What color loctite is best to use for suspension and driveshaft bolts? Is it still recommended to replace driveshaft bolts?
__________________
Livernois Motorsports: Maggie 2300 7psi, Livernois 2C cam/L99 to LS3 Conversion, Ported TB, Rotofab w/adm race scoop, adm trans cooler,Kooks headers no cats, Kooks 3" exhaust. METCO breather. Precision 2400 Vigilante TC. Eibach Lowering Springs & Swaybars. BMR Trailing arms, BMR Rear Cradle Bushings, BMR Toe Rods, BMR Differential bushings. Vossen CV3 20's w/ 305 Nitto 555R@25psi. Zl1 front bumper. OE Zl1 Hood and matte black insert. 556RWHP/500RWTQ L99
jsharp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2011, 09:46 AM   #23
Squintz Palladoris
 
Squintz Palladoris's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 IOM 1SS M6
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: NC
Posts: 566
Blue should be sufficient. Red will be a major pain to remove later.
Squintz Palladoris is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2011, 12:03 PM   #24
jsharp
NOW CAMMED & SUPERCHARGED
 
jsharp's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 2SS/RS Black w/ IOM
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Ar
Posts: 2,334
thanks! anyone have input on driveshaft bolts?
__________________
Livernois Motorsports: Maggie 2300 7psi, Livernois 2C cam/L99 to LS3 Conversion, Ported TB, Rotofab w/adm race scoop, adm trans cooler,Kooks headers no cats, Kooks 3" exhaust. METCO breather. Precision 2400 Vigilante TC. Eibach Lowering Springs & Swaybars. BMR Trailing arms, BMR Rear Cradle Bushings, BMR Toe Rods, BMR Differential bushings. Vossen CV3 20's w/ 305 Nitto 555R@25psi. Zl1 front bumper. OE Zl1 Hood and matte black insert. 556RWHP/500RWTQ L99
jsharp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2011, 12:01 PM   #25
BAWLZ SS

 
BAWLZ SS's Avatar
 
Drives: '10 Camaro LS3 2SS/RS, 1968 Nova
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: California
Posts: 970
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsharp View Post
thanks! anyone have input on driveshaft bolts?
I was told that u can still use the same bolts just make sure u put some blue locktite on them. If u wqnt u can get a new set from the dealer but used the same ones on my car and havent had any issues!
__________________
Performance- Kooks Headers w/HF cats, ZL1 Corsa exhaust, VMax, CAI Inc. CAI, MGW shifter, RX CC Suspension - KW V3 Coilovers/ Full PFADT & BMR suspension Appearance - ZL1 Fascia/Sides/ Diffuser, AAC Afterburners, RK Sport 3pc Spoiler, SLP Black out Kit
BAWLZ SS is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
bmr trailing arms and diff bushings ipimpthisc Vendor and Seller review / feedback / experiences 1 07-14-2011 05:43 PM
BMR 1.4" drop springs, sway bars, pro bushing kit, trailing arms, toe rods install. SUX2BU Suspension / Brakes / Chassis 22 05-08-2011 07:27 PM
BMR Subframe Connectors: $249.95 at Apex Motorsports!!! Apex Motorsports Suspension / Chassis / Brakes 11 10-08-2010 11:44 AM
BMR Launches New Product - 67-69 F-Body Weld-on Subframe Connectors (SFC006) BMR Suspension 1st & 2nd Generation Camaros 0 09-17-2010 09:42 AM
BMR Launches New Product - 67-69 F-Body Bolt-on Subframe Connectors BMR Suspension 1st & 2nd Gen Marketplace 1 09-01-2010 11:27 AM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:41 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.