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Camaro V8 LS3 / L99 Engine, Exhaust, and Bolt-Ons Bolt-Ons | Intakes | Exhaust

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Old 10-02-2011, 10:17 PM   #1
mikester0612
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CAI Intake Question

So I was looking at all the cold air intakes for the Camaro and I have decided to go with the CAI intake to go with my Corsa Cat-Back on my L99. I just have a single question. Will this require a tune? Some people have said yes and some no, so I just wanted to make sure because I do not want to add a tune to my car and void the warranty. Any information will be greatly appreciated. Thank you!!
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Old 10-02-2011, 10:19 PM   #2
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You'll do fine without a tune.

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Old 10-02-2011, 10:21 PM   #3
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You'll do fine without a tune.

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Will any damage happen to the car over time?
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Old 10-02-2011, 10:24 PM   #4
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Will any damage happen to the car over time?
No. The worse that will happen is you have more fun.

The stock computer adjusts for the change in airflow. As long as there is no huge change in airflow (headers), you'll stay within the stock computer's parameters.

Any long-term problems will be directly proportional to how much you abuse your car with your newfound fun factor.

Check my build journal for my Fastlane CAI (no tune) results at the track. I was pleased.

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Old 10-02-2011, 10:26 PM   #5
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No. The worse that will happen is you have more fun.

The stock computer adjusts for the change in airflow. As long as there is no huge change in airflow (headers), you'll stay within the stock computer's parameters.

Any long-term problems will be directly proportional to how much you abuse your car with your newfound fun factor.

Check my build journal for my Fastlane CAI (no tune) results at the track. I was pleased.

Padre
Is there anyone that you know or heard of that has gotten their parameters changes due to only a CAI swap?
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Old 10-02-2011, 10:28 PM   #6
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No, it will not damage the engine. Your ecu will adjust to the new flow. Going without a tune will be completely fine.
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Old 10-02-2011, 10:29 PM   #7
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Is there anyone that you know or heard of that has gotten their parameters changes due to only a CAI swap?
I don't understand the question. With just a CAI swap, no tune is necessary. However, a tune will help - not so much because you need to adjust for the CAI, but because your tuner will usually optimize your air-fuel ratio and timing. The stock ECU is more conservative than a tuner would be.

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Old 10-02-2011, 10:47 PM   #8
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i dont understand why people do not know, that long term use of a CAI will equal no gains to actually decrease gains with out a tune.

you don't want your ECM to adjust, thats when the gains are gone.

i will never again run a CAI without tuning.
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Old 10-02-2011, 10:49 PM   #9
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I don't understand the question. With just a CAI swap, no tune is necessary. However, a tune will help - not so much because you need to adjust for the CAI, but because your tuner will usually optimize your air-fuel ratio and timing. The stock ECU is more conservative than a tuner would be.

Padre
Sorry for making it confusing it. So when a intake is installed, your parameters will automatically change, correct? But will these changes void the warranty?
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Old 10-02-2011, 10:54 PM   #10
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Sorry for making it confusing it. So when a intake is installed, your parameters will automatically change, correct? But will these changes void the warranty?

Comes down to how anal the dealer is, but probably not.
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Old 10-02-2011, 11:04 PM   #11
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Sorry for making it confusing it. So when a intake is installed, your parameters will automatically change, correct? But will these changes void the warranty?
No, the computer is always adjusting to all sorts of changes: octane, temps, humidity, load, airflow, etc. This is the natural state of the computer, responding to expected changes in parameters.

Only reason a dealer would deny warranty is for the CAI alone. Which, from experience, most dealers can or won't do, unless yours is a loser.

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Old 10-02-2011, 11:07 PM   #12
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Quote:
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Sorry for making it confusing it. So when a intake is installed, your parameters will automatically change, correct? But will these changes void the warranty?
Yes the parameters will automatically change. No, installing a CAI will NOT void your warranty. It will only void your warranty if the problem is caused by your new CAI
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Old 10-02-2011, 11:13 PM   #13
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Thanks all of you for your help!! Looks like I will be ordering my CAI intake soon!!
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Old 10-02-2011, 11:13 PM   #14
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i dont understand why people do not know, that long term use of a CAI will equal no gains to actually decrease gains with out a tune.

you don't want your ECM to adjust, thats when the gains are gone.
You are mistaken.

The ECM commands the AFR (using the LTFT's and STFT's, etc. which are managed differently than the old LS1 models) taking into account the increased airflow. It cannot reduce the airflow, nor does it depart from its commanded AFR. Because you have more airflow at the same AFR, there is more power.

A fresh install may cause it to run more lean, with consequent more power (usually, as the LS3 doesn't always like it leaner), but once it adjusts, a good CAI will always be more powerful (all else being equal) than a stock tune.

Think of it like temperature: 10*F cooler, and your engine will have more power. The ECM cannot unlearn that and will not force it to the previous lower power level. What it will do is adjust fuel and spark accordingly to keep it in its nominal operating range, which will naturally give more power because cooler, denser air burns better and produces more power naturally. Hotter air does the opposite, as the computer moves its parameters to keep the engine nominal (protected).

Same thing with a CAI. It basically shifts your "nominal operating range" to a more powerful range.

Hope that helps.

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Old 10-02-2011, 11:22 PM   #15
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You are mistaken.

The ECM commands the AFR (using the LTFT's and STFT's, etc. which are managed differently than the old LS1 models) taking into account the increased airflow. It cannot reduce the airflow, nor does it depart from its commanded AFR. Because you have more airflow at the same AFR, there is more power.

A fresh install may cause it to run more lean, with consequent more power (usually, as the LS3 doesn't always like it leaner), but once it adjusts, a good CAI will always be more powerful (all else being equal) than a stock tune.

Think of it like temperature: 10*F cooler, and your engine will have more power. The ECM cannot unlearn that and will not force it to the previous lower power level. What it will do is adjust fuel and spark accordingly to keep it in its nominal operating range, which will naturally give more power because cooler, denser air burns better and produces more power naturally. Hotter air does the opposite, as the computer moves its parameters to keep the engine nominal (protected).

Same thing with a CAI. It basically shifts your "nominal operating range" to a more powerful range.

Hope that helps.

Padre
Very helpful!!!! THANKS
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Old 10-02-2011, 11:35 PM   #16
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not even going to bother any more. my advise for you mikester, talk with shops before you do any performance mods. and when i mean shops i don't mean vendors.
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Old 10-02-2011, 11:40 PM   #17
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not even going to bother any more. my advise for you mikester, talk with shops before you do any performance mods. and when i mean shops i don't mean vendors.
Also talk to people who have done the installs themselves and have race-proven results, with and without a tune.

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Old 10-02-2011, 11:44 PM   #18
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Also talk to people who have done the installs themselves and have race-proven results, with and without a tune.

Padre
i will stick to my shops info who knows more about this subject.

thanks any way Padre.
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on our dyno 320-340 is pretty typical. the car did have a CAI, but to my knowledge was not tuned, which over time of running it that way can make them baseline lower than stock. Of the last 5 cars that came in here with a cold air that was not tuned everyone of them made less power than the average stock car.
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Old 10-02-2011, 11:52 PM   #19
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i will stick to my shops info who knows more about this subject.

thanks any way Padre.
alright girls this isnt a drama series
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Old 10-02-2011, 11:56 PM   #20
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i will stick to my shops info who knows more about this subject.

thanks any way Padre.
Well, if all you are doing is repeating what you have heard from a shop, then maybe you ought to shop around, since your first statement in this thread is demonstrably wrong.

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Old 10-02-2011, 11:58 PM   #21
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well people you can listen to me and my shop, who probs does the most cars in all of MI, or listen to the man who says he gained 20HP from shorty headers. your choice
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Old 10-03-2011, 12:02 AM   #22
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Of course a shop would want you to get a tune.......
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Old 10-03-2011, 12:06 AM   #23
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well people you can listen to me and my shop, who probs does the most cars in all of MI, or listen to the man who says he gained 20HP from shorty headers. your choice
I'm sure you have a great shop. You just don't seem to have demonstrated any understanding of what they may have told you.

And just to be clear, MikeSS said: long term use of a CAI will equal no gains to actually decrease gains with out a tune.

Any shops want to chime in and agree without qualification what our resident tune expert has just claimed?

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Old 10-03-2011, 12:11 AM   #24
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well people you can listen to me and my shop, who probs does the most cars in all of MI, or listen to the man who says he gained 20HP from shorty headers. your choice
2 days ago you said these engines don't have valves...I don't think you're who I'd go to for advice on engines or tuning.
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Old 10-03-2011, 12:18 AM   #25
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2 days ago you said these engines don't have valves...I don't think you're who I'd go to for advice on engines or tuning.

They don't son. Wait! You didn't know?!?! They count on hopes, dreams, and ambitions to take in air and produce exhaust. Which is why I'm making around 16,000rwhp easy
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