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Old 10-11-2011, 08:25 AM   #101
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FINALLY...

http://www.gmheritagecenter.com/gm-h...let-Camaro.pdf

Page 173...

How did you want yours built?

COPO pricing NOT included, above. COPO 9560 (ZL1 engine) = Base V8 Coupe + $4160 + mandatory options (F70/14 RWL, PDB, M40/M21/M22) = $7280 to $7407. COPO 9561 (L72) = Base V8 Coupe + $490 (iirc) + mandatory options = $3610 to $3737 FOB dealer.

http://www.camaros.org/copo.shtml

So a COPO 9561 was about $138 LESS than an SS-L78 with similar options and ZL2 Hood ($3748-up).

A "Base" Z/28, including mandatory options, started at $3727 (with G80 + ZL2 Hood).
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Old 10-11-2011, 08:33 AM   #102
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ZZZZzzzzzz

I am thoroughly convinced that GM will release a Z28 with the new direct injection 5.5L engine that will be base engine in the C7 Vette. This might happen for the Vette as soon as next year. A Z28 version could put out about 440HP according to speculation. The 5.5 engine is the engine running in the LeMans series Corvettes in the C6R. If they gave a 5th gen Camaro a 5.5 engine, Magnetic ride technology and a few other tweaks, it would compete well with the Boss 302 on dragstrip or road course. (IMHO)

See: http://www.leftlanenews.com/chevrole...e-5-5l-v8.html
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Old 10-11-2011, 08:56 AM   #103
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Originally Posted by ParisTNDude View Post
I am thoroughly convinced that GM will release a Z28 with the new direct injection 5.5L engine that will be base engine in the C7 Vette. This might happen for the Vette as soon as next year. A Z28 version could put out about 440HP according to speculation. The 5.5 engine is the engine running in the LeMans series Corvettes in the C6R. If they gave a 5th gen Camaro a 5.5 engine, Magnetic ride technology and a few other tweaks, it would compete well with the Boss 302 on dragstrip or road course. (IMHO)

See: http://www.leftlanenews.com/chevrole...e-5-5l-v8.html
That is a distinct possibility as well. Although, I don't know about the MR. Seems like that would push the cost too high.
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Old 10-11-2011, 09:05 AM   #104
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I am thoroughly convinced that GM will release a Z28 with the new direct injection 5.5L engine that will be base engine in the C7 Vette. This might happen for the Vette as soon as next year. A Z28 version could put out about 440HP according to speculation. The 5.5 engine is the engine running in the LeMans series Corvettes in the C6R. If they gave a 5th gen Camaro a 5.5 engine, Magnetic ride technology and a few other tweaks, it would compete well with the Boss 302 on dragstrip or road course. (IMHO)

See: http://www.leftlanenews.com/chevrole...e-5-5l-v8.html
Your info source is over 15 months old. Recent info suggests TWO Gen-5 SBC displacements only: one for trucks (largely), one for sporty cars. The 5.5L version used in the C6R is a Series-specific size to maximize efficiencies at its 475 hp.-regulated limit.

To only put 440 hp. into a 200+ lb. heavier Gen-5 Camaro vs. the 444 hp. BOSS will NOT have it "compete well". It would be struggling to match, let alone bust the wee bronco...quarter horse, steeplechase, or most other "equestrian" metaphors...

Just slip in a shelf-ready LS7...GAME...SET...MATCH! Tennis, anyone?!

As a Gen-6 Camaro, with a Gen-5 SBC, 440 hp in a car weighing closer to the current Stang might be "enough"...
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Old 10-11-2011, 01:23 PM   #105
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Originally Posted by LOWDOWN View Post
Your info source is over 15 months old. Recent info suggests TWO Gen-5 SBC displacements only: one for trucks (largely), one for sporty cars. The 5.5L version used in the C6R is a Series-specific size to maximize efficiencies at its 475 hp.-regulated limit.

To only put 440 hp. into a 200+ lb. heavier Gen-5 Camaro vs. the 444 hp. BOSS will NOT have it "compete well". It would be struggling to match, let alone bust the wee bronco...quarter horse, steeplechase, or most other "equestrian" metaphors...

Just slip in a shelf-ready LS7...GAME...SET...MATCH! Tennis, anyone?!

As a Gen-6 Camaro, with a Gen-5 SBC, 440 hp in a car weighing closer to the current Stang might be "enough"...
I still don't see an LS7 Z28, however I do see a Z28 powered by a new generation V8. Consider the following source:

Internally known as Y1XX, Mathews reports that the C7 will find its way to market sometime in the middle of 2013 as a 2014 model, which might be slightly further off than some expected. When it does, PM tells us to expect the previously rumored 5.5-liter next generation small block V8 engine mated to either an eight-speed automatic or six-speed manual transmission. To note, there was no word on the rumored long-stroke 3.0L V8 in development. Currently, Corvette Racing is using a 5.5-liter small block V8 (dubbed the LS5.5R) that pushes out 485 horsepower. That number seems in line with PMs statement that the base model C7 will exhibit numbers similar to todays Z06, while the next generation Z06 will be closer to what we currently see in the ZR1. Sounds delicious, but what about the interior?

So based on that statement from GM Inside News, I see the Z/28 being released mid year of 2014 (February like the ZL1?) and using a 475 hp DI V8 from the new Corvette. I know rumors are that the 6th Gen Camaro is rumored to be due as a 2015 model, but remember nothing is confirmed, and a 5 year run on the C5 seems a little short and I don't understand the rush to get to the next generation.. Its actually more likely to me that the 6th Generation will be a 2016 or 2017 MY release - that's only 4 years away from being on the dealer lots (50th Anniversary anyone?) which leaves plenty of time for a 2-3 year run on a 2014 Z/28.
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Old 10-11-2011, 01:25 PM   #106
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I predict that the Z-28 will be a turbocharged V6... especially since we've seen how nicely some turbo's would mount up to the new 1 piece head/exhaust manifold.
I wouldn't read too much into that. That engine is being used everywhere. From Camaros to Cadillacs to Impalas. They probably are going to be making a turbo6 out of it someday, but that doesn't mean that they'll use it in the Camaro when they already have a superior engine available (the LS3).

Plus, the whole point of a Z28 is to make it a track oriented car. Adding weight over the front end & making it hotter under the hood are not the way to go if thats the goal. I suppose it might be good if your goal for a Z28 is fuel efficiency though ...
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Originally Posted by ParisTNDude View Post
I am thoroughly convinced that GM will release a Z28 with the new direct injection 5.5L engine that will be base engine in the C7 Vette. This might happen for the Vette as soon as next year. A Z28 version could put out about 440HP according to speculation. The 5.5 engine is the engine running in the LeMans series Corvettes in the C6R. If they gave a 5th gen Camaro a 5.5 engine, Magnetic ride technology and a few other tweaks, it would compete well with the Boss 302 on dragstrip or road course. (IMHO)

See: http://www.leftlanenews.com/chevrole...e-5-5l-v8.html
The 5.5L is being used solely because of ALMS restrictions. It has no bearing on the production engines. A coupe years ago they restricted it to 6.0L, and Corvette Racing shrank the LS7.R race engine to comply. But the LS7 street engine remained at 7.0L
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Old 10-11-2011, 01:35 PM   #107
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Originally Posted by LOWDOWN View Post
Your info source is over 15 months old. Recent info suggests TWO Gen-5 SBC displacements only: one for trucks (largely), one for sporty cars. The 5.5L version used in the C6R is a Series-specific size to maximize efficiencies at its 475 hp.-regulated limit.

To only put 440 hp. into a 200+ lb. heavier Gen-5 Camaro vs. the 444 hp. BOSS will NOT have it "compete well". It would be struggling to match, let alone bust the wee bronco...quarter horse, steeplechase, or most other "equestrian" metaphors...

Just slip in a shelf-ready LS7...GAME...SET...MATCH! Tennis, anyone?!

As a Gen-6 Camaro, with a Gen-5 SBC, 440 hp in a car weighing closer to the current Stang might be "enough"...

Nothing you said would outdate my information...as a matter of fact it confirms what I said. You should google a little more and you will find that the 5.5 engine is definitely currently under development for the Corvette. You'll note that I stated the 5.5 engine and a few more tweaks and that engine would be competative in the Camaro. Direct injection opens huge performance potential for any engine. I watched a video of the Boss 302 at VIR (I think)...the Mustang fanboys like to brag on this one. It was a bone stock Camaro SS against the LS Boss 302 and at the end of a long straight away, the Camaro was only a few car lengths behind the 302. Remember, the current Camaro was never intended as a full out track focussed build as the Boss 302 is and was. There are other videos showing the Boss 302 running mid 13 second ETs in the quarter as well. I think you under-rate the Camaro's performance capability considerably. But, to each his own opinion and I respect that.
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Old 10-11-2011, 01:35 PM   #108
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I still don't see an LS7 Z28, however I do see a Z28 powered by a new generation V8. Consider the following source:

Internally known as Y1XX, Mathews reports that the C7 will find its way to market sometime in the middle of 2013 as a 2014 model, which might be slightly further off than some expected. When it does, PM tells us to expect the previously rumored 5.5-liter next generation small block V8 engine mated to either an eight-speed automatic or six-speed manual transmission. To note, there was no word on the rumored long-stroke 3.0L V8 in development. Currently, Corvette Racing is using a 5.5-liter small block V8 (dubbed the LS5.5R) that pushes out 485 horsepower. That number seems in line with PMs statement that the base model C7 will exhibit numbers similar to todays Z06, while the next generation Z06 will be closer to what we currently see in the ZR1. Sounds delicious, but what about the interior?

So based on that statement from GM Inside News, I see the Z/28 being released mid year of 2014 (February like the ZL1?) and using a 475 hp DI V8 from the new Corvette. I know rumors are that the 6th Gen Camaro is rumored to be due as a 2015 model, but remember nothing is confirmed, and a 5 year run on the C5 seems a little short and I don't understand the rush to get to the next generation.. Its actually more likely to me that the 6th Generation will be a 2016 or 2017 MY release - that's only 4 years away from being on the dealer lots (50th Anniversary anyone?) which leaves plenty of time for a 2-3 year run on a 2014 Z/28.
From that article, they're saying that the engine from the base Corvette will be this 475 hp gen V. Which means ... its replacing the LS3, which means ... its going into the SS.
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Old 10-11-2011, 01:39 PM   #109
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From that article, they're saying that the engine from the base Corvette will be this 475 hp gen V. Which means ... its replacing the LS3, which means ... its going into the SS.
That should be absolutely correct, Camaro SS should get base Vette engine, I would expect a Camaro Z/28 to get something else.
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Old 10-11-2011, 01:39 PM   #110
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From that article, they're saying that the engine from the base Corvette will be this 475 hp gen V. Which means ... its replacing the LS3, which means ... its going into the SS.
I think you're confused on the series models: C5 Vettes were manufactured from 97 through 2004 or 7 years and the C6 is the current model series which has been in production since 2005 and is in it's 7th year as well. Your reference for the new engine would be the C7....just a friendly correction for "currency".
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Old 10-11-2011, 01:43 PM   #111
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Nothing you said would outdate my information...as a matter of fact it confirms what I said. You should google a little more and you will find that the 5.5 engine is definitely currently under development for the Corvette. You'll note that I stated the 5.5 engine and a few more tweaks and that engine would be competative in the Camaro. Direct injection opens huge performance potential for any engine. I watched a video of the Boss 302 at VIR (I think)...the Mustang fanboys like to brag on this one. It was a bone stock Camaro SS against the LS Boss 302 and at the end of a long straight away, the Camaro was only a few car lengths behind the 302. Remember, the current Camaro was never intended as a full out track focussed build as the Boss 302 is and was. There are other videos showing the Boss 302 running mid 13 second ETs in the quarter as well. I think you under-rate the Camaro's performance capability considerably. But, to each his own opinion and I respect that.
Just because you can find it on the internet doesn't mean its true.
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Old 10-11-2011, 01:45 PM   #112
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I think you're confused on the series models: C5 Vettes were manufactured from 97 through 2004 or 7 years and the C6 is the current model series which has been in production since 2005 and is in it's 7th year as well. Your reference for the new engine would be the C7....just a friendly correction for "currency".
Gen V = 5th generation Chevy small block V8, successor to the gen IV family which began with the LS2
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Old 10-11-2011, 01:50 PM   #113
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Gen V = 5th generation Chevy small block V8, successor to the gen IV family which began with the LS2
I didn't see your reference to the generation of the engine, only your mistaken identity of the series of Corvettes?????
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Old 10-11-2011, 01:54 PM   #114
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I didn't see your reference to the generation of the engine, only your mistaken identity of the series of Corvettes?????
I never specified any generation of Corvettes
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Old 10-11-2011, 01:58 PM   #115
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That should be absolutely correct, Camaro SS should get base Vette engine, I would expect a Camaro Z/28 to get something else.
Clyde
It is certainly possible. I think we've seen a new V8 in mid-generation on the Camaros in the past. The thing is there is no engine that clearly fits the Z/28 mold at this moment, so all we can do is speculate. It could be an LS7, but that engine series is nearing the end of its life span. It could be a new small block, and it could be a yet to be announced LS8? Right now, we really don't know. The SS could keep the current LS3 through the end of the generation, or it could go straight to the new Vette engine. Is GM likely to implement the new engine immediately in all applications? If not, then I could see the LS3 SS remaining and a Z/28 recieving the new V8, or even the LS7. Otherwise, we have a 475 hp SS and still no clear cut Z/28 engine, and no engine that has been announced as of yet for the ZL1. So many possibilities...
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Old 10-11-2011, 02:01 PM   #116
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It is certainly possible. I think we've seen a new V8 in mid-generation on the Camaros in the past. The thing is there is no engine that clearly fits the Z/28 mold at this moment, so all we can do is speculate. It could be an LS7, but that engine series is nearing the end of its life span. It could be a new small block, and it could be a yet to be announced LS8? Right now, we really don't know. The SS could keep the current LS3 through the end of the generation, or it could go straight to the new Vette engine. Is GM likely to implement the new engine immediately in all applications? If not, then I could see the LS3 SS remaining and a Z/28 recieving the new V8, or even the LS7. Otherwise, we have a 475 hp SS and still no clear cut Z/28 engine, and no engine that has been announced as of yet for the ZL1. So many possibilities...
Ok...not exactly sure what C5 and C7 meant in your post, but that's ok, I understand what you meant.
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Old 10-11-2011, 02:05 PM   #117
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Ok...not exactly sure what C5 and C7 meant in your post, but that's ok, I understand what you meant.
It was meant as 5th Generation Camaro and 7th Generation Corvette...yup very confusing. My bad.
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Old 10-11-2011, 02:48 PM   #118
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...which supports a rant of mine since the Gen-5 Camaro arrived...

C5 = MY 1997 to 2004 CORVETTES (EIGHT Model Years, btw...)

Gen-5 Camaros = MY 2010-and-up CAMAROS...likely to be with us through MY '15...

1993 to 2002 Camaros are NOT referred to as C4s are they?! But 1984-1996 Vettes ARE...
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Old 10-11-2011, 02:55 PM   #119
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What's the only advantage of a Gen-5 SBC @ 475 hp, over a Gen-4 LS7 SBC @ 505? Fuel economy...which won't be important until CAFE '16, and the then-new Gen-6 Camaro's birthing date...with its "all-new" Gen-5 SBC...
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Old 10-11-2011, 02:58 PM   #120
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...which supports a rant of mine since the Gen-5 Camaro arrived...

C5 = MY 1997 to 2004 CORVETTES (EIGHT Model Years, btw...)

Gen-5 Camaros = MY 2010-and-up CAMAROS...likely to be with us through MY '15...

1993 to 2002 Camaros are NOT referred to as C4s are they?! But 1984-1996 Vettes ARE...
Then add in the confusion of Gen4 and Gen5 SBC!
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Old 10-11-2011, 03:35 PM   #121
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Well, I think we're all starting to agree somewhat that the newer 5.5 DI is going to find it's way into a Camaro. That the Z28 should be lighter in the front end with no superchargers or turbos. That the Gen6 is probably going to happen in the 2016MY (maybe 2015MY) because of the new 2015 Mustang.

GM has pitted the SS against the Z28 (and vice versa) before. It'll depend on the pricing of the Z28, but one of the goals is probably to get current SS owners wanting to trade up to the Z28. I don't think anyone believes the Z28 will be cheaper than the SS.
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Old 10-11-2011, 03:47 PM   #122
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No one ever suggested/expected a ZEE to be less than an SS in any manner...including price...

Look at the BOSS...there's your target...which happens to be in a location that is more (in every way) than an SS, and less than a ZL1 in price and "halo"...
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Old 10-11-2011, 04:55 PM   #123
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Well, I think we're all starting to agree somewhat that the newer 5.5 DI is going to find it's way into a Camaro. That the Z28 should be lighter in the front end with no superchargers or turbos. That the Gen6 is probably going to happen in the 2016MY (maybe 2015MY) because of the new 2015 Mustang.

GM has pitted the SS against the Z28 (and vice versa) before. It'll depend on the pricing of the Z28, but one of the goals is probably to get current SS owners wanting to trade up to the Z28. I don't think anyone believes the Z28 will be cheaper than the SS.
Uhhhh no.
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Old 10-11-2011, 05:04 PM   #124
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O' hell no!!
We're getting the ZL1 crowd now.
My Z28 brother I do believe you are correct. The as of yet unannounced price of the ZL1 has scared them to our Z28 threads as predicted. That being said the more the better. Enough screams heard by GM for the Z28 can only help.
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Old 10-12-2011, 03:08 AM   #125
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Originally Posted by LOWDOWN View Post
What's the only advantage of a Gen-5 SBC @ 475 hp, over a Gen-4 LS7 SBC @ 505? Fuel economy...which won't be important until CAFE '16, and the then-new Gen-6 Camaro's birthing date...with its "all-new" Gen-5 SBC...
speaking from a strick mod potential. . .the Gen 5 motor will be able to handle more boost/funny gas and probably will take better to mods. start with the best base possible.

ls7 with a lot of boost = boom. 0r a really high shot of funny gas. . . quite frankly the thin walls on the ls7 scare me to never mod it beyond a cam and LT headers.

with a 6.2L DI I will start out with more power then an LS7 and quit possibly be able to end with more power with the same type of mods.
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Originally Posted by fbodfather View Post
We do not want to use the Z28 moniker on a car that does not deserve this hallowed name.
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