Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com
 
Hurst Shifters
Go Back   Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com > Engine | Drivetrain | Powertrain Technical Discussions > Camaro V8 LS3 / L99 Engine, Exhaust, and Bolt-Ons

Camaro V8 LS3 / L99 Engine, Exhaust, and Bolt-Ons Bolt-Ons | Intakes | Exhaust

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 01-04-2012, 02:46 PM   #1
CGT
 
Drives: 2011 SSm6
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: St.Louis
Posts: 191
3 bolt cam gear tensioner compatibility

I have done a couple 3 bolt conversions in the past, while also changing the tensioner 12626407 for dampener 12581276. I have mocked up the three bolt gear with the stock tensioner but the chain felt excessivily tight. I always figured there must be a very slight difference somewhere between the 1 bolt and 3 bolt gears making the dampener necessary when changing to the 3 bolt design. Recently I have seen pictures here and elswhere showing the 3 bolt gear being used with the tensioner assembly. Can anyone comment on this, Jannety, TSP, ADM, etc. What do you guys do when converting?
CGT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2012, 02:51 PM   #2
JANNETTYRACING
PRESIDENT CALIBRATOR JRE

 
JANNETTYRACING's Avatar
 
Drives: YELLOW 2013 ZL1 AUTO
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: ON THE DYNO WATERBURY CT.
Posts: 9,109
Quote:
Originally Posted by CGT View Post
I have done a couple 3 bolt conversions in the past, while also changing the tensioner 12626407 for dampener 12581276. I have mocked up the three bolt gear with the stock tensioner but the chain felt excessivily tight. I always figured there must be a very slight difference somewhere between the 1 bolt and 3 bolt gears making the dampener necessary when changing to the 3 bolt design. Recently I have seen pictures here and elswhere showing the 3 bolt gear being used with the tensioner assembly. Can anyone comment on this, Jannety, TSP, ADM, etc. What do you guys do when converting?
There are several 3 bolt gears, which one do you have?
__________________
Technical information, Parts Sales, Professional Installation, and Custom Dyno Tuning.
Please vist our web sites for all your performance needs!
Ted Jannetty
Jannetty Racing Ent Inc.
2984 East Main St.
Waterbury Ct. 06705
203-753-7223
tedj@jannettyracing.com
www.jannettyracing.com
www.turboaddictionparts.com
Performance Parts
JANNETTYRACING is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2012, 02:55 PM   #3
bcguy
bcguy
 
bcguy's Avatar
 
Drives: 2011 ss/rs m6
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: british columbia canada
Posts: 339
so just to be clear,not to hyjack thread,sorry,do we absulutely have to change the tensioner on the ls3 when doing the cam swap,i heard there was problems with both tensioners failing
bcguy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2012, 02:56 PM   #4
JANNETTYRACING
PRESIDENT CALIBRATOR JRE

 
JANNETTYRACING's Avatar
 
Drives: YELLOW 2013 ZL1 AUTO
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: ON THE DYNO WATERBURY CT.
Posts: 9,109
Quote:
Originally Posted by bcguy View Post
so just to be clear,not to hyjack thread,sorry,do we absulutely have to change the tensioner on the ls3 when doing the cam swap,i heard there was problems with both tensioners failing
No to each his own.
__________________
Technical information, Parts Sales, Professional Installation, and Custom Dyno Tuning.
Please vist our web sites for all your performance needs!
Ted Jannetty
Jannetty Racing Ent Inc.
2984 East Main St.
Waterbury Ct. 06705
203-753-7223
tedj@jannettyracing.com
www.jannettyracing.com
www.turboaddictionparts.com
Performance Parts
JANNETTYRACING is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2012, 06:19 PM   #5
Go Fast Kid
 
Drives: Camaro 2010 SS LS7 427ci
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Miami
Posts: 61
Tensioner assembly

Teds comment is on point, to each his own. If you can take a hint from GM Powertrain division, the LS3 and LSA motors all use the same tensioner style part. Those being the most current motors released by GM you should take the hint that those are their newest and best design for the application.

Changing the stock LS3 tensioner to some other style requires removal of the oil on while the motor is in. That project will cause you far more grief than a simple tensioner. Ask anyone who has changed a pan gasket on the C5 .

Good luck.
Go Fast Kid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2012, 06:22 PM   #6
PQ
1st State Chevy supporter
 
PQ's Avatar
 
Drives: Hybrid SS Camaro
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Mobile, AL
Posts: 36,719
Send a message via Yahoo to PQ
Quote:
Originally Posted by bcguy View Post
so just to be clear,not to hyjack thread,sorry,do we absulutely have to change the tensioner on the ls3 when doing the cam swap,i heard there was problems with both tensioners failing
There have been several found broken on simple cam swaps and a few others broken after the single bolt cams broke. But those ones are not necessarily known to be the cause of the failure.
__________________
PQ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2012, 07:09 PM   #7
JDP Tech

 
JDP Tech's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 CGM Camaro 2SS/RS 429 LSX/F1X
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Sandy, UT
Posts: 427
Agreed, each person can choose what they want, both configurations will work, and many will not have any problems.
We always use the 3-bolt cam sprocket, and dampener. Pulling the oil pump off in the car is not very hard to do.

Though it is true the LSA, LS3 and L99 all use the same sprocket and tensioner, the badder boy engines (LS9, LS7, and dry-sump LS3) all use the 3-bolt sprocket and the dampener. When changing the cam in these LS3/L99s, we get similar power to the LS9 and LS7, plus the three bolt design and dampener are more dependable, so why not spend the little bit extra for insurance?

The reason the LSA, LS3, L99, and almost every other V8 engine GM makes (trucks, SUVs, cars, etc) all have the exact same cam sprocket and tensioner, is because it works and is cheaper to do, and thats what they're after. If it was better, why would the premium engines (LS9, LS7, dry sump LS3) be different?

- Jeremy
JDP Tech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2012, 03:56 AM   #8
Stingr69
'69 Owned Since '79
 
Stingr69's Avatar
 
Drives: '69 Z/28 LeMans Blue w/White
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: LR AR
Posts: 1,574
Quote:
Originally Posted by JDP Tech View Post
Agreed, each person can choose what they want, both configurations will work, and many will not have any problems.
We always use the 3-bolt cam sprocket, and dampener. Pulling the oil pump off in the car is not very hard to do.

Though it is true the LSA, LS3 and L99 all use the same sprocket and tensioner, the badder boy engines (LS9, LS7, and dry-sump LS3) all use the 3-bolt sprocket and the dampener. When changing the cam in these LS3/L99s, we get similar power to the LS9 and LS7, plus the three bolt design and dampener are more dependable, so why not spend the little bit extra for insurance?

The reason the LSA, LS3, L99, and almost every other V8 engine GM makes (trucks, SUVs, cars, etc) all have the exact same cam sprocket and tensioner, is because it works and is cheaper to do, and thats what they're after. If it was better, why would the premium engines (LS9, LS7, dry sump LS3) be different?

- Jeremy
They use the same tensioner on the LS9 as they use in the LS3. I have seen the factory assembly video.

-Mark.
Stingr69 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2012, 09:10 AM   #9
CGT
 
Drives: 2011 SSm6
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: St.Louis
Posts: 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by JANNETTYRACING View Post
There are several 3 bolt gears, which one do you have?
I am using 12586481 gear. I am putting a LS7 cam in my personal car,2011 SS LS3. I have the cam, gaskets, etc. And figure, what the hell. I have more time than money right now. Which dampener or tensioner would you use Ted? Gonna try and knock this out Saturday morning. Thanks for your response.
CGT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2012, 09:30 AM   #10
CGT
 
Drives: 2011 SSm6
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: St.Louis
Posts: 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by JDP Tech View Post
Agreed, each person can choose what they want, both configurations will work, and many will not have any problems.
We always use the 3-bolt cam sprocket, and dampener. Pulling the oil pump off in the car is not very hard to do.

Though it is true the LSA, LS3 and L99 all use the same sprocket and tensioner, the badder boy engines (LS9, LS7, and dry-sump LS3) all use the 3-bolt sprocket and the dampener. When changing the cam in these LS3/L99s, we get similar power to the LS9 and LS7, plus the three bolt design and dampener are more dependable, so why not spend the little bit extra for insurance?

The reason the LSA, LS3, L99, and almost every other V8 engine GM makes (trucks, SUVs, cars, etc) all have the exact same cam sprocket and tensioner, is because it works and is cheaper to do, and thats what they're after. If it was better, why would the premium engines (LS9, LS7, dry sump LS3) be different?

- Jeremy
LS7 is the only current ls that i see using the dampener. LS9, LSA and all LS3's dry and wet sump show using #12626407 Tensioner assy. The dampener definitely has no moving parts to fail, I like that about it for sure. Just wonder why they made the switch.
CGT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2012, 09:46 AM   #11
JANNETTYRACING
PRESIDENT CALIBRATOR JRE

 
JANNETTYRACING's Avatar
 
Drives: YELLOW 2013 ZL1 AUTO
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: ON THE DYNO WATERBURY CT.
Posts: 9,109
Quote:
Originally Posted by CGT View Post
LS7 is the only current ls that i see using the dampener. LS9, LSA and all LS3's dry and wet sump show using #12626407 Tensioner assy. The dampener definitely has no moving parts to fail, I like that about it for sure. Just wonder why they made the switch.
The Spring loaded tensioner is Preferred method for a timing chain but we have seen a few broken upon disassembly so confidence is only about 90% on them

I like them because they reduce noise that the Knock sensors can pick up and they keep the chain snug all the time which reduces what I will call Snap Tensioning on the chain or Whipping of the chain.

So Again to Each his own.

Ted.
__________________
Technical information, Parts Sales, Professional Installation, and Custom Dyno Tuning.
Please vist our web sites for all your performance needs!
Ted Jannetty
Jannetty Racing Ent Inc.
2984 East Main St.
Waterbury Ct. 06705
203-753-7223
tedj@jannettyracing.com
www.jannettyracing.com
www.turboaddictionparts.com
Performance Parts
JANNETTYRACING is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2012, 09:54 AM   #12
Bell040


 
Bell040's Avatar
 
Drives: 2SS/RS - Black - GFX
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: B'ham, Alabama
Posts: 2,457
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showth...=ls9+tensioner

post #21
__________________
Ordered: 10-13-08
Built: 3-30-09 (#1691)
Recieved: 6-12-09

Blacked out, Cammed (Lunati Voodoo 233/245, .578/.598 @114°, +4°), ARH LTs, VR OTR CAI, Cutouts, and lots of other fun mods.
Bell040 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2012, 09:57 AM   #13
CGT
 
Drives: 2011 SSm6
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: St.Louis
Posts: 191
Thank you Ted. Never considered the knock sensor thing, seems logical. I think ill give the stock tensioner a whirl. I have the dampener also, if i change my mind. So you have used that three bolt gear 12586481 with the stock tensioner i assume?
CGT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2012, 10:48 AM   #14
JANNETTYRACING
PRESIDENT CALIBRATOR JRE

 
JANNETTYRACING's Avatar
 
Drives: YELLOW 2013 ZL1 AUTO
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: ON THE DYNO WATERBURY CT.
Posts: 9,109
Quote:
Originally Posted by CGT View Post
Thank you Ted. Never considered the knock sensor thing, seems logical. I think ill give the stock tensioner a whirl. I have the dampener also, if i change my mind. So you have used that three bolt gear 12586481 with the stock tensioner i assume?
That is the correct gear number.
__________________
Technical information, Parts Sales, Professional Installation, and Custom Dyno Tuning.
Please vist our web sites for all your performance needs!
Ted Jannetty
Jannetty Racing Ent Inc.
2984 East Main St.
Waterbury Ct. 06705
203-753-7223
tedj@jannettyracing.com
www.jannettyracing.com
www.turboaddictionparts.com
Performance Parts
JANNETTYRACING is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2012, 11:05 AM   #15
CGT
 
Drives: 2011 SSm6
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: St.Louis
Posts: 191
Thank you Ted, I appreciate it.
CGT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2012, 11:09 AM   #16
Anthony @ LG Motorsports



 
Anthony @ LG Motorsports's Avatar
 
Drives: 1994 1LE / 2006 Z51 Corvette
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Plano, TX
Posts: 2,290
We convert all of the cars to a three bolt cam gear and go back to the traditional LS2/LS7 'dog bone' style damper assembly.

In testing here, we have seen broken tensioner assemblies on the LS3 style as well as broken chains. I don't know if it was an issue with the tensioner (LS3) itself or a combination of the tensioner(LS3) and chain.

Since 2008 we have done all of our cam kits with the three bolt gear, dog bone, and Katech chains. Zero issues to date
__________________
Anthony @ LG Motorsports is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2012, 11:54 AM   #17
Rock-It Man
376 cubic inches of fun
 
Rock-It Man's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 2SS A6
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: MA
Posts: 1,024
FWIW, here's the ZL1's 6.2L LSA V8, with one bolt cam and spring loaded tensioner.

Rock-It Man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2012, 01:14 PM   #18
Stingr69
'69 Owned Since '79
 
Stingr69's Avatar
 
Drives: '69 Z/28 LeMans Blue w/White
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: LR AR
Posts: 1,574
True - The ZL-1 uses a stock LS3 Tensioner but it also uses GM valve springs and GM cam lift rates and additional components that were all designed to work together relaibly. If you up the ramp rates with a custom grind cams and heavy spring pressures etc then you could say "all bets are off" when it comes to the tensioner. The tuners have learned from experience to change them out during a valve train upgrade.

JMO.

-Mark.
Stingr69 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2012, 02:23 PM   #19
flht99b

 
flht99b's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 2SS/RS RJT
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Knoxville
Posts: 1,308
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stingr69 View Post
True - The ZL-1 uses a stock LS3 Tensioner but it also uses GM valve springs and GM cam lift rates and additional components that were all designed to work together relaibly. If you up the ramp rates with a custom grind cams and heavy spring pressures etc then you could say "all bets are off" when it comes to the tensioner. The tuners have learned from experience to change them out during a valve train upgrade.

JMO.

-Mark.
Exactly. Fast accelerating cam lobes, heavy seat/open pressure dual valve springs which transmit additional force to the LS3 spring loaded tensioner and timing chain. Harley didn't stay with it's spring loaded cam chain tensioners very long, instead they redesigned to a hydraulic tensioner setup.
Ed M.
__________________
RJT 2SS/RS, AAM 3.70's, MTI Sway Bars, Shifter & SS brake lines, BMR Trailing & Toe Arms, full rear cradle & diff bushings, Pedders XA's, Camber/Toe eccentrics, Radius arm inserts, Hawk HPS Brake pads, GTO clutch reservoir, LS9 cam, Comp Cam valve springs, Melling 10296 oil pump, CR 5 timing chain, LS2 damper, CAI Cold Air Induction, ARH LT headers w/HF cats, GMPP touring axle back, Elite Engineering Catch Can, Forgeline 20x9 & 20x11 DS3 wheels w/Vredstein 275/40/20 & 315/35/20 tires, '11 Convertible spoiler, Lloyd "SS" Floor Mats, GM Camaro Trunk Mat, GM SS Fender & LS3 Emblems.
flht99b is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Official 1/4 Mile (V8) 2010+ Camaro Fast List Merc Dragstrip and Launch Techniques Discussion 2619 Today 01:29 AM
Cam basics CamaroSpike23 Camaro V8 LS3 / L99 Engine, Exhaust, and Bolt-Ons 74 07-07-2014 01:54 AM
Small cam pushrods and cam gear b20 V8 - Engine, Exhaust, Bolt-Ons, Tuning Equipment 12 05-14-2011 07:21 AM
Shop help please...toe arms cam bolt measurement robsls3 Suspension / Brakes / Chassis 2 03-17-2011 12:16 PM
installing hot cam logan1080 Camaro V8 LS3 / L99 Engine, Exhaust, and Bolt-Ons 47 11-23-2008 06:12 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:14 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.