Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com
 
Phastek Performance
Go Back   Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com > General Camaro Forums > Camaro ZL1 Forum - ZL1 Specific Topics

Camaro ZL1 Forum - ZL1 Specific Topics Camaro ZL1 specific topics

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 03-22-2015, 02:45 AM   #1
GenF-GTS
 
GenF-GTS's Avatar
 
Drives: none
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: sydney
Posts: 416
Elite Catch Can Not Working Very Well

This is the install location of my catch can:



Update:
I am nearing 20,000km (12,427miles) now so today I thought I would take the blower lid off and inspect for oil that the catch can is possibly not collecting. Not happy I did find some oil......I just hate to think how bad this would be without a catch can at all.





Here are the intake ports which look rather nice to be honest the fuel is cleaning the oil off and the valves too although i wasn't able to get the camera in to take a picture of the valves they were crystal clean like the port where the fuel is hitting.



Zoomed in version of the same port, you can see where the fuel has cleaned the oil off the port.



Ok so what to do now and the reasons why this is happening:
I believe the issue can be a couple of scenarios or a combination of these scenarios.
1. Heat, the location of the catch can does not get cool air so the oil inside the can is not able to condense and liquefy from oil vapor into oil. (To some degree it will be condensing just not all of it in this case)
2. Heat the system just runs hot combined with the above it does no favors

Solutions are:
1. Get a glass fuel filter and mount it on the return oil line as close to the catch can as possible, this should catch anything the can misses and run back into the catch can. Looks like this:

2. mount it on the other side where there is a lot more space, once the air box is removed and you have either an OTR or a pod filter
3. run 2 catch cans and a glass fuel filter - this is what i will be doing once i get it tuned with the Duspeed OTR. I have circled where I will be mounting the 2nd catch can.

(Note: I do not currently have the OTR fitted as I have not gotten the car tuned for it yet so I am running the stock airbox as seen in the first picture)

__________________

GenF-GTS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 06:50 AM   #2
vatechguy3
 
Drives: 2014 ZL1 M6
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Virginia
Posts: 373
Not to nit pick, but are you sure you have it plumbed correctly?

Tony
__________________
2014 ZL1 M6
Bone stock, for now!

2001 Z28 M6
!cags, !air, FTP 85mm Lid, Z06 85mm MAF, P&P TB
!4x4, Strano Springs, Strano Sways, Koni 4/4s, Watts Link
ARH LTs, ARH catted Y, SLP catback with Dual/Dual Muffler, SLP CME and Valance
OE Wheels Chrome C5 DDs, 18x10.5s, with 295/35-18s on all 4 corners!
352rwhp and 366rwtq
vatechguy3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 07:03 AM   #3
GenF-GTS
 
GenF-GTS's Avatar
 
Drives: none
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: sydney
Posts: 416
Quote:
Originally Posted by vatechguy3 View Post
Not to nit pick, but are you sure you have it plumbed correctly?

Tony
Yeah here is a video of me telling others how to install the catch can on my car.

__________________

GenF-GTS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 07:19 AM   #4
Chrispy
 
Drives: 2015 Camaro ZL1, 2014 ATS, 2013 SRX
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Canada
Posts: 220
Thanks for the info,

Which version do you have? (1 or 2)
Chrispy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 07:24 AM   #5
GenF-GTS
 
GenF-GTS's Avatar
 
Drives: none
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: sydney
Posts: 416
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chrispy View Post
Thanks for the info,

Which version do you have? (1 or 2)
Elite E2
__________________

GenF-GTS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 08:11 AM   #6
CanadianZL1#992
ANGRY Z
 
CanadianZL1#992's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 Camaro ZL1 Davenport Stage 5+
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 1,199
I have elite 1 mounted in same location. When I changed my blower at 6000 miles there was no oil. Clean about 1/2 inch or so of oil out of the can every 1000 miles
__________________
2012 ZL1 M6 686RWHP(91 tune)750RWHP(VP109 tune)
2014 ZL1 A6 607RWHP(91 tune) 652RWHP (VP109 tune)
2014 Ford TREMOR 4x4(Roush CAI +tune)
CanadianZL1#992 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 08:27 AM   #7
GenF-GTS
 
GenF-GTS's Avatar
 
Drives: none
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: sydney
Posts: 416
Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadianZL1#992 View Post
I have elite 1 mounted in same location. When I changed my blower at 6000 miles there was no oil. Clean about 1/2 inch or so of oil out of the can every 1000 miles
Mine is catching oil.....just not all of it.

Here are the measurements i recorded:

just over 5000km (3106miles) about 10ml (visually guessed the amount)
just over 10,000km (6213miles) about 15ml (visually guessed the amount)
11,685km (7260miles) exactly 30mls of oil (measured the amount)
15,115km (9392miles) exactly 42ml of oil (measured the amount)

(This was emptied every 600-1000miles into the same container so i could keep track of how much oil i have collected in total)

Each amount listed above is the total amount collected from brand new so in total i have collected 42mls + whatever else i have collected since emptying it into my container this weekend.

So the catch can is catching some oil.....just not all of it.
__________________

GenF-GTS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 09:58 AM   #8
Caswell239

 
Caswell239's Avatar
 
Drives: 2011 2ss/rs
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,234
My catch can is not catching anything either. Granted mines a different brand but it's like it's not even installed. Still have oil pooling in the supercharger :(
Caswell239 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 10:51 AM   #9
unstable vic
Account Suspended
 
Drives: 2014 ZL1
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 344
It's because it's no big deal. You guys are a bit crazy with all this catch can stuff. GM designed the engine and endurance tested it to reach 100,000 miles with a warranty without everyone concerned where oil is or going. Let me take my oil pan out and inspect that for oil lolol.
unstable vic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 11:01 AM   #10
GenF-GTS
 
GenF-GTS's Avatar
 
Drives: none
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: sydney
Posts: 416
Quote:
Originally Posted by unstable vic View Post
It's because it's no big deal. You guys are a bit crazy with all this catch can stuff. GM designed the engine and endurance tested it to reach 100,000 miles with a warranty without everyone concerned where oil is or going. Let me take my oil pan out and inspect that for oil lolol.
Yes the engine will run for many years but it will lose performance once carbon oil and dirt combine and bake on to the valves like this.

__________________

GenF-GTS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 11:28 AM   #11
unstable vic
Account Suspended
 
Drives: 2014 ZL1
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 344
I use the GM recommended large black bottle of Chevron Fuel System Cleaner every oil change. Have been for years. Never had any engine not perform well or look like that. I'm 50 so this isn't my first rodeo or not even close to my first performance car. The Chevron cleaner is the same exact product GM used to market as there top end cleaner btw.
unstable vic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 11:46 AM   #12
GenF-GTS
 
GenF-GTS's Avatar
 
Drives: none
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: sydney
Posts: 416
Quote:
Originally Posted by unstable vic View Post
I use the GM recommended large black bottle of Chevron Fuel System Cleaner every oil change. Have been for years. Never had any engine not perform well or look like that. I'm 50 so this isn't my first rodeo or not even close to my first performance car. The Chevron cleaner is the same exact product GM used to market as there top end cleaner btw.
Based on your findings no one will ever use a catch can ever again LOL
__________________

GenF-GTS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 12:19 PM   #13
Elite Engineering

 
Elite Engineering's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Denver
Posts: 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by GenF-GTS View Post
Elite E2
Do you also have the Clean-Side Separator Installed? If not, this oil could be the result of ingestion from the Clean-Side.
__________________
Elite Engineering is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 12:27 PM   #14
GenF-GTS
 
GenF-GTS's Avatar
 
Drives: none
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: sydney
Posts: 416
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elite Engineering View Post
Do you also have the Clean-Side Separator Installed? If not, this oil could be the result of ingestion from the Clean-Side.
Thanks for the reply, I don't have it installed however I have looked at the hollow tube on the intake pipe and the throttle body + intake tube all are oil free.
__________________

GenF-GTS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 12:34 PM   #15
unstable vic
Account Suspended
 
Drives: 2014 ZL1
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 344
Lol I guess they won't lolol.
unstable vic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 12:39 PM   #16
djnice
 
djnice's Avatar
 
Drives: 13 ZL1 SIM, 99 Z28 Black
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 610
Did you install the catch can from day 1? Could the oil have got there prior to catch can install?

Have you looked behind the throttle body where the pcv returns...in coming tube from the catch can? If it is dry around the tube inlet then the oil is coming from somewhere else.
__________________
2013 ZL1 - SIM, 6 spd, RotoFab CAI, Craftsman Can. / 1999 Z28 - Black, 6 spd, K&N, Subframe. / More Fun Stuff - www.inlandspeed.com
djnice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 12:40 PM   #17
jsd
 
jsd's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 ZL 1 #370
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elite Engineering View Post
Do you also have the Clean-Side Separator Installed? If not, this oil could be the result of ingestion from the Clean-Side.
What about the clean side seperator? Never hear about this. Can you explain better. I also have the elite 2. but i hope the oil problem was solved for me

Just til today, i have seen this thread
jsd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 12:46 PM   #18
GenF-GTS
 
GenF-GTS's Avatar
 
Drives: none
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: sydney
Posts: 416
Quote:
Originally Posted by djnice View Post
Did you install the catch can from day 1? Could the oil have got there prior to catch can install?

Have you looked behind the throttle body where the pcv returns...in coming tube from the catch can? If it is dry around the tube inlet then the oil is coming from somewhere else.
I installed it on day 2 of ownership, day 1 was very minimal driving and wouldn't have caused this.

I'll have a look soon at the inlet from the can to the snout and see.
__________________

GenF-GTS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 01:20 PM   #19
djnice
 
djnice's Avatar
 
Drives: 13 ZL1 SIM, 99 Z28 Black
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 610
It's easy to see with a flash light by just removing your air inlet tube.

Your 30 ml in 7,000 mile is low. I think your not catching very well. I get 15 ml (not measured...just visually guessing .5 oz) in 500 miles.
__________________
2013 ZL1 - SIM, 6 spd, RotoFab CAI, Craftsman Can. / 1999 Z28 - Black, 6 spd, K&N, Subframe. / More Fun Stuff - www.inlandspeed.com
djnice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 01:38 PM   #20
GenF-GTS
 
GenF-GTS's Avatar
 
Drives: none
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: sydney
Posts: 416
6am Monday here now so I'll check further some time during the week when I have time to get into it.
__________________

GenF-GTS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2015, 03:31 AM   #21
NW Sam
 
Drives: 2014 ZL1 Red
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Wa
Posts: 171
Hi GenF-GTS,
What did GM name your car over there in Australia? Nice looking ride, Cheers. Thanks, Sam.
NW Sam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2015, 04:56 AM   #22
GenF-GTS
 
GenF-GTS's Avatar
 
Drives: none
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: sydney
Posts: 416
Quote:
Originally Posted by NW Sam View Post
Hi GenF-GTS,
What did GM name your car over there in Australia? Nice looking ride, Cheers. Thanks, Sam.
HSV (Holden Special Vehicles) Gen F GTS it's the performance division of Holden GM Australia.

Check it out here http://www.hsv.com.au/Gen-F/see/GTS/
__________________

GenF-GTS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2015, 07:44 AM   #23
GenF-GTS
 
GenF-GTS's Avatar
 
Drives: none
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: sydney
Posts: 416
Update:

Tonight after work I removed the throttle body to have a look from this angle into the snout and also look inside in the intake tube + clean side cylinder attached to intake tube.
I was able to find a small amount of oil on the inside of the throttle body once removed, you can see it in this picture around the gasket at the bottom:



The intake tube looks clean there are no traces of oil in it, here are the pictures as best i could to get one with the right angle to see into the breather tube. If this was leaking from here wouldn't it leave an oil splatter coming out from the tube into the throttle body?





I then removed the return line on the catch can, as it has the AN fuel line type fittings i had to cut it off, so here is the cut off piece....the dry area is where it mounted to the fitting, the wet area is part of the line that would have seen oil....as you can see it is wet with oil. (This is the return line going to the manifold)

__________________

GenF-GTS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2015, 08:06 AM   #24
Russell James


 
Russell James's Avatar
 
Drives: 1st gen drag car, 5th gen stock car
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: SE Michigan
Posts: 3,569
That little bit of oil in the top end is meaningless. Quit worrying about it and enjoy the car.

It's actually helping lube things. The OE setup does pretty good in recircing the vapors back to the crankcase and burning off that little bit of oil and vapors. A catch can will help a bit more to catch the heavier liquids.... but in a non direct injection engine, that little bit of oil burn is meaningless. On a DI engine, too much intake oil can carbon up the intake valves because there is no intake fuel to wash it off.

Even with a catch can there is still oil in the vapors going up into the intake that will settle out in the low spots of the intake under certain throttle conditions. It's just sit there and look ugly, but affects nothing.

If the car is driven so hard in cornering that the valve covers are getting flooded from the G's... like during a full day of an HPDE track day. Then there will really be a lot of oil up in the catch can and intake. Empty can, don't worry about that little bit in the engine. Engines use oil for lube, that little extra up there will do nothing.

If there was so much oil going into the intake to actually affect things, it would be smoking, spark knock, power loss... When just a minute normal amount... normal power, no smoke, no knock, plugs will look clean, normal oil consumption... and there will still be that little bit that pools here and there in hte intake... meaningless.

If it were antifreeze, I'd worry. Oil... engines don't mind a little upper end oil actually helps lube things. When it becomes too much intake oil, it will be very obvious in performance, knock, oil consumption.... Normal oil consumption, I'd ignore that little bit up there.
Russell James is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2015, 09:20 AM   #25
djnice
 
djnice's Avatar
 
Drives: 13 ZL1 SIM, 99 Z28 Black
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 610
So I wonder if other people have checked this with their catch cans. Seems like quite a bit is getting past it.
__________________
2013 ZL1 - SIM, 6 spd, RotoFab CAI, Craftsman Can. / 1999 Z28 - Black, 6 spd, K&N, Subframe. / More Fun Stuff - www.inlandspeed.com
djnice is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:41 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.