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Old 02-18-2012, 12:45 PM   #101
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...and looking at them now you violated #3 too...


I say voilate #2 a little bit and get these... Nine Balls price is cheaper than what I quoted earlier...

P40SC forged Monoblock . No worries about 3 piece wheels leaking either... and get them in any finish or color you want...


sometimes you DO get what you pay for...
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Old 02-18-2012, 12:51 PM   #102
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That's my formula. I just need to find out how much the Vossens weigh.

Interestingly enough I violated the first two with my last purchase. LOL
As long as you know now that you don't always get what you pay for.


On a serious note; you think we'll ever let you live this down?
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Old 02-18-2012, 01:24 PM   #103
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...and looking at them now you violated #3 too...

No doubt. Funny thing is they still actually look pretty good when on the car. I actually still get compliments on them.



sometimes you DO get what you pay for...
True. I'm just admittedly bitter. But Tony is hooking me up with a good deal on Forgelines. So right now I'm going back and forth on that and Vossen. I"m sure Tony would give me a break on these too but the Forgelines are just a bit less.

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On a serious note; you think we'll ever let you live this down?
I'd be disapointed if you did.

And as long as we don't forget it, is more time Savini is known on here for it.
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Old 02-18-2012, 01:33 PM   #104
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Ok.

So my thought process now is this:

Vossen are much less expensive. I can get tires, sensors AND the wheels for the price of Forgelines. And still have money for gas. lol

Somebody tell me the TRUE difference?

I mean the kind of difference that is worth 2 thousand dollars. Because I've spent the big bucks for 3 piece forged wheels before and even taking the out of round problems and leaking air problems away I still didn't see what exactly I was paying for.

Quote:
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Hey PQ,

If you are even remotely considering road racing your Camaro, then go with the Forgelines. The "lower cost" wheels, although fine for the street, would not be suitable for track.

Also, go with as wide a front as possible. I'm running 20x10 front and 20x11 rear Forgelines with Pfadt coilovers. Makes the car look mean!
Ok, I need to bite on this...

In the entire time I have been on the forums everyone will preach that you have to buy top quality wheels if you want to track the car. However, I have yet to see anyone post a list of track quality wheels that doesn't use the sole determining factor to be the price of the wheel.

Forgestar - People say since you can walk away with a set for under 2k you shouldn't track them, however a ton of people are and I have personally not heard of any issues. What about their wheel makes them unsafe?

Vossen - same as above. What makes them unsafe?

Mind you I am not talking about the cheap rip off wheels that we all know are for looks and a hazard to even put on the car.

It just seems that a huge game of telephone where one person in 2009 said that cheap means you can't track with no supporting evidence, and now in 2012 everyone says you can't track them and doesn't know why...

So I'm asking, why?
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Old 02-18-2012, 02:15 PM   #105
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So I'm asking, why?


I have pretty much assumed that it's not unsafe but just less performance. And less durable should the tires come apart or whatever.

But I'm just guessing.

Of course the ZL1 wheels have done pretty damn good and are cast wheels.

If the Vossen wheels weigh the same or less than the ZL1 wheels then our question is more interesting. A balanced set-up is better on a road course or autox but take a cast Vossen wheel on a balanced set-up and tell me what the advantage to the more expensive wheels is?
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Old 02-18-2012, 02:48 PM   #106
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Ok, I need to bite on this...

In the entire time I have been on the forums everyone will preach that you have to buy top quality wheels if you want to track the car. However, I have yet to see anyone post a list of track quality wheels that doesn't use the sole determining factor to be the price of the wheel.

Forgestar - People say since you can walk away with a set for under 2k you shouldn't track them, however a ton of people are and I have personally not heard of any issues. What about their wheel makes them unsafe?

Vossen - same as above. What makes them unsafe?

Mind you I am not talking about the cheap rip off wheels that we all know are for looks and a hazard to even put on the car.

It just seems that a huge game of telephone where one person in 2009 said that cheap means you can't track with no supporting evidence, and now in 2012 everyone says you can't track them and doesn't know why...

So I'm asking, why?
Who has posted that? I have never read anything like that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PQ View Post


I have pretty much assumed that it's not unsafe but just less performance. And less durable should the tires come apart or whatever.

But I'm just guessing.

Of course the ZL1 wheels have done pretty damn good and are cast wheels.

If the Vossen wheels weigh the same or less than the ZL1 wheels then our question is more interesting. A balanced set-up is better on a road course or autox but take a cast Vossen wheel on a balanced set-up and tell me what the advantage to the more expensive wheels is?
LOLs, ZL1 wheels are forged.

Weight/size is what performance is all about for wheels. The only reason people prefer forged wheels is not because a forged wheel will perform better than a cast wheel. That is not always true. It depends on size and weight. Forged aluminum is stronger than cast aluminum, so you can make a forged wheel just as strong as a cast wheel with less material. That is what makes the wheel lighter, using less material. Obviously smaller wheels will ALWAYS perform better. Obviously lighter weight wheels will always perform better.

This reminds me of the same myth that people think chromoly race parts are lighter that mild steel because chromoly is lighter. IT IS NOT. It is stronger so you can make the same strength part with thinner material. Less material = less weight.

Cast wheel doesn't mean crappy wheel, just like forged doesn't mean quality wheel. Wheel design is a big factor. Cast wheels are great, hell 99% of all OEM aluminum wheels are cast.
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Old 02-18-2012, 03:35 PM   #107
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Who has posted that? I have never read anything like that.

I guess it's more implied than anything else.

LOLs, ZL1 wheels are forged. LOL, I meant to look that up fist. haha

Weight/size is what performance is all about for wheels. The only reason people prefer forged wheels is not because a forged wheel will perform better than a cast wheel. That is not always true. It depends on size and weight. Forged aluminum is stronger than cast aluminum, so you can make a forged wheel just as strong as a cast wheel with less material. That is what makes the wheel lighter, using less material. Obviously smaller wheels will ALWAYS perform better. Obviously lighter weight wheels will always perform better.

This reminds me of the same myth that people think chromoly race parts are lighter that mild steel because chromoly is lighter. IT IS NOT. It is stronger so you can make the same strength part with thinner material. Less material = less weight.

Cast wheel doesn't mean crappy wheel, just like forged doesn't mean quality wheel. Wheel design is a big factor. Cast wheels are great, hell 99% of all OEM aluminum wheels are cast.
I guess that's my point. Is that if the Vossens weigh less I should be able to get good performance from them and save some money?
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Old 02-18-2012, 03:43 PM   #108
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What's your preferences?
#1 Holds air
#2 Round is good
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Old 02-18-2012, 03:50 PM   #109
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Ok, I need to bite on this...

In the entire time I have been on the forums everyone will preach that you have to buy top quality wheels if you want to track the car. However, I have yet to see anyone post a list of track quality wheels that doesn't use the sole determining factor to be the price of the wheel.

Forgestar - People say since you can walk away with a set for under 2k you shouldn't track them, however a ton of people are and I have personally not heard of any issues. What about their wheel makes them unsafe?

Vossen - same as above. What makes them unsafe?

Mind you I am not talking about the cheap rip off wheels that we all know are for looks and a hazard to even put on the car.

It just seems that a huge game of telephone where one person in 2009 said that cheap means you can't track with no supporting evidence, and now in 2012 everyone says you can't track them and doesn't know why...

So I'm asking, why?
Go to any SCCA or NASA weekend and see what the racers use. If you watched the 24 Hours of Daytona you saw one car after the other on Forgeline wheels. I have been using Forgeline for years for custom wheels. They have delivered top quality work on time every time.
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Old 02-18-2012, 03:53 PM   #110
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#1 Holds air
#2 Round is good
I feel that those are more requirements than preferences.
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Old 02-18-2012, 04:05 PM   #111
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Quote:
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#1 Holds air
#2 Round is good


Quote:
Originally Posted by stieger View Post
I feel that those are more requirements than preferences.
With Savini they are cost options.
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Old 02-18-2012, 04:17 PM   #112
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I guess that's my point. Is that if the Vossens weigh less I should be able to get good performance from them and save some money?
To be honest I don't know too much about Vossen wheels, but from what I see/read around here they seem to be more "luxury" wheels (just like Savini wheels) than performance centered. I don't know if they are built to handle the strains of track performance or just look pretty.

I did a lot of researching when I bought my Forgestar F14s and there are tons of GTRs, Porches and BMWs tracking theses wheels so it was a no brainer for me.








Quote:
Originally Posted by JusticePete View Post
Go to any SCCA or NASA weekend and see what the racers use. If you watched the 24 Hours of Daytona you saw one car after the other on Forgeline wheels. I have been using Forgeline for years for custom wheels. They have delivered top quality work on time every time.
Forgelines are awesome wheels, but they are no where near budget wheels. Serious race car owners usually don't care about the cost of wheels.
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Old 02-18-2012, 05:46 PM   #113
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Correct me if I'm wrong but I think the ZL1 wheels ARE cast aluminum,

but they are Rotory "Forged" which in theory gives GM the right to say they are Forged.

It can be misleading....or am I completely wrong?

When I saw the ZL1 in Oshawa the wheels didn't look like they were machined from a solid piece of billit....the looked cast.

Anyway PQ, if you get the Forgelines from Nineball,you will never have to talk about wheels ever again.....unless of course you want to tell everybody how awesome they are...
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Old 02-18-2012, 06:03 PM   #114
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...and avoid your addiction to chrome plating. Chrome adds weight, and are impossible to repair when damaged - without having to rechrome them. Keep a layer of automotive wax on the bare polished aluminum and they will repel water and won't dull.

That, and even some of the best brands have had chrome peeling issues. It can be avoided by avoiding chrome.
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Old 02-18-2012, 06:18 PM   #115
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Anyway PQ, if you get the Forgelines from Nineball,you will never have to talk about wheels ever again.....unless of course you want to tell everybody how awesome they are...
Or to bash Savini still.

Quote:
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...and avoid your addiction to chrome plating. Chrome adds weight, and are impossible to repair when damaged - without having to rechrome them. Keep a layer of automotive wax on the bare polished aluminum and they will repel water and won't dull.

That, and even some of the best brands have had chrome peeling issues. It can be avoided by avoiding chrome.
Good stuff. I would have no problem avoiding the chrome. I need to keep the cost down.
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Old 02-18-2012, 06:27 PM   #116
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PQ, The Forgelines in Nine Ball's avatar are almost done right The correct way is to have the inner barrel match the finish of the outer barrel.



It only takes a little longer to clean and polish them

Polished aluminum is the best but keeping them looking new
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Old 02-18-2012, 06:31 PM   #117
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PQ, The Forgelines in Nine Ball's avatar are almost done right The correct way is to have the inner barrel match the finish of the outer barrel.



It only takes a little longer to clean and polish them

Polished aluminum is the best but keeping them looking new
I'd definitely do the polished aluminum. As long as it's shiny.
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Old 02-18-2012, 07:12 PM   #118
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I'd definitely do the polished aluminum. As long as it's shiny.
From me to you for your new wheels.

Step #1



Step #2



Step #3




Step #4


Finishing touches for your order.
  • Have the valve stems run through a fastner hole
  • Flush mount TPMS sensors
  • Titanium hardware to save weight
  • Lightening pockets in the hubs
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Old 02-18-2012, 07:14 PM   #119
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The valve stem is at about 2 o'clock.

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Old 02-18-2012, 07:17 PM   #120
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Oh, another nice thing about the Forgelines is that the TPMS sensors mount like they do on the stock wheels.
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Old 02-18-2012, 07:24 PM   #121
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Oh, another nice thing about the Forgelines is that the TPMS sensors mount like they do on the stock wheels.
Only on the stepped lip Performance Series. Like yours. The lighter ones.
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Old 02-18-2012, 07:28 PM   #122
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...and looking at them now you violated #3 too...


I say voilate #2 a little bit and get these... Nine Balls price is cheaper than what I quoted earlier...

P40SC forged Monoblock . No worries about 3 piece wheels leaking either... and get them in any finish or color you want...


sometimes you DO get what you pay for...
I know HRE from a project in 2004 and polish

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Old 02-18-2012, 07:29 PM   #123
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Only on the stepped lip Performance Series. Like yours. The lighter ones.

Tony, thanks for the correction. I didn't realize that.

I just know that those "other wheels" I had were a pita to mount the sensors.
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Old 02-18-2012, 07:39 PM   #124
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Stepped lip wheels also don't do the rain-wobble dance. Water doesn't get trapped behind the spokes.

Can you tell I prefer stepped lip wheels?
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Old 02-18-2012, 07:42 PM   #125
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Stepped lip wheels also don't do the rain-wobble dance. Water doesn't get trapped behind the spokes.

Can you tell I prefer stepped lip wheels?
I find the stepped lip wheels are MUCH easier to clean than my other wheels were. The water just runs off. No puddles (like you said) AND the finish stays on the wheels when I wash and polish them.

Did I mention that the car is tons quicker with them too?
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