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Old 03-30-2012, 07:57 PM   #631
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hmmm i want one!!!
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Old 03-30-2012, 08:02 PM   #632
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The information so far says that the hood is wrapped. If that's true, you might be able to remove the wrap and have factory paint underneath. Just a thought...
If that is true, then you are my favorite person today. IDK if I like the black hood yet or not. My first impression is it makes the car look ratty as if it was in a front end collision and the hood was just primed. But who knows. I may end up liking it and keep it. I am just wondering what options I have. I love the black wheels though. When I got an SS I was actually going to power coat my wheels black.
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Old 03-30-2012, 08:06 PM   #633
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This is nice, I'm thinking about upgrading to 3.70s or now even the 3.91s!
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Old 03-30-2012, 08:08 PM   #634
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Considering that Warp 1 = Light Speed... I don't really think so... 280Miles/hr is nothing compared to 186,000Miles/sec.

Given that Warp is calculated with in TOS and in TNG, it's not even close...
Ha ha, I know! I was making a joke, that if it had that much power to to attain those speeds and the suspension stayed the same...things could get warped
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Old 03-30-2012, 08:11 PM   #635
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I wouldn't let it get to you. I know how hard it is to give your best effort on something and have people rip it up, but that's just the harshness of people. Someone will complain about something. The fuel fill hole is on the wrong side, the car is too blacked out, the car is not blacked out enough, etc. Just human nature. I always tell myself if we weren't constantly unhappy/unsatisfied we would probably still be living in trees and eating termites instead of driving camaros.

If I wanted to I could find something I don't like either, but then no car will ever be perfect for you unless you build it yourself. That's what modifications are for. You take the closest you like and change what you dont. You did a good enough job to get my money. I am just trying to decide which one is right for me at this point.

So thank you GM and excellent job from me. For what it's worth.

Would I like 450 or 460 hp instead of 426 and a 100 lbs weight reduction? Hell ya, but I understand the constraints you are working under. As it stands now, when you look at the quality of components you get with the camaro you are actually getting a good deal when you look at the competition of the Challenger and Mustang. Although I like the competition too. If I had the money I would buy all three, but unfortunately I have to choose just one and at this point the camaro fits me best. :(
Thank you for your kind words -- they're much appreciated.

It is sometimes very frustrating....for instance: I received a rather 'nasty' letter about three weeks ago from an 'enthusiast' - demanding that we " get (our) S### together" and drop the weight of the car.....by at least 400 pounds. This person then listed the things we need to 'fix' the car........

.......including "hideaway headlights" (added weight) a full size spare tire and wheel (added weight) cooled seats (added weight) T-tops (added weight) ....I mean, the list was quite lengthy.......

Now - our engineers are really good........but they have not yet been able to figure out how to change the laws of physics....

again - thank you for being a voice of reason!
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Old 03-30-2012, 08:12 PM   #636
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And do we have any choice on the black hood? If you get 1LE you automatically get matte black hood?

yes -- it's a black hood - BUT - it's a 'wrap' -- you theoretically could remove it once you get it.....
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Old 03-30-2012, 08:13 PM   #637
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I wouldn't let it get to you. I know how hard it is to give your best effort on something and have people rip it up, but that's just the harshness of people. Someone will complain about something. The fuel fill hole is on the wrong side, the car is too blacked out, the car is not blacked out enough, etc. Just human nature. I always tell myself if we weren't constantly unhappy/unsatisfied we would probably still be living in trees and eating termites instead of driving camaros.

If I wanted to I could find something I don't like either, but then no car will ever be perfect for you unless you build it yourself. That's what modifications are for. You take the closest you like and change what you dont. You did a good enough job to get my money. I am just trying to decide which one is right for me at this point.

So thank you GM and excellent job from me. For what it's worth.

Would I like 450 or 460 hp instead of 426 and a 100 lbs weight reduction? Hell ya, but I understand the constraints you are working under. As it stands now, when you look at the quality of components you get with the camaro you are actually getting a good deal when you look at the competition of the Challenger and Mustang. Although I like the competition too. If I had the money I would buy all three, but unfortunately I have to choose just one and at this point the camaro fits me best. :(
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Old 03-30-2012, 08:16 PM   #638
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If that is true, then you are my favorite person today. IDK if I like the black hood yet or not. My first impression is it makes the car look ratty as if it was in a front end collision and the hood was just primed. But who knows. I may end up liking it and keep it. I am just wondering what options I have. I love the black wheels though. When I got an SS I was actually going to power coat my wheels black.
Yeah, I'm not sure about the hood either but I'm reserving judgement till I see one in person. I would really like to be able to get rally stripes but I'm not gonna let the hood wrap keep me from a 1LE.
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Old 03-30-2012, 08:18 PM   #639
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Maybe they will offer a hood blackout delete option similar to the stripe delete on the anniversary edition.
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Old 03-30-2012, 08:24 PM   #640
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Chevy isn't really marketing this car for outright acceleration this car optimized for a road course. Adding20-50 hp is not going to improve road course performance that much.
But improving the suspension and mounting those good years on it will help waaaay more and increase the fun factor.
When I take my GTO on the Tail of the Dragon, I have never wished for more power. Not once. What i do want is less body roll, understeer and weight transfer.
Sounds like the 1LE might be in my future.
I agree with you here. I guess it depends on what the 1LE package will end up costing and their intended market. The Boss 302 was mentioned and it was mentioned it would cost a little less. Well...the Boss 302 has more hp over a gt and the motor is underrated so it makes more than the advertised 444 hp. I think I saw 416 rwhp from insideline. The motor also has forged internals and the heads are ported from the factory.

I believe it has an upgraded clutch in addition to a list of suspension upgrades and other things. Point being it has a laundry list of upgrades for $42K.

The 1LE option sounds like a step above the GT track package, but without engine upgrades it's not in Boss Territory in terms of value even if it can out handle the BOSS.

The track pack on the GT costs $2500 so it comes down to what the 1LE package will cost. If it starts costing much more than $3-4K, then it may be a hard sell. $39,995 1LE will be a hard sell compared to a $42,000 Boss especially if 1SS + 1LE = $39,000 and 2SS + 1LE > $40K

From a Ford Press Release:

Quote:
Revved up and ready
The powerful Boss engine yields 444 horsepower and 380 lb.-ft. of torque, while still offering a smooth idle and low-end torque for comfortable around-town driving. A race-inspired clutch with upgraded friction materials transmits power, while a short-throw, close-ratio six-speed manual handles gear change duties.

Power is delivered to a 3.73-ratio rear axle using carbon fiber plates in the limited-slip differential to improve handling and longevity. For those who want even more precise control over power delivery, a torque-sensing (Torsen) limited-slip differential is available, coupled with Recaro® front seats.

In keeping with the Boss mandate to provide the best-handling Mustang ever, the already strong Mustang GT suspension system has been further refined. Higher-rate coil springs on all four corners, stiffer suspension bushings and a larger-diameter rear stabilizer bar all contribute to the road racing mission, and Boss models are lowered by 11 millimeters in front and 1 millimeter at the rear versus Mustang GT. But the real key to handling is in the adjustable shocks and struts, standard on all Boss Mustangs.

Working in concert with the suspension upgrades, Boss 302 receives unique, lightweight 19-inch black alloy racing wheels in staggered widths: 9 inches in front, 9.5 inches in the rear. The Pirelli PZero summer tires are sized specifically for each end of the car, with the front wheels receiving 255/40ZR-19 tires while the rear stays planted thanks to 285/35ZR-19 rubber.

Boss braking is also up to the challenge, using Brembo four-piston calipers acting on 14-inch vented rotors up front. In back, standard Mustang GT brakes are upgraded with a Boss-specific high-performance pad compound. The combination of vented brake shields and unique Anti-Lock Brake System (ABS) tuning gives Boss drivers maximum control and rapid, repeatable fade-free stops in road and race situations alike.

Boss 302 circa 1969-70
With styling tweaked by newly arrived Ford designer Larry Shinoda, the new-for-1969 Boss 302 sported front and rear spoilers, blacked-out hood treatment and racy side stripes for a look that screamed performance.

Beyond the bodywork, the Boss 302 didn’t disappoint. Its engine combined a four-bolt main Windsor small-block with reworked heads from the then-new 351 Cleveland engine. A forged steel crankshaft, connecting rods and pistons rounded out the reciprocating assembly. The result was a free-breathing, high-revving powerplant making what Ford claimed was 290 gross horsepower – though actual output is estimated to be significantly higher.

Ford engineers also thoroughly massaged Mustang’s suspension in an effort to meet then-boss Semon “Bunkie” Knudsen’s mandate “to build absolutely the best-handling street car available on the American market.” Stiffer springs and shocks, special sway-bar tuning, a stiffened chassis and wide tires led to the fastest Mustang ever to lap the Ford test track up to that point.
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Old 03-30-2012, 08:32 PM   #641
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I agree with you here. I guess it depends on what the 1LE package will end up costing and their intended market. The Boss 302 was mentioned and it was mentioned it would cost a little less. Well...the Boss 302 has more hp over a gt and the motor is underrated so it makes more than the advertised 444 hp. I think I saw 416 rwhp from insideline. The motor also has forged internals and the heads are ported from the factory.

I believe it has an upgraded clutch in addition to a list of suspension upgrades and other things. Point being it has a laundry list of upgrades for $42K.

The 1LE option sounds like a step above the GT track package, but without engine upgrades it's not in Boss Territory in terms of value even if it can out handle the BOSS.

The track pack on the GT costs $2500 so it comes down to what the 1LE package will cost. If it starts costing much more than $3K, then it may be a hard sell. $39,995 1LE will be a hard sell compared to a $42,000 Boss

From a Ford Press Release:
Who cares what the boss has if it can't win. I'm interested in results. If the 1LE can outperform the boss with less upgrades than that's a testament to the motor and platform that GM gives you from the start. A quicker lap time on VIR in a Camaro that is at least ten grand cheaper than the boss LS, sign me up.
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Old 03-30-2012, 08:38 PM   #642
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Originally Posted by cbass View Post
I agree with you here. I guess it depends on what the 1LE package will end up costing and their intended market. The Boss 302 was mentioned and it was mentioned it would cost a little less. Well...the Boss 302 has more hp over a gt and the motor is underrated so it makes more than the advertised 444 hp. I think I saw 416 rwhp from insideline. The motor also has forged internals and the heads are ported from the factory.

I believe it has an upgraded clutch in addition to a list of suspension upgrades and other things. Point being it has a laundry list of upgrades for $42K.

The 1LE option sounds like a step above the GT track package, but without engine upgrades it's not in Boss Territory in terms of value even if it can out handle the BOSS.

The track pack on the GT costs $2500 so it comes down to what the 1LE package will cost. If it starts costing much more than $3K, then it may be a hard sell. $39,995 1LE will be a hard sell compared to a $42,000 Boss

From a Ford Press Release:

I could be wrong, but I think that the 1LE option will probably cost $6,000 -$7,000. I get the impression that a 1SS 1LE will cost $39,900. Keep in mind, you can spend over $50,000 on a BOSS 302 if you load it up.
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Old 03-30-2012, 08:51 PM   #643
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It is sometimes very frustrating....for instance: I received a rather 'nasty' letter about three weeks ago from an 'enthusiast' - demanding that we " get (our) S### together" and drop the weight of the car.....by at least 400 pounds. This person then listed the things we need to 'fix' the car........

.......including "hideaway headlights" (added weight) a full size spare tire and wheel (added weight) cooled seats (added weight) T-tops (added weight) ....I mean, the list was quite lengthy.......

Now - our engineers are really good........but they have not yet been able to figure out how to change the laws of physics....

again - thank you for being a voice of reason!
The camaro is heavier than cars of the past, but so is the competition and other cars built in a similar fashion. So for reasons I don't understand, since I am not in the industry car weight has increased. With all the but the Mustang is lighter talk it's only 250 lbs lighter according to official stats. Other than the mustang the car is light for what's out there. You can't just rag on the camaro without looking at what other car manufacturers are able to accomplish.

This is also a 150 mph car. Something that fast with that much power needs to be built solidly especially since from what I see there are over engineered components that can handle above stock power levels. I personally am done with super light weight flimsy cars. The sheet metal on those cars is pathetic. A couple of winters ago I slipped on the ice and went into one of my cars face first. My face was fine. The car door was not. There is just something wrong with that. I know I am a burly guy, but not burly enough for my face to not get bruised and my car door dented.

Mustang: 3603
M3: 3704
GT500: 3820
Camaro: 3860
Challenger RT: 4082
Challenger SRT8: 4170
6 series: 4233
5 series: 4365 (Ouch!)

I don't feel like looking them all up and some of those are cars that cost double or more, but in that size they can't keep the weight down either and many are heavier!
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Old 03-30-2012, 08:58 PM   #644
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This will be my next car... Thank the lord I waited for a car in my price range. I currently have a 1LT M6 and trade that sucker in. It will be a very long and hard goodbye but IMHO this is my favorite car. It has the pizzazz of today's tuner cars, yet the GM pedigree. It is gorgeous utterly gorgeous. If only I could get it in PURPLE with the BLACK.

P.S. please excuse my little rant but I am incredibly excited for this.

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