Black ICE vs MACE 25mm

[hapisok]

ok folks...here it is. something a lot of you have been waiting patiently for.

as a lot of you know, i was previously running with MACE's 25mm insulator. Tracy was kind enough to send me a Black ICE to do a comparison test and i finally managed to get some dyno time this afternoon. this write up will give factual data and comparison data (aka: butt dyno).

3wks ago i made the switch to the Black ICE so i could run it through its course for comparison purposes. i was a bit skeptical, but it did perform as Tracy claims by reducing the heat soak. heat soak temps weren't taken during this test with a thermometer, but after sitting, heat temps on the IM climbed faster over time vs the MACE-o-lator, can probably contribute that mostly to the thickness of the insulators in comparison.

so...today i reset the tune as i didn't want the ECU to have any learn value of one insulator over the other. 1mi drive to the dyno shop and the Black ICE was up first and pulled 279HP. marilyn (the camaro's given name) sat on the dyno while the insulators were swapped out and the MACE-o-lator was dyno'ed about 1hr 20min later. one thing i've noticed, is this motor pulls better as it warms up as all the consecutive pulls continue to gain 2-3HP. if i had the dyno for the day, then i would have swapped out parts and let the ECU relearn, but nobody got paid other than the dyno shop. the comparison was done this way so there could be no disputing of weather (temp, baro, humidity) or different dyno's, or any other factor that might skew the results. obviously, resetting the tune and driving exactly 50mi's for each insulator would provide more drastic results but i don't have the time or money to foot that bill. just a simple side by side comparison.

Black ICE = 279 HP / 250 TQ green line
MACE-o-lator = 276 HP / 255 TQ pinkish/grey line

TEMP: awaiting update
HUMIDITY: "
BARO: "
FUEL: E85

those were the facts...

here's what my butt dyno tells me...

after making the swap to the Black ICE and putting some good miles on it is when i started to pay attention to my butt dyno. there was a bit more pep in the step, but didn't really set in till around 4K RPM. it was noticeable, but just not the same as with the MACE-o-lator. MACE's 25mm starts around 2500ish RPM and pulls hard up till redline. this is where i believe putting more miles on the car between pulls would have been the most beneficial. the increase in runner length is also evident with the shift of the HP band to the left by about 250 RPM.

conclusion:

both products are a must, especially when it comes to bang for the buck, for the price, you can't go wrong with either. both are top quality backed by great customer service and support. both install easily, a true DIY install.

one thing i like about the MACE-o-lator is the ease to port match it to both the IM and heads (pre-matched during production).

Black ICE bolts up using OEM bolts.

My personal unbiased preference (simply based on performance) is the MACE 25mm as its a night and day difference on the road. for those with the vararam, you know what im talking about.

thanks goes to both Tracy and Steve for the opportunity to be involved with product development and their contribution to the C5 community...

[TJ91]

wow awesome review man!
This should be good news for those who are on the fence Both a re great products, both pull great numbers, now where does one want the power band? Well that all depends on the specific driver.
I love the Black Ice VR combo, the reason I bought it was because I knew they would work well together for sure. Shortly after I realized the MACE 25 works with the VR.
Either way happy, either way no one can go wrong. Im curious in all honesty to try the Maceolator

[LIM3]

thanks for the review.
how much rwhp are you putting out with all your mods ? and do you have the cam in ? pm me please

[hapisok]

i agree, they are both great and work. wish i could have spent the day working this, dyno one in the am...drive and the other in the afternoon. would have shown more dramatic and realistic gains for each. the power band shift is very interesting, and hope to do some more work in this area in the future. like you said, it comes down to the driver. personally, i'd rather be quick than fast...1/4 mi is only...well, a 1/4 mi.

[Ivan @ Southwest Speed]

Wow...this is awesome.

Really fantastic to get this sort of info from the streets and not just from us vendors. It's one thing to hear it from all of us but when it comes from the customers I feel that it speaks volumes more than any of us ever could.

Thank you for taking the time and effort to share this with everybody here.

What a great forum.
Ivan @ Southwest Speed

[gahammerle]

Thanks for doing this comparison. Just for kicks, I would like to see the black ice-olator stacked on top of the mace 25mm.

[hapisok]

Originally Posted by gahammerle

Thanks for doing this comparison. Just for kicks, I would like to see the black ice-olator stacked on top of the mace 25mm.

i've been kicking it around myself. but my goal is to increase runner length and go from there. guess we'll see.

[Midlife Crisis]

I just finished installing my 25mm Mace this afternoon and found that the Mace pulled very hard from 2500rpm to the red line as well. I also found that at 2000rpm I had a lot more power than before. I don't know if it was the sum of all the recent mods but I am very pleased with Mace.
Thank you for your review.

[bmorecam]

Aaron, you are the man bro!! Look like you really can't go wrong with either and each has a slight difference in hp/tq but as expected. Longer runner length, more peak tq(there's over 10ft lb of tq difference in mid rpm). Shorter runner length, more peak hp.

No more mace vs iceolator bullshyt

Both win!

[ChadG]

Bmore,

You're running Mace + Vararam right? I really need to see your car in person so I can see the fit vs. my Vararam only.

[bmorecam]

I will tell you now...there was no way for me to run vararam the way it come with 25mm insulator. I had to modify the rear neck to an angle to make it work for the front gap to have enough room for air. I actually made the gap bigger too. It scared me a little since I didn't know if the angle was going to mess up the original airflow characteristic, but everything look good, from my fuel trims to ignition timing, perfect!

I can put up some pics or I can even meet up with you one day.. just let me know.

[its a syn]

I have been waiting for a write up like this since these two products hit the market. Like it was said, where do you want your power band to be at. Well mine is going for the 1/4 mile -1/8 mile so it looks as if my money will be going towards Mace. Thanks for your time and effort plus money to really nail down these awesome products.

[SC2150]

Well done. We respect the Mace products as we do any other porven competing products that we know are good and perform as advertised, direct competitor or not we post it like we see it and some dont want to here that (were talking all products we manufacture or endorse). When we praise a competitors product it has earned it, and the same as when we point out those falling short. Any that know us well know we do our evaluations based upon actual findings and dont play brand or corporate politics as so many do. I know many think it makes no sense to acknolwledge anothers products as good or great when they compete against us and then the personal ego's pop up and it can turn into blind side taking and that is never good for any involved. But as with other products we have praised, the Mace units perform as advertised and we respect them and what they have accomplished. You cant go worng with either.

[OOLIE]

Nice to see the side by side comparison and runner length theories seem to be held up with the evidence. little more hp with shorter and a little more torque with the longer. Good to see it in black and white thanks for you effort!

[its a syn]

Tracy, you sir are a class act! This makes this decision even harder to make. I have an 1/8 mile track just down the road from me so I am going to side with the torque numbers. That being said, I haven't shot the money to Mace yet and could be back on the black side when I make up my mind tonite

[Preditorian]

Originally Posted by bmorecam

I will tell you now...there was no way for me to run vararam the way it come with 25mm insulator. I had to modify the rear neck to an angle to make it work for the front gap to have enough room for air. I actually made the gap bigger too. It scared me a little since I didn't know if the angle was going to mess up the original airflow characteristic, but everything look good, from my fuel trims to ignition timing, perfect!

I can put up some pics or I can even meet up with you one day.. just let me know.

Please post screens with an explanation to changes via pictures so us simple folk can do the same.

I should have my VR tonight and am looking forward to the 25mm and VR. Thanks.

[hapisok]

this is what the forum is all about. i have a lot of respect for both tracy and steve and appreciate their hard work, tireless effort and dedication to responding to 1,000,001 PM's a day. without guys like them, we would still be talking about who has the best sounding exhaust or which CAI is numero uno. and thanks to the rest of the forum...yes, you! who make coming here and sharing ideas and good times part of my everyday routine. its like fat kids and cake, whitney houston and crack, macon and bacon...mmmm bacon.

thanks again to everyone

[its a syn]

[KMPrenger]

Well at least now I can come out and say that I knew that at least one of you MACE folk were also doing testing for the RX units lol.

This is a great thread and pretty much confirms what I thought. I will say that I was thinking that the MACE might be the superior product because of its runner length, and it appears that it does pull a bit better down low, but good to see they both perform well in the upper ranges.

I would have had the MACE product, but the RX works perfectly with the VR and I was a bit scared to modify the VR intake. Still very happy with the black ice-olator.

Jay maybe you can shoot me a picture or two sometime of your modification to the VR tube...I'd like to see that lol.

[bmorecam]

Keith, predotarian, chad.. I got you

again, nice job aaron. This is what is all about. There's nothing better than a non biased straight up result. Both product get from me. for $150, this is what you call bang for the buck!

[aron77]

Well I was hoping you were going to say the black ice was hands down the better product cuz I just bought one and am waiting for it to arrive lol. I'm sure I'll love the ice but the mace is going to be the one that got away and I'll always wonder if I would have liked it better eventho they both sound good. Why do we have to make choices??? You always wonder what was behind door number two lol.

[Kmorpheus]

I feel the Black Ice-Olator is the perfect fit for me, Really only drive my car on hot sunny days and the heat is a power killer.

[pistolgripcopo1]

Good job

[Blade]

This is probably the best comparison test I have read since Janetty did the CAI tests early last year. This is how it should be done, thanks Hapi for taking the time and stepping up.

I have the Mace and pretty damn happy with it I chose it after reading about runner length differences and deciding that I want more torque that horses, I have plenty of horses already

[Mike Norris]

Interesting test for sure. I would guess the mid-range gains are from the longer runner length. Plus it seems you have some quite extensive mods compared to what most folks are going to do to their cars.

What I would like to do is a test that more fits 90% of our customers from what I have seen. By that I mean is completely stock or minimal mods (VMax TB & CAI, No Tune, No Headers). This would be comparable to the testing I did for VMax and I think relate to a large portion of the buying market looking at these pieces.

Since Tracy was nice enough to send an ICE-olator out for free to test, maybe MACE would not mind sending one of the 25mm units out to me to test on a CAI/TB only car

If not, are there any US dealers for the MACE 25mm spacer kit? I would like to buy local (US) if at all possible.

Thanks!!

Mike Norris