The time has come for the truth to be told

[mlee]

Originally Posted by Zedder

I was waiting for the fanboy rhetoric Read my post again and you'll see I never said anything about jumping ship because I didn't get a 2012. If I go back to a foreign car, that will only be because my dealer/GM did not keep their end of the deal that we made.

And I don't care what GM's process is - how they structure their business processes is their business. I just want the deal that I have a contract for. If I don't get that, then I will re-evaluate my purchase decision.

Originally Posted by FAST ZL1

Sorry if I misunderstood what you were saying.

Doesn't sound to me like you misunderstood.. guess I miss understood the same thing twice...

We'll all find out next week... I'm in the same boat as everyone else at 1100. Hopefully DSOP later on this month mine will get picked up.. otherwise BRM, Nav, Touchscreen here we come...

[sspddmn]

I dont care either way. Even though I sold my SS and dont have a car now, it gives me a few more months to save up more $$$.

I spoke to my dealer regarding the end of the 2012 MY and he contacted their Chevy rep. The Chevy rep said we will know in 10 days about the rest of the allocations for MY 2012 and whether they will be fulfilled or not. So in 10 days if my order doesnt get through and I dont get a 2012, my dealer says he will cancel my order and put me down for their first allocation for 2013 which he states that "ordering concensus" should start in June. Which means I could get a 2013 ZL1 as early as August. At this point so late in the 2012 MY, I dont mind waiting for the 2013. Not to mention that the new 7" touchscreen...which I am so liking that ..is a very nice incentive to wait.

[Zedder]

Fast ZL1...sorry, I didn't mean to offend you either. I just knew that when I mentioned owning a foriegn car, someone would make the "you're not a GM guy" comment and I'm just so tired of reading that on car forums. I was soley a GM guy for 30 years, so I think I paid my dues in that regard But the reality is that we are all consumers and GM is a business trying to satisfy our needs...they aren't giving cars away and we aren't blindly faithful...or at least we shouldn't be! GM is striving to be better because they want to satisfy us to stay in business. Case in point, I wanted a 2010 Camaro when they first came out and had the money to buy one. I was disappointed that they didn't earn a 5 star safety rating all around and that's why I didn't buy one. Look at the new 5 star ratings now and keep in mind that the standards have been increased since 2010 and you'll find that the majority of cars that have earned 5 stars overall are built by GM! Now that is impressive and one of the reasons that customers like me are considering coming back home to GM

[Wolty]

I placed my order on November 4th with my dealer that had one allocation for a ZL1. I have been at 2030 status since Jan. 13th. I have sent an email to GM Customer Service to ask for a definitive answer on the outcome of my order as a 2012 car which is what I really want and I have not heard anything back. I am frustrated beyond description since I have been waiting for some movement of my order for the last 2 months.

I am happy for those that got there orders, however, it is like rubbing salt in a wound when I see one dealer get delivery of 3 ZL1s at the same time and we have others that are still waiting and may never get thier order fulfilled at all.

I am still hoping for the best on my order, however, will have to settle for a 2013 (front of the line for me I expect from GM) if I don't get my 2012. It is out of my control at this point...fingers crossed

[hognutz]

Originally Posted by Zedder

I was waiting for the fanboy rhetoric Read my post again and you'll see I never said anything about jumping ship because I didn't get a 2012. If I go back to a foreign car, that will only be because my dealer/GM did not keep their end of the deal that we made.

And I don't care what GM's process is - how they structure their business processes is their business. I just want the deal that I have a contract for. If I don't get that, then I will re-evaluate my purchase decision.

this is exactly how I feel. I dont' car how they run there business I just want what I ordered. anybody who wants to defend GM go ahead but it does not change my sistuation. money tied up for months on a product they can't deliver even though they set the guidelines on how to order it.

they set up this allocation system if they can't manage it in a way to get the product to the end customer I am not going to be happy and I don't like excuses. I didn't tell them to take orders in october that still are not even scheduled in april. they did that. So either make it right or I will buy a different product.

I still don't know how this is going to play out there is a number of ways they could make me happy but it won't be paying more for a 2013. it will be building me a 2012 or a hey were sorry deal on a 2013.

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by Zedder

I was waiting for the fanboy rhetoric Read my post again and you'll see I never said anything about jumping ship because I didn't get a 2012. If I go back to a foreign car, that will only be because my dealer/GM did not keep their end of the deal that we made.

And I don't care what GM's process is - how they structure their business processes is their business. I just want the deal that I have a contract for. If I don't get that, then I will re-evaluate my purchase decision.

I'm confused..............your contract was for a ZL1 ANNNNND a CTS?

First you say you will cancel both orders then you say you only want what was in your contract. Was your contract with a dual Chevy/Cadillac dealer? From your points, there would be no reason to cancel the CTS other than to hold it over GMs head.

And your reasoning is perfect.......................as long as you are the only customer not getting their car. How would you run your business if you had capacity to build half of the demand? How would you decide which half to satisfy and which half to applogize to? If you were smart you'd raise your prices but GM can't do that (although some dealers now might).

I understand the frustration, I truly do. It is the dark side of GM being so open with their customers, and more so with enthusiast customers. You tell them everything you expect to happen and the fans line up. One glitch can screw the pooch so to speak and this is a classic example of that. And sadly, the Camaro is example after example of telling people when they should see cars and having delays. Happened with the first coupes, the first convertibles and now the ZL1.

As mentioned, the Japanese OEMs don't do this. You just hear when a car shows up at the dealer and you can run down and buy it. Very little communication. In that case you probably can go to the dealer and put a deposit on the first one or the next one but the dealer will be your only link.

And for those not getting it, this is now a very limited production model year. For anyone hoping for collector value, imagine now a 1 of 1,000 ZL1s 50 years from now. Much different than everyone that ordered one got one. So there will be, I expect a lot of consternation over who gets the "2nd 500" to be built. How many Z28s were built in the first model year?

[Zedder]

Ok, one more time in as simple a format as I can come up with...

I am not mad at GM or my dealer for what has transpired.

I signed a deal for a 2012 ZL1 based on a guarantee from my dealer that he had an allocation and could get me the car. I was never told there was any chance that the car would not be built.

At the same time, I signed a contract for a 2012 CTS AWD coupe...from the same dealer principal who owns 3 GM stores - one of which sells Chev, Buick and Cadillac. So I have 2 contracts with one dealer group.

If GM cancels my ZL1 order and gives me a 2013 out of the first 600 built (assuming they are cancelling 600 cars as the email posted suggested) at the same price as my 2012 and they honor the GM points bonus that is in my original contract, I will take the car and all will be fine.

If any of the points mentioned above are not met, then I will not support my dealer principal/GM and will not take either car. Why?... because the dealer mislead me by telling me they could guarantee a ZL1 and because GM didn't care enough about me as a customer to make the situation right.

Any business person who attempts to raise prices because they failed to execute their plan and cannot meet demand will have no problem meeting demands in the future. Any smart business person will understand what I mean

[IcePick06]

Originally Posted by ezleeinfamous

I don't understand why people always say this. It will be the same assembly line and will be built in the same year if you get a 2013 vs the 2012. There won't be anything wrong found in the 2012 that won't be found in the 2013. And who knows if there will be a 2014 for this styled ZL1. As little as we are going to drive our 2012s in 2 months I doubt we will put enough miles on them to catch any flaws before the 13s hit the street.

. If you get pushed to 2013 you will encounter the same problems as the 2012 owners if not more now that you will have a TOUCH SCREEN RADIO (remember this is 1st generation, never before put in the CAMARO) and you will have HILL START ASSIST in the M6 cars. So, you guys get some nice FREE UPGRADES for your extra waiting time, but you may just encounter more problems so either way I think it's pretty even between the 2012 and 2013 cars. As long as the MSRP stays the same I wouldn't be too pissed for waiting 4 more months for my car.

[Z4me]

I think were just seeing a lot of passion and anticipation
for this car. When things take longer then expected it's
just natural to feel some frustration as well. Hopefully all
of us who are waiting for this car will have one to
purchase in the coming months. Peace all

[OldScoolCamaro]

I won't be glib or sarcastic. I am not trying to be critical, or draw any criticism or attack. I will be honest though, my humble feelings, because I so much desired wanting a ZL1 for 2012. I can understand how the OP feels based upon his conversation with the dealership at the time of ordering. Many feelings will be felt by those whose 2012 orders will be filed as a 2013, or not at all. It's a human thing...feelings...., and nobody is right or wrong based on human emotion, and I feel for those who will not have whatever dream, desire, promise, verbal agreement, or whatever stipulation or thought inbetween the lines fullfiled. Number 3 made good points, and I think his interpretations are sound. But we all must remember as humans thoughts and feelings are not pefect, they are varied and wide, and we can feel dissapointed, hurt, or a variety of other sub-divisions. I backed out of my long standing 2030 order because I knew it was not going to be a 2012, which I wanted. I really don't want a 2013. My feelings. And that's ok. I ordered on the first day. I will patiently wait on the sidelines and watch the situation unfold. I will be ready to move again at some time in the future after 2013. But a little empathy and understanding goes a long way in our situation. We all want something, but our hopes or expectations can vary. It's hard to take it lying down when someone in a sales position changes his story or does not follow through on what what discussed. No matter what the circumstances were at the time. But this venue is no different than any other busness situation one may expect to encounter. As previously stated this is a fluid situation with no guarantees, at all, for anything. The OP understands the process and is an educated consumer. We vent and talk outloud. I am so happy to see those of you getting your 2012 rides I could almost cry.. I wanted to be there amongst you. I am not. Everything has a reason. Thanks Scott, and The Camaro Team for homerun! Side note....a funny tidbit I got along the way about life being "fair".....a very good friend of mine along time ago said about life being fair....A fair is where they hang ribbons on pigs.... Rock on all you ZL1 owners, and about to be owners!

[htron50]

Originally Posted by OldScoolCamaro

I won't be glib or sarcastic. I am not trying to be critical, or draw any criticism or attack. I will be honest though, my humble feelings, because I so much desired wanting a ZL1 for 2012. I can understand how the OP feels based upon his conversation with the dealership at the time of ordering. Many feelings will be felt by those whose 2012 orders will be filed as a 2013, or not at all. It's a human thing...feelings...., and nobody is right or wrong based on human emotion, and I feel for those who will not have whatever dream, desire, promise, verbal agreement, or whatever stipulation or thought inbetween the lines fullfiled. Number 3 made good points, and I think his interpretations are sound. But we all must remember as humans thoughts and feelings are not pefect, they are varied and wide, and we can feel dissapointed, hurt, or a variety of other sub-divisions. I backed out of my long standing 2030 order because I knew it was not going to be a 2012, which I wanted. I really don't want a 2013. My feelings. And that's ok. I ordered on the first day. I will patiently wait on the sidelines and watch the situation unfold. I will be ready to move again at some time in the future after 2013. But a little empathy and understanding goes a long way in our situation. We all want something, but our hopes or expectations can vary. It's hard to take it lying down when someone in a sales position changes his story or does not follow through on what what discussed. No matter what the circumstances were at the time. But this venue is no different than any other busness situation one may expect to encounter. As previously stated this is a fluid situation with no guarantees, at all, for anything. The OP understands the process and is an educated consumer. We vent and talk outloud. I am so happy to see those of you getting your 2012 rides I could almost cry.. I wanted to be there amongst you. I am not. Everything has a reason. Thanks Scott, and The Camaro Team for homerun! Side note....a funny tidbit I got along the way about life being "fair".....a very good friend of mine along time ago said about life being fair....A fair is where they hang ribbons on pigs.... Rock on all you ZL1 owners, and about to be owners!

Wow! Tom, words from the heart my friend. Thank you for expressing those thoughts.

EDIT/ADDITION: Amidst all the drama... I recommend POTD.

[z28camaro2471]

Originally Posted by GoldenBear

People may want to rethink stating that they were "promised" a 2012 ZL1 by General Motors.

I think it would be wise to read the language from the 2012 Camaro ZL1 Coupe Estimated Production Guide dated October 24, 2011, before stating that one was "promised" a 2012 ZL1 by General Motors:

"These numbers are only "estimates" and not a guaranteed allocation. The total numbers of units used to calculate the Estimated Production Guide Numbers were based on anticipated production for 2012 model run of the Camaro ZL1 Coupe. Every attempt will be made to honor these numbers, but given the nature of production and unforeseen issues, actual dealer allocation for the ZL1 will not be determined until final production numbers are determined for 2012 model run."

One is certainly free to cancel one's order should one so choose, but remember that the caveats with respect to ordering a 2012 ZL1 were available for one's consideration before one placed one's order.

What part of this isn't understood. GM never guaranteed anyone a 2012. They even explicitly state "unforeseen issues". Some of you guys sound like my kids. Nah, just kidding, my kids don't whine that much.

How many will still complain if their 2013 ends up with 600 hp? Unlikely I'm sure, but the specs on the 2013 have yet to be released.

[11RS]

So you guy's didn't wanna wait for the dust to settle or them to work out any flaws? Just wanted to be the first to own the ZL1?

Hmm..

[hognutz]

Originally Posted by z28camaro2471

What part of this isn't understood. GM never guaranteed anyone a 2012. They even explicitly state "unforeseen issues". Some of you guys sound like my kids. Nah, just kidding, my kids don't whine that much.

How many will still complain if their 2013 ends up with 600 hp? Unlikely I'm sure, but the specs on the 2013 have yet to be released.

maybe someday we will be cool like your are and have kids that don't whine. what is your order number by the way?