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Old 04-16-2012, 08:50 AM   #1
Graham Behan
 
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Anyone checked out the ZL-1 clutch pedal assembly yet???

Hmmm.
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Old 04-16-2012, 08:54 AM   #2
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Guess they just bandaided the problem with a spring
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Old 04-16-2012, 09:04 AM   #3
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Way to go GM.
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Old 04-16-2012, 09:21 AM   #4
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Guess they just bandaided the problem with a spring
No, they simply understand hydraulic and mechanical systems. BTW the ZL-1 has great pedal effort, is meant to be driven hard and the pedal will not stick to the floor, believe me we have tested it.

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Old 04-16-2012, 09:58 AM   #5
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No, they simply understand hydraulic and mechanical systems.
If GM understood hydraulic and mechanical systems, the pedal would not have stuck to the floor to begin with. So yes, it is a bandaid.
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Old 04-16-2012, 10:54 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by toml_pa View Post
If GM understood hydraulic and mechanical systems, the pedal would not have stuck to the floor to begin with. So yes, it is a bandaid.
NICE!

Call it what you want but If it works we should add it.

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Old 04-16-2012, 11:20 AM   #7
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Anyone know if they copied the separate clutch reservoir too?
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Old 04-16-2012, 12:25 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by toml_pa View Post
If GM understood hydraulic and mechanical systems, the pedal would not have stuck to the floor to begin with. So yes, it is a bandaid.
That’s actually a good point, what needs to be taken into consideration is how far can, or should, the factory go in designing a vehicle to withstand abuse. This is a discussion that goes on all the time, not just with new platforms, but also existing platforms, through a continuous improvement process. The simple facts are that there are arduous test cycles that the cars and subsystems are tested to throughout the various design levels to production intent and finally production. These are designed to represent “real world” conditions up to a certain percentile of the expected customer usage. The main problem is that it is almost impossible to subject a vehicle to the level of variation that the public will once it gets into their hands. If it can be broken they will through abuse, over aggressive use or just plain lack of knowledge. As the sample size increases dramatically then some issues not seen in development or validation will be encountered and no doubt addressed. If one was to try engineer something for every potential eventuality it would probably never make is way to production. The fix is simple and almost elegant in its simplicity, oh and isn’t that the way they used to be?

This fact is also true for software as well as hardware, just ask Microsoft.

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Old 04-16-2012, 05:41 PM   #9
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Where they get that idea from guys? Lol
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:21 PM   #10
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I agree....a bandaid
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Old 04-16-2012, 08:38 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Graham Behan View Post
That’s actually a good point, what needs to be taken into consideration is how far can, or should, the factory go in designing a vehicle to withstand abuse. This is a discussion that goes on all the time, not just with new platforms, but also existing platforms, through a continuous improvement process. The simple facts are that there are arduous test cycles that the cars and subsystems are tested to throughout the various design levels to production intent and finally production. These are designed to represent “real world” conditions up to a certain percentile of the expected customer usage. The main problem is that it is almost impossible to subject a vehicle to the level of variation that the public will once it gets into their hands. If it can be broken they will through abuse, over aggressive use or just plain lack of knowledge. As the sample size increases dramatically then some issues not seen in development or validation will be encountered and no doubt addressed. If one was to try engineer something for every potential eventuality it would probably never make is way to production. The fix is simple and almost elegant in its simplicity, oh and isn’t that the way they used to be?

This fact is also true for software as well as hardware, just ask Microsoft.

Graham.
Great points, Graham. It reminds me of the following saying:
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the universe is winning." -- Rich Cook
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Old 04-18-2012, 12:30 AM   #12
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Old 04-18-2012, 04:20 AM   #13
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Hmmm.
Graham, any idea if the clutch master cylinder is different and/or better than the ones in the current SS models?
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Old 04-18-2012, 07:03 AM   #14
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Anyone know if ZL1 parts are available from GM yet??? Would love to have the part numbers for spring and bracket if they are separate from clutch pedal assembly. Looked at my SS pedal yesterday and bracket will bolt right on and I would only have to drill a hole in the pedal. If anyone with access to GM would care to look this up, it would be greatly appreciated.
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Old 04-18-2012, 07:16 AM   #15
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What was wrong with having the slave cylinder outside the transmission pushing on a fork where there is less heat, that seemed to work fine for a long time...could shim them easily if you were not getting enough throw, don't have to pull the trans to change slave, easy to bleed...sorry to get off topic a little
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Old 04-18-2012, 07:29 AM   #16
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What was wrong with having the slave cylinder outside the transmission pushing on a fork where there is less heat, that seemed to work fine for a long time...could shim them easily if you were not getting enough throw, don't have to pull the trans to change slave, easy to bleed...sorry to get off topic a little
This way GM can charge 10 times as much if you have slave/throw-out problems.
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Old 04-18-2012, 07:44 AM   #17
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http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=141577
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Old 04-18-2012, 07:49 AM   #18
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Anyone know if ZL1 parts are available from GM yet??? Would love to have the part numbers for spring and bracket if they are separate from clutch pedal assembly. Looked at my SS pedal yesterday and bracket will bolt right on and I would only have to drill a hole in the pedal. If anyone with access to GM would care to look this up, it would be greatly appreciated.
Lingenfelter has had one of these for quite some time. It fixes the stuck pedal, it always comes back up, but doesn't fix the actual problem. Hydraulics and issues with the pressure plate as well as the trans are the real issues.
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Old 04-18-2012, 08:13 AM   #19
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Lingenfelter has had one of these for quite some time.
WaaaaaaaY overpriced at $90.00. Would rather have OEM setup if possible and reasonably priced.
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Old 04-18-2012, 08:39 AM   #20
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And to think I just paid $90 for the LPE spring... All because I wanted to buy $300 worth of their crap to get the free shipping... IDIOT!!! LOL
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Old 04-18-2012, 11:15 AM   #21
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This way GM can charge 10 times as much if you have slave/throw-out problems.

You're not kidding, the bean counters probably tell the engineering dept that camaro guys will never go to the track and race their cars...and it's usually the bean counters that win
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Old 06-11-2012, 02:27 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by Graham Behan View Post
No, they simply understand hydraulic and mechanical systems. BTW the ZL-1 has great pedal effort, is meant to be driven hard and the pedal will not stick to the floor, believe me we have tested it.

Graham.
So then why dont they come up with a fix for the hard shifting manuals in the SS???????
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Old 06-11-2012, 02:36 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Graham Behan View Post
That’s actually a good point, what needs to be taken into consideration is how far can, or should, the factory go in designing a vehicle to withstand abuse. This is a discussion that goes on all the time, not just with new platforms, but also existing platforms, through a continuous improvement process. The simple facts are that there are arduous test cycles that the cars and subsystems are tested to throughout the various design levels to production intent and finally production. These are designed to represent “real world” conditions up to a certain percentile of the expected customer usage. The main problem is that it is almost impossible to subject a vehicle to the level of variation that the public will once it gets into their hands. If it can be broken they will through abuse, over aggressive use or just plain lack of knowledge. As the sample size increases dramatically then some issues not seen in development or validation will be encountered and no doubt addressed. If one was to try engineer something for every potential eventuality it would probably never make is way to production. The fix is simple and almost elegant in its simplicity, oh and isn’t that the way they used to be?

This fact is also true for software as well as hardware, just ask Microsoft.

Graham.
So why dont the hell they design a properly shifting transmission in the first place??? Why do we have then so many people on here complaining of the same thing??? GM has droped the ball on this one and needs to fix it soon!!!! Like yesterday! and not having a 19 dollar seperate reservoir on a $40000.00 "performance car" is absolutly cheaping out.
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Old 06-11-2012, 11:50 AM   #24
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So why dont the hell they design a properly shifting transmission in the first place??? Why do we have then so many people on here complaining of the same thing??? GM has droped the ball on this one and needs to fix it soon!!!! Like yesterday! and not having a 19 dollar seperate reservoir on a $40000.00 "performance car" is absolutly cheaping out.
The ZL1 doesnt have a seperate reservoir either

But they did add a better clutch assembly and a smooth as butter manual trans.

It's funny how they say there is nothing wrong with the "stock" syncros in the SS but if you go buy new ones they're now made of a different material..................but no problems according to gm.............it's all about abuse lmao....................what a bunch of idiotic morons

There is a member here that took his car to the dealer for this problem and he was told that his cat-back exhaust damaged his clutch...........wtf???
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Old 06-11-2012, 12:05 PM   #25
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WaaaaaaaY overpriced at $90.00. Would rather have OEM setup if possible and reasonably priced.
It is way overpriced but it does work and I cant say it wasnt worth it And I haven't blown up any more slave cylinders since I installed it

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And to think I just paid $90 for the LPE spring... All because I wanted to buy $300 worth of their crap to get the free shipping... IDIOT!!! LOL
It's actually worth it for what it does. You could probably make your own for $10 but not everybody has the time to jack around with the right spring size and tension and fabbing a bracket for it. If you look at the pics in the OP even GM copied Lingenfelter's idea haha
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