![]() |
|
|||||||
| Homepage | Garage | Wiki | Register | Members List | Social Groups | Calendar | Search | Today's Posts | Mark Forums Read |
| Forced Induction - V6 V6 Supercharger, turbo, nitrous discussions |
![]() |
|
|
Thread Tools |
|
|
#1 |
![]() Drives: 2012 Camaro LFX - IPF Supercharged Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Tempe, AZ
Posts: 389
|
Hello Camaro5 Members,
I think a formal introduction is in order. I am one of the owners / developers that helped create the IPF SC system for the LLT and LFX Camaro's. There seems to be a lot of questions and controversy regarding our system so maybe now would be a good time to address them point by point (in no particular order) as well as provide some additional information about our system and the companies that helped create it. Introduction to the companies involved: About IPF Tuning - Founded in 2011, IPF Tuning is a collaborative effort by 3 different performance and tuning companies founded by Todd Zuccone, Arno Schindler and Jason Plotke. • Todd Zuccone is founder and president of the world renowned Porsche Tuning Company, Evolution MotorSports (http://www.evoms.com) located in Tempe, AZ. His company engineers, builds and produces some of the most sought after hardware and software components that power the world’s fastest Porsche’s and other high end exotic automobiles. His long track record building some of the most reliable and powerful cars in the world helped shape the current production Camaro V6 Supercharger system. His other companies include: EVOMSit (http://www.evomsit.com) which is the software company that supports the ECU tuning of everything from off road vehicles, PWC, Snowmobiles and fleet trucks to Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, Bentley, Maserati, Mercedes and new to its line of software is late model GM tuning. • Arno Schindler is Founder and President of EDS MotorSport (http://www.eds-motorsport.de) located in Marl, Germany. His ISO9001 and German government registered TUV certified company is responsible for developing the IPF tuning system platform which is currently being utilized in over 15 countries worldwide. His industry leading technology allows seamless OBD II port ECU / TCU reprograming for performance and ECO tuning for most all GM vehicles from 2007 to current models. He is the “mastermind” behind the IPF software technology / ECU tuning and is regarded as one of the best GM tuners in Europe. • Jason Plotke is Founder and President one of the world’s leading full-line Cadillac & GM Tuning company, KPE Performance (http://www.kpe-products.com) located in Scottsdale, AZ. Jason’s deeply rooted background in aftermarket product design and manufacturing had him as an official licensed product supplier to GM and recipient of the coveted GM Design Award 4 times. His vast knowledge of the GM brand and understanding of the dealer and client network helped form the USA strategy for IPF-Tuning & Supercharger Systems. OK, enough about us, now on to the IPF Supercharger System: - Bosch Me9.6 ECU tuning & the GM DI engine. The ECU tuning aspect of the IPF supercharger conversion is one of the KEY elements to a properly designed system – which is a topic that I RARELY see mentioned. I have been tuning this ECU since 2005 when it came out in the VAG line of cars and my German partner has more experience tuning this ECU than anyone that I know of here in the USA. He has been tuning the Opel cars in Germany as well as the Vauxhall models in the UK and Holden models throughout Australia well before the DI engine was introduced into the US market in 2007 with this ECU. The LLT Camaro Bosch ME9.6 DI ECU shares the same basic platform as found in the late model Ferrari California, F458 DI engines, Lamborghini LP550, 560, 570 DI engines, most all Audi / VAG DI Engines since 2005, etc. My partner and I have tuned all aspects of this ECU for all of the above mentioned cars in both NA applications, OEM turbo cars as well as turbo and supercharger converted engines. Some versions of this ECU have over 16,000 maps that control the engine. In order to get the IPF supercharger to run as it does (like a stock car during normal driving) with a proper MAF calibration for our increased diameter MAF housing and to fuel properly under boost, a tremendous amount of time was spent tuning the software. Tuning the software is only part of the equation, the other bigger part of the equation is the YEARS of experience tuning this type of ECU on both boosted and normally aspirated applications AND having FULL access over ALL parameters of the ECU. Additionally, understanding how the ECU thinks, reacts, protects, etc. is not something anyone with a at home software suite can master and tune – especially with a supercharger or turbo system added. I encourage anyone to do some research on this ECU as well as my tuning partner and his experience. I think you will find that the KEY elements to a properly performing supercharger system lie with well-engineered components COMBINED with properly tuned software. -Single SC Drive System: We opted for a single drive belt system due to the placement of the Vortec V3 supercharger and how we have our intake system designed. We are using a draw through MAF system (like the OEM intake system) instead of a blow through MAF setup. Generally speaking, using the MAF sensor on the intake side, like it was intended to be used, typically allows for better overall drivability. Additionally, there are many supercharger systems that utilize a single belt system and if we felt this was going to be an issue, we would have opted to change the design. If designed properly, there are no adverse effects of this single serpentine belt type of system. Note: It was brought up that having a dual belt system may be better, however that is a matter of opinion. With any serpentine belt, weather it that drives the naturally aspirated engine accessories and / or with a supercharger, regular belt inspection and routine maintenance will prevent any belt problems. One could say that a dual belt system is better but if regular belt inspection and routine maintenance is ignored one could be left stranded with or without a supercharger installed. So on a dual belt system, if the main engine serpentine belt fails due to lack of proper maintenance, but the supercharger belt doesn’t, then what? You are still stuck ![]() -Crankcase ventilation system. Our crankcase vent system is a very simple “dual valve” system; one that we have used on other forced induction DI engines including the Audi R8’s twin turbo conversions that we build. We don’t have a smoking problem or oil buildup in the intake system as some mentioned. I am not sure what “black art” is behind this topic but we used the same basic principles as we have done on other DI engines with forced induction. I will not claim to have the ONLY system that works for this engine because I hear there is another system that works as well. ![]() -“Multi-million dollar international backing and unlimited resources” – I wish this were the case. I started my company with NOTHING except a passion for high performance, a willingness to work my ass off and a never give up attitude out of my garage at my house many years ago. The same can be said for EDS and KPE. I / we all share the passion of motorsports, engines and designing products for them. I don’t care if it is powering a car, boat, ATV, snowmobile, PWC, I have my hands in them all. I too welcome anyone that wants to see things in person to visit us and watch what I and my other employees / partners do on a regular basis. We all share the same passion and that is what drives my / our companies and all of the projects / products that we create. -Research and Development Standards With any Research and Development project we commit our resources to, especially one of this magnitude; we demand the highest quality and we believe that actually owning a V6 Camaro is critical. Having our own 2012 MT V6 Camaro was a key element to ensuring that the supercharger components we produced work flawlessly it allows us to perform extensive testing on the street and track prior feeling confident and releasing the supercharger system to the general public. Some of the reason this supercharger system was delayed numerous times was due to changes that we thought were necessary after performing these tests. Additionally, we did not set out to make 1 supercharger; we set out to make a system that could be mass produced. Jason Plotke, head of marketing and sales felt it was not an option to develop a supercharger system of this caliber without owning the vehicle. We all felt if we wanted to build the best system without any compromises, we had to have a vehicle that the company could use at all times for testing. The red LFX Camaro in our videos is our company car AND NOT a customer’s car that we took out and abused at the race track. Additionally, this is the same car that was doing doughnuts and not a “poor customer’s car” as someone had alluded to. We treat our customers cars as if they were theirs, NOT as if they were ours –we beat the $hit out of ours Our LFX test car is our “proving ground” to push the limits of the new “LFX” engine as well as to have a vehicle to take to shows and allow other Camaro V6 owners a chance to experience what we have created. - Supercharger Details: We invested countless man hours designing the hardware and tuning the ECU of the IPF Supercharger which resulted in an optimal combination of maximized power, drivability and most important, reliability. Our design team incorporated the same painstaking attention to detail and design practices as it does to create products for Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini and other exotic vehicles we dedicate our resources to. From CAD engineered components, virtual flow simulation, rapid prototyping, CNC machining to real world testing and ISO 9001 manufacturing standards. The IPF Supercharger System consists of the following major components: • CAD Engineered / CNC machined 6061 aluminum supercharger mounting system • All major CNC machined components are anodized black for an OEM appearance • Vortech V3 self-contained centrifugal supercharger – Black Color1 • CNC machined idler pulleys – utilizes OEM belt tensioner • Gates premium brand serpentine belt • Large air-to-air front mounted intercooler w/ all mounting brackets & hardware • Precision fit boost pipes / hoses are available in either aluminum2 or all silicone2 • CNC machined large diameter MAF housing • High quality “synthamax” premium oil-less air filter • CNC machined billet aluminum crankcase vent tank w/ mounting bracket & hardware • Gates premium brand crank ventilation system hoses • All needed high quality vacuum / pressure check valves, adapters & hoses • CNC machined aluminum boost recirculation valve system • CNC machined PS fitting and reservoir mounting bracket • OEM quality new windshield washer reservoir w/ mounting bracket & hardware • High quality zinc plated hardware, stainless hose clamps, silicone couplers, etc. • Comprehensive installation manual - The IPF SC System can be shipped anywhere in the worlds and installed by any competent technician or enthusiast • Optional powertrain warranty available3 • IPF Tuning’s Proprietary OBD port ECU flash – Model / hardware specific supercharger software calibration. A custom tune for cars fitted with headers is currently in development. • The above list is the major components included in the IPF Supercharger system. o There are actually over 240 individual components that make up the complete kit. Price: $5695 + installation. (Typical installation time runs ~ 8-10 hours) 1: Custom supercharger finishes are also available for an additional fee. We offer full polished superchargers as well as upgrade colors such as red, yellow and blue. All custom finished kits are built to order, require prepayment and take at least 2 weeks to complete. Please inquire for more details. 2: Matching / colored silicone boost pipes in red, yellow or blue are also available. Polished aluminum boost pipes or Powder-coated red, yellow or blue aluminum boost pipes are also an option. Custom colors are also available for a nominal upcharge. All custom finished kits are built to order, require prepayment and take at least 2 weeks to complete. Please inquire for more details. 3: An optional 3 year / 36,000 mile powertrain warranty is available for an additional $275. An optional 4 year / 50,000 mile powertrain warranty is available for an additional $475. The warranty can only be purchased if the supercharger installation is performed at one of our authorized installation centers or by a PRE APPROVED ASE certified technician. A complete vehicle checkup may be required prior to the fitting of the supercharger system and may involve additional fees set by the installer. -Boost and other Gauges: I am sure most of you are aware that Auto Meter makes a direct fit gauge pod for the Camaro. Details can be found here: http://www.autometer.com/cat_mountsdetail.aspx?vid=440&sid=0&mid=1&pg=1&mdl =9&gw=6 Because our supercharger has a fixed boost limit based on the pulley diameter and engine speed, having a boost gauge is not 100% needed. Some people want them and some people don’t. An AFR Gauge is however a recommended gauge to install. There are limitless options for AFR monitoring depending on how simple or complex one decides to go with this. There are some gauges that offer a combination of different gauges in one display. Depending on the different sensor options, gauge styles, functions, etc. we can help determine the best solution for the individual needs of the customer based on the different criteria. Some Additional Details about IPF Tuning: • We are currently involved with the Bondurant School of High Performance Driving and their Private Race team that is running a V8 Camaro in SCCA World Challenge. Rookie Driver and friend of IPF tuning Andy Lee is currently 4 overall in the GTS category and one his irst race at Miller MotorSports 2 weeks ago. The engine was built by our head engine builder at EVOMS and the car was tuned by IPF. • We have our own in house Mustang AWD 500SE dyno with a properly ventilated dyno cell with fans that produce wind speed in excess of 70 MPH. We use our dyno as a tuning tool and do not rent our dyno services to the general public. We have had the LFX Camaro strapped to the dyno for weeks at a time during some of the tuning sessions which helped us perfect some of the tuning without having to drive the car on the street. For us, this is much more efficient and much safer when it comes to part of the tuning process. • We perform all of our CAD work as well as all of the prototyping and testing in house. We have a complete internal fabrication facility as well as machining equipment for virtually any project. All of our production components that we manufacture are made in the USA. For now, that is all I have. Sorry for the LOOONG post but there have been so many unanswered questions and speculation that I felt it was necessary to go through some of them in detail. I welcome any questions or comments. I can’t guarantee that I will respond to them all in a matter of minutes but I will do my best to get them answered ASAP. Thanks for reading. – Todd
|
|
|
|
|
|
#2 |
|
Space Coast Camaros
Drives: 2011 Camaro Vert Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Palm Bay , FL
Posts: 778
|
__________________
|
|
|
|
|
|
#3 |
|
Account Suspended
|
Thank you for posting that information. What do you offer for the crowd that already has LT's, HFC's, full catback, ported TB, IM, insulator, etc?
|
|
|
|
|
|
#4 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Nice read
I am concerned with the LLT and if it has enough power to meet my goals. Goals: 13.5 or better in the 1/4 mile with 18" rims 18x9.5 or 10 front and 18X10.5 back. (possibly Forgestar F14) Also 0-60 in less than 5.7 seconds. I would like to do this without having to change my tires. If traction is an issue I can address that when it needs to be. Does your tune address the automatic transmission? As I have an automatic. Thats about all the questions I have. Again nice write up.
__________________
|
|
|
|
|
|
#5 | |
![]() Drives: 2012 Camaro LFX - IPF Supercharged Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Tempe, AZ
Posts: 389
|
Quote:
Thanks, Jason IPF Tuning www.IPF-Tuning.com www.Facebook.com/IPF-Tuning |
|
|
|
|
|
|
#6 | |
![]() Drives: 2012 Camaro LFX - IPF Supercharged Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Tempe, AZ
Posts: 389
|
Quote:
Thank you for your interest. Thanks, Jason www.Facebook.com/IPFTuning |
|
|
|
|
|
|
#7 |
![]() Drives: 2013 Mustang 5.0 Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: CA
Posts: 103
|
Just for clarification, when you say 4 year / 50,000 mile powertrain warranty, is that from the time of installation? i.e. does it matter how many miles are on the car at the time of installation?
Also what have been your experiences with the 2012 v6 transmission holding up to the 435 HP and 360 lbs/ft torque listed on your site? Thanks for any info you can give! |
|
|
|
|
|
#8 |
![]() ![]() Drives: 2010 Black Camaro 2LT/RS Auto Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: San Fernando Valley
Posts: 756
|
You would set alot of members clear if you showed more of the LLT in action. Our cars notorious or FI option issues, and we need a little more visual stimuli
__________________
BackInBlack
Performance:Vararam cold air intake |
|
|
|
|
|
#9 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Ok TCU = Transmission Control Unit, ECU = Engine Control Unit, and BCU = Body Control Unit.
As far as the LLT engine will it perform as well as the LFX? Am I to assume since the LFX got a 13.0 then so should the LLT.
__________________
|
|
|
|
|
|
#10 |
|
The Greengo
|
Thanks for the "long post"
Now I get to do my homework and research... Oh, one question regarding: Do you have a list of these centers? |
|
|
|
|
|
#11 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Drives: '10 ABM LT/RS, 01 Ford Ranger Join Date: May 2009
Location: Jefferson City, Missouri
Posts: 7,174
|
I think it is safe to assume that with as little as sticky tires added to a SC'd V6, 12s should not be a suprise.
__________________
Shes ALL MINE! - 8/24/2009 2G1FB1EV2A9133373 Custom Magnaflow Exhaust, Vararam intake, MACE Ported Intake Manifold, RX Ported TB, RX "Black Ice" manifold insulator, Mike Norris Catch Can, ZL1 reproduction wheels, DRL Harness, Heritage grill, Street Scene lower grill, NLP Spoiler, ZL1 rockers, Switchblade silver interior, Defenderworx sills, and more!
|
|
|
|
|
|
#12 | |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Drives: '10 ABM LT/RS, 01 Ford Ranger Join Date: May 2009
Location: Jefferson City, Missouri
Posts: 7,174
|
Quote:
If you do offere seperate tuning, do you have any information on that for us?
__________________
Shes ALL MINE! - 8/24/2009 2G1FB1EV2A9133373 Custom Magnaflow Exhaust, Vararam intake, MACE Ported Intake Manifold, RX Ported TB, RX "Black Ice" manifold insulator, Mike Norris Catch Can, ZL1 reproduction wheels, DRL Harness, Heritage grill, Street Scene lower grill, NLP Spoiler, ZL1 rockers, Switchblade silver interior, Defenderworx sills, and more!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
#13 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Drives: 2011 CGM Camaro LS A6 Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Posts: 5,959
|
^^^ Interested in this. If you offer seperate tuning, I'd love to hear about it.
__________________
Current Mods:
Vararam | Borla ProXS Custom Axle-Back | Mace 25mm Insulator | MACE Ported Intake Manifold | And a few other things ![]() Click here to visit my Build Thread! |
|
|
|
|
|
#14 |
|
Patiently saving for 1LE
|
According to the website I saw just a tune was $700
__________________
2012 Chevy Silverado 6.2L.. Why you ask?
Because Racecar! |
|
|
|
|
|
#15 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Drives: 2011 CGM Camaro LS A6 Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Posts: 5,959
|
Trifecta used to be 600.... If the tune gives greater gains, I don't have a problem paying that. Not bashing trifecta or anything but depending on how they go about tuning, I'd like to know the details of their tune
__________________
Current Mods:
Vararam | Borla ProXS Custom Axle-Back | Mace 25mm Insulator | MACE Ported Intake Manifold | And a few other things ![]() Click here to visit my Build Thread! |
|
|
|
|
|
#16 | |
|
Red Brick of Vengeance!
Drives: 12 Second Brick Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: at my pulpit
Posts: 7,512
|
Quote:
Brick with me weighs in at 5185 and turns 12.95... Figure 1000 pounds = 1 second... |
|
|
|
|
|
|
#17 |
|
I Get Around
Drives: 2011 1LT Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Hampton, Va
Posts: 42
|
Any dealers in S.C or N.C
|
|
|
|
|
|
#18 |
![]() Drives: Camaro Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Rhode Island
Posts: 131
|
How easy is the installation? Can it be done by anyone?
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD |
|
|
|
|
|
#19 |
![]() Drives: 2011 Camaro LS Stripper model Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: South Beloit IL
Posts: 590
|
Thank you for the information. It will be great to see the LLT run once the owner gets his gear for the track.
Also curious as I live in the north if you feel the tune will be broad enough to safely run one setup year round. O degrees to 100 degrees not to mention summer and winter blended fuels? Where is your intake air filter? Call me stupid but I drive the camaro in anythhing up to 3 inch's of snow. |
|
|
|
|
|
#20 |
|
Suspension by Pedders
Drives: Synergy Edition 13.71@102 1.95 60' Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Chicagoland (Crown Point, IN)
Posts: 1,914
|
Thanks for posting. Your company seems very professional and your site is very well done.
__________________
My first Love. She was called "Miss Carriage" (still cry when I think about her)
383, Muncie 4 speed, custom linkage mated to hurst short throw shifter. |
|
|
|
|
|
#21 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Is the just a tune include dyno or ECU and TCU? I like others am really curious. I like the post and am really interested in what is available. I love the LFX runs very very nice.
__________________
|
|
|
|
|
|
#22 | |
![]() Drives: 2012 Camaro LFX - IPF Supercharged Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Tempe, AZ
Posts: 389
|
Quote:
The application of power with the Vortech is smooth and not harsh on the drivetrain. We have no reason to believe there would be any dramatic issues. Thanks, Jason IPF Tuning www.facebook.com/IPFTuning |
|
|
|
|
|
|
#23 | |
![]() Drives: 2012 Camaro LFX - IPF Supercharged Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Tempe, AZ
Posts: 389
|
Quote:
Please visit our youtube channel at: http://www.youtube.com/user/IPFTuning?feature=guide Look for the videos with the silver car. Thanks, Jason IFP Tuning www.facebook.com/IPFTuning |
|
|
|
|
|
|
#24 | |
![]() Drives: 2012 Camaro LFX - IPF Supercharged Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Tempe, AZ
Posts: 389
|
Quote:
For more information on our tuning product, visit www.IPF-Tuning.com Thanks, Jason IPF Tuning www.facebook.com/IPFTuning |
|
|
|
|
|
|
#25 | |
![]() Drives: 2012 Camaro LFX - IPF Supercharged Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Tempe, AZ
Posts: 389
|
Quote:
Thanks, Jason IPF Tuning www.facebook.com/IPFTuning |
|
|
|
|
![]() |
| Thread Tools | |
|
|