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Dragstrip and Launch Techniques Discussion 1/4 mile, 1/8 mile, launch discussions.

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Old 05-14-2009, 07:20 PM   #1
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Wheelie Possible?

Anyone think it's possible to get the Camaro to pop a wheelie with the ls3 engine?
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Old 05-14-2009, 07:23 PM   #2
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Anyone think it's possible to get the Camaro to pop a wheelie with the ls3 engine?
Yeah, fill the trunk with lead. Pop the clutch at redline. Replace drivetrain. Repeat.
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Old 05-14-2009, 08:01 PM   #3
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You're kidding, right?
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Old 05-14-2009, 08:31 PM   #4
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Try it and let us know.
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Old 05-14-2009, 10:39 PM   #5
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Yeah, fill the trunk with lead. Pop the clutch at redline. Replace drivetrain. Repeat.
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Try it and let us know.
LMAO

depends ...
does the ls3 put abt 700 horses to the rear wheels ?
with something like 4.56 gears and abt 500+ lbs of torque
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Old 05-14-2009, 10:41 PM   #6
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lol btw i was trying to find a vide of my neighbors car at the track (he lifted un- unexpectedly and he doesnt have wheelie bars) and came across this in a hot rod forum IT JUST MADE MY BRAIN HURT

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You can come close if you know some details about your car. First you must know where the center of gravity of your car is in relation to the rear wheels. Since torque is force acting on a lever arm, you must be able to generate enough torque so your rear end can lift the weight "W" of your car acting on a lever arm "L" equal to the distance in feet from the rear wheel center to the center of gravity. Once you know that and the gear ratios in your tranny "Rt" and rear end "Rr", you can do an easy calculation. Also, if you are running a torque converter, you gain an approximate 2.5 torque increase "Rc" at the instant you begin to move which is applied in the equation.

Assume,

W = 3000#
L = 48" = 4ft
Rt = 2.75
Rr = 4.56
Rc = 2.5

Torque at the fly-wheel required is,

(L x W) / (Rr x Rt x Rc) = (3000# x 4ft) / (2.75 x 4.56 x 2.5) = 382ft.lb.

One more item I didn't mention B4, to find the center of gravity of the car all you need to do is weigh the front end "Wf" seperately and the whole car "W". Now, measure the wheelbase "Lc".

Here is how to use this info to determine the length "L" to use in the previous equation,

Assume,

Lc = 100" = 8.33'
Wf = 1800#
W = 3000#

L = (Wf x Lc) / W = (1800# x 8.33') / 3000# = 5'

Remind me and I'll post a picture in my Photo Album tonight when I get home that shows how to weigh your car with a 200# bathroom scale.

There are some issues with tires that will determine whether you lift the front end or spin the tires. If you have enough traction, it won't matter what size your tires are, you will pop a wheelie. Since they will be fixed to the ground during a wheelie, they could be 20" or 30", it won't matter because they are essentially a part of the ground and your car will be trying to rotate around the axle that is anchored to the ground. However, if the tires can't generate enough traction to anchor them to the ground, the torque you apply will break the tires loose, they won't be 'part of the ground' anymore and they will spin preventing the front end from raising. Traction "Wt" is a force (like weight) resisting the torque applied to the rear axle and is a function of the coefficient of friction "Fc", weight pressing down on the tire food print "Wr", area of the tire foot print "At", and diameter (radius) of the tire "Rt" which is the lever arm for the traction force.

Traction can be calculated if you know the weight of the rear of your car, the exact area of the tire in contact with the pavement, and the coefficient of friction of the tire/pavement combo. the equation is,

Wt = Fc x Wr x At

This is the force available to resist breaking the tires loose, thus causing a wheelie. If the it is at least

Wt = (W x L)/Rt

Then you can wheelie. If it is smaller, you will spin the tires.

Coefficient of friction is a fraction from 0.0 - 1.0 and is experimentally determined for two surfaces in contact. Polished steel skate blades on ice have an Fc of near 0.0 (impossible to reach perfect 0.0) while 80 grit sandpaper on 80 grit sandpaper has an Fc of 1.0. I don't remember what racing tires on pavement Fc is but it must be around 0.9.

As you can see from the equations, wheelies are enhanced by more weight on the rear tires, center of gravity toward rear wheels, tall tires, wide tires with a lot of tread lying on the ground. Spun tires are result of opposite trends. Both spun tires and wheelies benefit from low gear ratios and high engine torque. Drag racers perform a balancing act of getting as much traction on the rear tires (move weight over rear tires, biggest tires possible, etc.) while keeping the center of gravity far enough forward to prevent wheelies. They want ALL of the torque to be transmitted into the traction force which will propel the car forward as fast as possible. Spun tires and wheelies are both no-nos!
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Old 05-14-2009, 11:43 PM   #7
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Old 05-15-2009, 07:26 AM   #8
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Oh, it's possible. Always a winner in NFS: Pro Street, but you gotta mod it beyond Stage 3
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Old 05-15-2009, 07:31 AM   #9
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Maybe, this mustang does wheelies with 400hp and some slicks but it's 3,300lbs



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Many of you have been wondering, and we've asked the question ourselves, why the Cobra Jet is "only" rated at 400 horsepower. After all, the GT500, which also features a 5.4L supercharged V8, puts out 500. We asked around at Ford and found that the Cobra Jet has been de-tuned to meet specifications needed for NHRA's AA Stock class. The official horsepower figure has yet to be finalized, but expect it to be right around 400 as quoted before.
http://www.autoblog.com/tag/FordFr500cjMustang/
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Old 05-15-2009, 07:55 AM   #10
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Maybe, this mustang does wheelies with 400hp and some slicks but it's 3,300lbs

Yeah, you're right. Someone could get the Camaro shell GM is selling for drag cars and do the same. Keep the weight down.
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Old 05-15-2009, 08:05 AM   #11
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Yeah, you're right. Someone could get the Camaro shell GM is selling for drag cars and do the same. Keep the weight down.
that would be a nice track setup
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Old 05-15-2009, 11:06 AM   #12
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Yeah, you're right. Someone could get the Camaro shell GM is selling for drag cars and do the same. Keep the weight down.
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He also installed low-compression CPE pistons and a custom Big Stuff Gen 3 fuel-injection system. To complete the build, twin Precision 88mm turbochargers force 50 psi of boost into a 510ci fuel-injected engine producing more than 2,600 horsepower and capable of revs over 10,000 rpm.To be competitive, the car will need to run in the mid-to-high 6s at around 230 mph, and with all this Bow Tie power, we don't see that as being an issue. In testing, the car has gone 4.43 at 178 in the eighth-mile, which would equate to about a 6.90 at over 205 mph....With 2,600 horsepower pushing 2,500 pounds,
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Old 05-15-2009, 11:29 AM   #13
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Holy MASSIVE twin turbos Batman!!!!
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Old 05-15-2009, 10:07 PM   #14
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and that mod cost what? holy bat crap
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Old 05-15-2009, 10:35 PM   #15
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slicks, gears, spray, and remove everything that doesnt have something to do with the engine, trans or rear. and let me drive it.
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Old 05-15-2009, 11:35 PM   #16
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Holy MASSIVE twin turbos Batman!!!!
lmao i knew sumone was gunna refernce the turbos
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Old 05-16-2009, 12:57 AM   #17
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Oh, it's possible. Always a winner in NFS: Pro Street, but you gotta mod it beyond Stage 3
haha thats the car i always use for drags lol
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Old 05-16-2009, 02:06 AM   #18
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slicks, gears, spray, and remove everything that doesnt have something to do with the engine, trans or rear. and let me drive it.
....um....and you'll need a supercharger AND Turbo on top of that spray....
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Old 05-16-2009, 04:21 AM   #19
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haha thats the car i always use for drags lol
It's the ONLY car I use for Drag.
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Old 05-16-2009, 11:41 AM   #20
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i see your 6.9 second camaro and raise you a 6.4 second mustang





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"We haven't put it on a dyno, but math for the e.t., mph, and weight tells us it's making around 3,500 hp,"
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Old 05-16-2009, 01:29 PM   #21
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i see your 6.9 second camaro and raise you a 6.4 second mustang



lol we'll havta wait till there's more '10 camaros on the strip lol
btw i know of that car, its a beast !!
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Old 05-16-2009, 01:49 PM   #22
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....um....and you'll need a supercharger AND Turbo on top of that spray....


pull enough weight off and gear it right with slicks and she'll pull the wheels. maybe not a full 1/4 mile wheel stand, but just pullin the wheels doesnt take a whole lot.


if a full interior 4th gen with a 200lbs driver can do it with a bolt-on LT1 pushing... maaaaaaaaaaybe 350 to the wheels, some slicks and spray and remove some weight and this car will pull the tires as well
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But not all people were born awesome like you, Spike.

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Old 05-16-2009, 04:01 PM   #23
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pull enough weight off and gear it right with slicks and she'll pull the wheels. maybe not a full 1/4 mile wheel stand, but just pullin the wheels doesnt take a whole lot.


Wheel stand on the independent rear Camaro will take a whole lot
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Old 05-16-2009, 08:05 PM   #24
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Wheel stand on the independent rear Camaro will take a whole lot
You will need a solid axel with leaf springs, 4 link, or a ladder bar type suspension. Once the tires hook on an IRS rear suspension the car will just go since there isn't really going to be any type of lift created, because there isn't a specific point where the power will be transfered through the body. For example the front of the leaf springs, 4 link, or ladder bars.
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Old 05-17-2009, 02:29 PM   #25
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Wheel stand on the independent rear Camaro will take a whole lot

depends what ure definition of a whole lot is, a solid rear 4 link and ladder bar may seem like more to some than others

BUT i gotta agree with CamaroSpike you won' nteed supercharger AND turbo on top of spray just to lift the wheels
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