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Forced Induction - V6 V6 Supercharger, turbo, nitrous discussions

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Old 07-05-2012, 09:49 PM   #51
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Ok if this comes to light may look into getting one!
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Old 07-06-2012, 01:23 AM   #52
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I'll buy the turbos if you do lol

This is extremely exciting. I would love a roots. Btw sleez, isn't your meeting with the person who might be interested in doing this soon? The more options out there the better!
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Old 07-06-2012, 02:36 AM   #53
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wow thought this was a pipe dream!!! Insane, subscribed!
Start saving, bro. Your pipe dream is about to get real. Lol.
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Old 07-08-2012, 09:45 PM   #54
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I will donate my car for it and pay for the parts
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Old 07-09-2012, 03:11 PM   #55
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I will donate my car for it and pay for the parts

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Old 07-09-2012, 05:24 PM   #56
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OK, you Forced Induction guys/gals bring me up to speed on how this would be better than the current Forced induction options already on the market.

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Old 07-09-2012, 06:09 PM   #57
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Hi !

from my experiance with roots blowers i can note :

in my personal opinion ... Roots blower need boost control with bypass-valve when used at high compression NA engines , to keep the boost low at low to medium engine speeds up to 4500 RPM , i dont like weak stock conrods looking out of the block !

the centrifugal charger like Vortech-V3 is doing exact this boost curve without external boost control !!

So for an build engine with rods and pistons the roots charger is the better option for low end tourqe and higher power !

Roots blowers without integrated intercoolers get high chargtemps , not good for power !

Installation is a bit tricky for external heat exchanger , water lines and waterpumps , also a + point for the Vortech Centrifugal Charger , here you can use a simple air to air intercooler in the front !

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Old 07-09-2012, 07:24 PM   #58
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that's what i'm talkin' 'bout!!!
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Old 07-09-2012, 08:15 PM   #59
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Hi !

do a full load run gear 1-6 and your chargetemp will rise to the moon !

im sorry , but only at part load ***** driving the aircon had enough capacity to cool down the intake temps below ambient temp !

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Old 07-09-2012, 09:15 PM   #60
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you just run the Super Chiller.......trust me I have one on my Maggie and my temps don't see 130* on a 0-140mph run on a 95* day.
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Old 07-09-2012, 11:02 PM   #61
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There is always something to learn on this forum...no matter who you are. That's why I love it.
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Old 07-10-2012, 12:46 PM   #62
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Hello !

Im sorry , but the sense in the information in my reply was not easy to catch !

The Chiller is working here in the US .. with speedlimits !

We live in Germany .. and in Germany there is NO GENERAL SPEEDLIMIT !

So i can do a power run from standstill 1-6 gear and drive 30min full load at TOP Speed over 190MPH !!!

in this situation ... im sorry to tell you ... the chiller will not work !!

that is all i wanted to explain ... not less or more !

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Old 07-10-2012, 01:27 PM   #63
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Quote:
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Hello !

Im sorry , but the sense in the information in my reply was not easy to catch !

The Chiller is working here in the US .. with speedlimits !

We live in Germany .. and in Germany there is NO GENERAL SPEEDLIMIT !

So i can do a power run from standstill 1-6 gear and drive 30min full load at TOP Speed over 190MPH !!!

in this situation ... im sorry to tell you ... the chiller will not work !!

that is all i wanted to explain ... not less or more !

regards ASH@IPF-TUNING

Go ahead and do that on a bottom end that isn't forged with FI and see how long that lasts.......I bet it won't be 30 min.... lol
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Old 07-10-2012, 01:46 PM   #64
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So I guess the Texas mile is out of the question. only a mile
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Old 07-10-2012, 02:14 PM   #65
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more like the "texas 30 mile" is out of the question. Does anyone think a stock camaro can take being at full throttle for 30 minutes straight?

Tracy, if you don't have a donor car for the twin screw setup by next March, i'm in!
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Old 07-10-2012, 04:43 PM   #66
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I will be able to donate mine
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Old 07-10-2012, 04:49 PM   #67
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more like the "texas 30 mile" is out of the question. Does anyone think a stock camaro can take being at full throttle for 30 minutes straight?

Tracy, if you don't have a donor car for the twin screw setup by next March, i'm in!
Stock Camaro or Stock engine with FI? With sensible boost I think it should be able to handle 30 minutes...

You want to see some insane testing watch this... sorry, I know... Ford EcoBoost.... BUT the LLT is actually pretty similar to the EcoBoost, without the turbos... These Ford torture tests are what made me feel better about tuning the Flex...

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Old 07-10-2012, 04:57 PM   #68
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Stock Camaro or Stock engine with FI? With sensible boost I think it should be able to handle 30 minutes...

You want to see some insane testing watch this... sorry, I know... Ford EcoBoost.... BUT the LLT is actually pretty similar to the EcoBoost, without the turbos... These Ford torture tests are what made me feel better about tuning the Flex...

That engine was built for boost IE forged and designed that way for a reason.
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Old 07-10-2012, 04:59 PM   #69
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That engine was built for boost IE forged and designed that way for a reason.
Read the specs on the LLT... very similar... Looking at the specs off the LLT you would think it was built for boost too!
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Old 07-10-2012, 05:01 PM   #70
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Read the specs on the LLT... very similar... Looking at the specs off the LLT you would think it was built for boost too!
Exactly. Only thing is we run higher CR than you guys do. Other than that, very similar design.
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Old 07-10-2012, 05:08 PM   #71
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Exactly. Only thing is we run higher CR than you guys do. Other than that, very similar design.
Trying to find that dang magazine article... you know the GM High Tech Performance one... that was a good write up on the LLT....

And yeah, the higher CR... which is why I said "sensible" boost!

found the article:

http://www.gmhightechperformance.com...v6_engine.html

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Old 07-10-2012, 05:22 PM   #72
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Aluminum-intensive construction extends to the pistons, which are manufactured as cast aluminum polymer coated oil cooled pistons, with a fully floating wristpin, and these pistons are considerably lighter than conventional pistons. Less weight means less reciprocating mass in the engine, which in turn means less inertia and greater operating efficiency. Moreover, the V-6 VVT pistons are crafted with a number of features that enhance durability and reduce noise and harshness, including a high-tech polymer coating and floating wrist pins. The V-6 VVT engine family was developed with pressure-actuated oil squirters in all applications. Three jet assemblies in the block hold a pair of oil-squirting nozzles that drench the underside of each piston and the surrounding cylinder wall with an extra layer of cooling, friction-reducing oil. The jets reduce piston temperature, which in turn allows the engine to produce more power without reducing long-term durability. The extra layer of oil on the cylinder walls and wristpin further dampens noise emanating from the pistons.


I think the bold will be your down fall. Cast will fail on an extended run of boost. Maybe not the first time but it will kill the ring landings.
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Old 07-10-2012, 05:25 PM   #73
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Quote:
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Aluminum-intensive construction extends to the pistons, which are manufactured as cast aluminum polymer coated oil cooled pistons, with a fully floating wristpin, and these pistons are considerably lighter than conventional pistons. Less weight means less reciprocating mass in the engine, which in turn means less inertia and greater operating efficiency. Moreover, the V-6 VVT pistons are crafted with a number of features that enhance durability and reduce noise and harshness, including a high-tech polymer coating and floating wrist pins. The V-6 VVT engine family was developed with pressure-actuated oil squirters in all applications. Three jet assemblies in the block hold a pair of oil-squirting nozzles that drench the underside of each piston and the surrounding cylinder wall with an extra layer of cooling, friction-reducing oil. The jets reduce piston temperature, which in turn allows the engine to produce more power without reducing long-term durability. The extra layer of oil on the cylinder walls and wristpin further dampens noise emanating from the pistons.


I think the bold will be your down fall. Cast will fail on an extended run of boost. Maybe not the first time but it will kill the ring landings.
Agreed. We are still waiting on forged pistons. Evidently they are not easy to make for a DI motor. We also have to worry about the crank. While it is forged, it has a very small diameter. We are going to need to go with some stronger material if we continue to up the power.
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Old 07-10-2012, 05:29 PM   #74
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Aluminum-intensive construction extends to the pistons, which are manufactured as cast aluminum polymer coated oil cooled pistons, with a fully floating wristpin, and these pistons are considerably lighter than conventional pistons. Less weight means less reciprocating mass in the engine, which in turn means less inertia and greater operating efficiency. Moreover, the V-6 VVT pistons are crafted with a number of features that enhance durability and reduce noise and harshness, including a high-tech polymer coating and floating wrist pins. The V-6 VVT engine family was developed with pressure-actuated oil squirters in all applications. Three jet assemblies in the block hold a pair of oil-squirting nozzles that drench the underside of each piston and the surrounding cylinder wall with an extra layer of cooling, friction-reducing oil. The jets reduce piston temperature, which in turn allows the engine to produce more power without reducing long-term durability. The extra layer of oil on the cylinder walls and wristpin further dampens noise emanating from the pistons.


I think the bold will be your down fall. Cast will fail on an extended run of boost. Maybe not the first time but it will kill the ring landings.
Another point the LLT has in common with the EcoBoost... The EcoBoost has cast piston!

"High-temperature cast aluminum alloy with lowfriction coated skirts, lowtension rings with direct injection bowl"

Yes, the EB has a lower CR (10.0:1)... but again that's why i said SENSIBLE boost!
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Old 07-10-2012, 05:31 PM   #75
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Agreed. We are still waiting on forged pistons. Evidently they are not easy to make for a DI motor. We also have to worry about the crank. While it is forged, it has a very small diameter. We are going to need to go with some stronger material if we continue to up the power.
Livernois is now offering forged piston for the EB 3.5... However seriously labor intensive to install! Probably a couple thousand when all is said and done!

Forged on the left, stock cast on the right:

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