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Old 05-28-2009, 04:20 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FirstLSK View Post
Sounds like the problem rests with Toyota making lunch box size cars like the ugly @$$ prius.

Maybe we need to petition Toyota to start making normal cars.



.
I think you might be on to something there. I say it is all Toyota's fault for making the Prius body shape in such a way that it disappears behind our mirrors. Seems to me that this isn't GM's issue but Toyota's.
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Old 05-28-2009, 04:24 PM   #70
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I have not driven one yet, but I "complained" about the visibility in another thread and almost everyone gave me a hard time about it.

The problem isn't the size of the mirror, it's the size of the windshield. Why would you want to put your seat down all the way in this car? All that will be showing through the side window will be your eyes. If anything, you would want to put the seat up as far as possible so you can see out the sides and back.

So I still think they screwed up on the visibility. I'm not trying to trash the car, just an honest opinion from someone who is not blinded by Camaro fever. And I think this fact will be borne out when more guys get their cars and the initial new car elation wears off. After all, a car is made to be driven, and to drive you need to be able to see.
No car is perfect. Every car has certain things that are pros to some, cons to some and yet not even noticeable to others. Perhaps this car isn't for you guys. Rather than complain and not understand why fans of the car stick up for the car, why not just look somewhere else?
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Old 05-28-2009, 04:37 PM   #71
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of all the things ive lost i miss my mind the most.
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Old 05-28-2009, 04:38 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by LDGn63 View Post
i guess sometimes it is best to start with the obvious but i done done that.

YES, my seat is 100% down AND leaned back to get me as low as possible. and the mirror is pushed up 100% as high as it will go (without removing stuff, which I will do tonight)

please see posts and pix here:
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showth...ghlight=mirror

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showth...ghlight=mirror
I agree with him 100% on this issue. I'm 6'2" and have the same problem... All I see under the mirror is about 2-3 inches of the windshield when I look to the right a bit..... especially when you turn right all you see is a big black spot. Us tall people have to adjust to this by always looking ahead of the situation. So stop saying to adjust our seats and do this and that...A lot of us have many years of driving experience (35Yrs) more than a lot of you. That said I still love the car and will deal with this issue by being careful and I'm going to enjoy the look on peoples faces when I cruise around town.
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Old 05-28-2009, 05:34 PM   #73
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Raise the mirror. I checked it out when I was at the dealer. I'm 5'11" and with the mirror adjusted high I have no problem.
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Old 05-28-2009, 08:02 PM   #74
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Originally Posted by LDGn63 View Post
i guess sometimes it is best to start with the obvious but i done done that.

YES, my seat is 100% down AND leaned back to get me as low as possible. and the mirror is pushed up 100% as high as it will go (without removing stuff, which I will do tonight)

please see posts and pix here:
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showth...ghlight=mirror

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showth...ghlight=mirror
LDGn63, I noticed the mirror was a distraction as well until I adjusted my seat down and back. I was trying to see to much of the hood.

You might have done that already from the sounds of your post, but I do not have any issue with the mirror blocking my forward view. My adjustment worked for me.

I wish you luck with finding a solution. Keep us updated.
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Old 05-28-2009, 08:10 PM   #75
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Originally Posted by Super83Z View Post
No car is perfect. Every car has certain things that are pros to some, cons to some and yet not even noticeable to others. Perhaps this car isn't for you guys. Rather than complain and not understand why fans of the car stick up for the car, why not just look somewhere else?
Agreed. Try not to look at it as a complaint, but more of an observation. I love this car, but I'm not sure if I would like driving it every day.

And YES, I have looked around. I like the G8GT, although granted, it isn't the same sort of vehicle.

And ok, this weekend I looked at some 2010 Mustangs, and to be honest they are very nice. More visibility for sure. I don't want to get into a big GM vs Ford thing here, but both cars have merits.
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Old 05-28-2009, 08:11 PM   #76
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Speaking as someone who is 6'6", and had to order my car without a sunroof so I didn't have to drive laying down to avoid constantly rubbing my head... The visibility with the mirror was concerning in both of the cars I sat in. Something will have to be done for the car to be safe, so hopefully GM can help us find a better solution.

In my other sports cars (Corvette included) I -always- bend the mirror as far up as possible, either the ball joints wont go any further, or it hits something above it.

In the Camaro the plastic wire cover above the mirror severely hinders this (see picts below). If GM could make a much thinner wire cover that may do the trick, otherwise I may be removing it completely (the plastic cover) to see if that does the trick.

IMHO, having on-star to use is great for emergencies, but not if it's attached to the mirror that is so big & in the middle of the windshield that it actually causes the accident...


From your other thread...
Good post. I did not realize the mirror had two swivel points. Cool, I gained a little of my mirror back.
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Old 05-28-2009, 08:14 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by jrhaus76 View Post
I think he is saying he wants to replace his mirror with a different one but is concerned about losing the onstar??

I take it as he is not happy about the blind spot. Its the price you pay for driving this car. Try driving a corvette. In the mirror you see into the trunk, the entire top of the car and a dental floss line that is out the back window. Not to mention the side view blind spots. This aint your mommas caddy here, you have to pay closer attention and deal with the slightly obstructed view.
I have a 2008 corvette coupe and both the front and rear visibility is quite good actually. I haven't sat in the new camaro yet, as they don't have a single one here in hawaii, but my side mirrors are quite large and practical, elmininating blind spots. Also for extra measure, you actually can look over your shoulder in my car before changing lanes, which is apparently something you can't do in the new camaro, from all the threads I've read on this subject. I still love the camaro but I'm waiting for the convertible to come out, apparently the blind spots are even worse on that car (I just read it somewhere, don't remember where), but I'm sure as with anything else you get used to it after awhile.
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Old 05-28-2009, 08:20 PM   #78
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Here is a great post by NukemGreg. How to properly align mirrors. It could help with some on this thread. I adjusted mine like this a few days ago, and it is a night and day difference. What I have been missing all my life. WOW!

http://www.linquist.net/motorsports/tech/mirrors/
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Old 05-28-2009, 08:24 PM   #79
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It looks like there are only two things that could give you more lift with the current mirror.

1, remove a section of the wire cover, so that the top of the mirror could tuck up into it a bit.

or

2, replacing the gimbal arm with one a bit longer, so that the mirror could come forward a bit more, and meet the wire cover where it meets the headliner.

Either is only going to give you maybe another 1/2 inch more viewing area from the bottom of the mirror.

Barring that, it looks like the only solution with the current setup, would be to remove the mirror, take it to your favorite custom shop, have them slice that puppy in half, and reinstall the remains upside down to preserve the electronics.

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Old 05-28-2009, 08:28 PM   #80
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My H3 was like that. It had so many blind spots! I got used to it. It just makes you that much more safety minded on the road.
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Old 05-28-2009, 08:29 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edog View Post
Here is a great post by NukemGreg. How to properly align mirrors. It could help with some on this thread. I adjusted mine like this a few days ago, and it is a night and day difference. What I have been missing all my life. WOW!

http://www.linquist.net/motorsports/tech/mirrors/
Yep, it's good info and you'd be shocked how many people drive with their own side of their car in their side mirrors. I was lucky enough to have my dad show me how to set them up this way when I first started driving, but any time I drove a friends car growing up they'd be too close in. I don't know how people can drive that way in traffic & not turn their head. Guess it explains how I've had people try to run me off the road several times just changing lanes on top of me...
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Old 05-28-2009, 08:59 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by fad1 View Post
Dude, I think you need to adjust the seats so that you can see the clearly
Can't speak for anyone else, but at 6'6" the seat is adjusted as much as it can be for me to just fit comfortably. Seems like shorter people don't seem to have too much of an issue, seems to be mostly 6' & over.

Quote:
Originally Posted by camaro5 View Post
I'm glad you did not have an accident.

I hear what you're saying, but what possible SOLUTION can anyone offer?

There is none, short of removing the mirror, and installing a rearview camara.

Remember, this Zeta was designed for cool looks, not practicality.

That's what we wanted, and GM delivered, big time.

The G8 is the practical Zeta. Excellent visibility.

Hang in there...
There's plenty that can be done, I would just hope that maybe GM would take it into consideration since so many people are having problems with it (or will). My car has not been built yet, so there would still be time for them to revise it a minor amount. The mirror itself is okay, it's mainly the plastic cable protector above it, & lack of adjustment in the ball joints on the mirror. If they were to find a better way to conceal the cables, and / or provide more adjustability in the mirror arm, you could have that thing practically touching the roof (as I always have in my corvette).

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeZ28 View Post
I don't understand the big blacked-out area of the windshield around the mirror mount. Why does that part need to be blacked out? Is it to keep the mirror and all the Onstar electronic guts from getting too hot?
From what I've read supposedly they started doing that to stop from blinding drivers when the sun is behind the mirror. Some cars have it just above the mirror, I cant recall any other cars I've seen with it as low as the Camaro.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Super83Z View Post
No car is perfect. Every car has certain things that are pros to some, cons to some and yet not even noticeable to others. Perhaps this car isn't for you guys. Rather than complain and not understand why fans of the car stick up for the car, why not just look somewhere else?
wow... just wow...

Do divorce your wife at the first sign of trouble, or to you talk to her & try to resolve things? Throw away your computer when it locks up? Don't confuse wanting to fix problems with not loving your car. Hell, most of us modify our cars even if there isn't a problem just because you think you might be able to make it better (even if it's just for your own taste).

Just because this may not be a problem for you, it is a genuine issue for some of us. Fortunately it is one that can be made better. I'd just hope that with such a minor overall issue GM may be able to resolve it for us. I'd rather not hack into my car the day I get it if I can avoid it, but I certainly will before I endanger myself, my passengers, and others on the road because I cant see out of the middle upper 1/2 of my windshield.

I don't have my car yet or I probably would have already torn into it. I've never once complained about the visibility of the car otherwise, which for most people is a bigger issue judging from that thread. I'm perfectly happy to live with that compromise of looks vs. visibility. But there's no reason the Mirror couldn't be more adjustable.
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Old 05-28-2009, 09:17 PM   #83
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so you say you have a huge blind spot out of the front window? appearently you have not tried to look out your side windows to change lanes? blind spot is an understatement. it is a virtual black hole.
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Old 05-28-2009, 09:30 PM   #84
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so you say you have a huge blind spot out of the front window? appearently you have not tried to look out your side windows to change lanes? blind spot is an understatement. it is a virtual black hole.
I don't use the windows as my primary lane change reference, I use the mirrors, & check beside me (peripheral vision), and I can see all of them perfectly fine. (See edog's post above or my reply to him, the link is very helpful if you have not been driving with your mirrors set up like that already)

Out the back is a non issue, the C5 Corvette convertible has a tiny, tiny rear window, after 5 + years I never had an issue with it. And it's not like I drive in reverse much or at more than parking speeds. The main reason it's there is to tell you when to pull over anyway.

Personally, I'm more concerned with being able to see in the direction the car is capable of going 155 mph in...
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Old 05-28-2009, 11:17 PM   #85
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ok... here is a pic taken today... judge for yourself but i still need REAL ideas.
so i dont like this one thing about my car and it CAN be changed... at least im not griping about something REALLY USEFUL like ABL! gimme a break.
BTW - ABL is ultra cool.

just for everyone who keeps saying lower the seat and raise the mirror:
the seat is LOWERED and laid back some, the mirror is RAISED (including removing the plastic wire cover, which buy you maybe 1/8").
believe it or not this picture is NOT doctored in any way. I took it while SITTING still with my iphone up against my face with my head on the headrest.
(my line of sight is about an inch below the tint line)

tada: (no need to criticize my photography, i know i stink)
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Why oh Why?
Windshield=10" vertical
mirror= 3 7/8" (that's almost 4") vertical
that means that the mirror is 38.75% the size of the vertical windshield...
it sure seems like the ratio could be better... just sayin....

our collective MIRROR patch:
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24612
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