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Old 10-24-2012, 04:29 PM   #1
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GM listed 420 lb-ft of torque for the SS with 1LE

So adding the 1LE performance package to an SS doesn't increase torque?
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Old 10-24-2012, 04:32 PM   #2
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No it doesn't. Tq multiplication increases because of the 3.91 gear, but actual flywheel tq stays the same. Same exact LS3 that's in the SS
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Old 10-24-2012, 04:38 PM   #3
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Ok so will there be more torque to the ground? I thought just adding 3.91 gears you'd get at least a 10% increase to the ground.
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Old 10-24-2012, 05:02 PM   #4
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Ok so will there be more torque to the ground? I thought just adding 3.91 gears you'd get at least a 10% increase to the ground.
Torque to the ground? That isn't a standard measurement that I've ever heard of, since it encompasses so many variables (transmission type, trans gearing, rear end gears, tire size, friction losses due to gearing cut type, etc etc)

The 1LE will definitely *feel* snappier bc of the 3.91's (thus explaining the high demand for the 3.91's), but that's just the multiplier effect of the higher gear ratio, not an increase of torque produced by the motor.

We might say that the 1LE has greater 'fake torque' than a standard SS... LoL
(Come on... its a joke!)
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Old 10-24-2012, 05:05 PM   #5
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Torque to the ground? That isn't a standard measurement that I've ever heard of, since it encompasses so many variables (transmission type, trans gearing, rear end gears, tire size, friction losses due to gearing cut type, etc etc)

The 1LE will definitely *feel* snappier bc of the 3.91's (thus explaining the high demand for the 3.91's), but that's just the multiplier effect of the higher gear ratio, not an increase of torque produced by the motor.

We might say that the 1LE has greater 'fake torque' than a standard SS... LoL
(Come on... its a joke!)
And a funny one at that. So for the uninformed. What would that snappier feel be measured as?
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Old 10-24-2012, 06:19 PM   #6
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Fake torque = REar wheel torque that you see on a chasis dyno. I think a lot people consider theis real torque since this is the actual power getting to the ground. An engine can make all the power in the world but if you cant get it to the wheels efficiently it is worthless. The manufacturer engine ratings use flywheel ratings from an engine dyno.
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Old 10-24-2012, 07:47 PM   #7
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It's clear to me that GM didn't SAE recertify the 2013 cars with electric steering and NPP?
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Old 10-24-2012, 07:49 PM   #8
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lets not forget about the electric steering and the NPP exhaust possibily providing an ACTUAL additional bump.
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Old 10-24-2012, 07:49 PM   #9
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So will the 1LE equipped SS dyno with more torque?
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Old 10-24-2012, 07:50 PM   #10
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It's clear to me that GM didn't SAE recertify the 2013 cars with electric steering and NPP?
HA...dam you! I just jumped to the end and replied. HA
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Old 10-24-2012, 08:17 PM   #11
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So will the 1LE equipped SS dyno with more torque?
Remains to be seen. Will definitely be interesting to see.

For what it's worth - it absolutely feels and performs more quickly than an SS. But it's a matter of smart engineering vs. just adding more power.
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Old 10-24-2012, 08:33 PM   #12
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Remains to be seen. Will definitely be interesting to see.

For what it's worth - it absolutely feels and performs more quickly than an SS. But it's a matter of smart engineering vs. just adding more power.
Besides, the only numbers that matter are at the finish line, not at the dyno.
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Old 10-24-2012, 08:48 PM   #13
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Seems to be some confusion about the 3.91 gears. Along with the change in the rear end to 3.91 gears, the 1LE also gets different transmission ratios making overall performance in each gear (1-6) similar. I think the main differences will be seen in 2nd, 3rd and 4th for increased road course performance. Someone with internet skills can probably link to the gear ratios and speed at redline info for each gear from another thread.

Putting 3.91 gears in a standard SS would make much more of a torque multiplying type effect at the wheels that some are talking about.
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Old 10-24-2012, 08:59 PM   #14
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Yup! +1. Can't forget the transmission itself, it was changed, too.

The lower gears are a tad shorter overall, but more importantly, better-matched to a track environment versus the street.

The higher gears, notably 5th and 6th...actually end up taller than an SS overall...engine spins slower, could see a fuel-economy benefit there...
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Old 10-24-2012, 09:07 PM   #15
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So we dont know.
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Old 10-24-2012, 09:45 PM   #16
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GM didn't re-certify the HP/Tq ratings of the LS3 with 1LE options. They used the same SAE rated figures the LS3 has had in the Camaro M6 since 2010 MY.

The 1LE optioned LS3 with electric steering and dual mode exhaust should have more power than the standard SS variant.

But owners will have to prove it with dyno and performance testing on their own.
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Old 10-24-2012, 10:52 PM   #17
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Seems to be some confusion about the 3.91 gears. Along with the change in the rear end to 3.91 gears, the 1LE also gets different transmission ratios making overall performance in each gear (1-6) similar. I think the main differences will be seen in 2nd, 3rd and 4th for increased road course performance. Someone with internet skills can probably link to the gear ratios and speed at redline info for each gear from another thread.

Putting 3.91 gears in a standard SS would make much more of a torque multiplying type effect at the wheels that some are talking about.
Good point that i forgot about. The 1LE is making more power to the ground with the lighter wheels and tires also. This reduction in unsprung weight will help accelerate and brake better.
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Old 10-24-2012, 10:55 PM   #18
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I heard in another thread that the dual mode exhaust doesn't add any horsepower to the rear wheels. It was said that no aftermarket cat-back systems add power, they're strictly for sound if you don't add headers. Not sure how true that is.
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Old 10-24-2012, 11:12 PM   #19
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Well all I know is that for me coming from a ss vert with gm's 21's and an extra 200+ pounds I am sure to be impressed!! Especially after I put on the headers and cai on and let Ted have a go at it.

Am willing to offer the car for science... anyone local want to do some before and after dyno testing?
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Old 10-25-2012, 12:22 AM   #20
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GM didn't re-certify the HP/Tq ratings of the LS3 with 1LE options. They used the same SAE rated figures the LS3 has had in the Camaro M6 since 2010 MY.

The 1LE optioned LS3 with electric steering and dual mode exhaust should have more power than the standard SS variant.

But owners will have to prove it with dyno and performance testing on their own.
Unless the dual mode exhaust diverts before the cats, it won't make much if any difference. If anything, it will add more weight.
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Old 10-25-2012, 12:46 AM   #21
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Fake torque = REar wheel torque that you see on a chasis dyno. I think a lot people consider theis real torque since this is the actual power getting to the ground. An engine can make all the power in the world but if you cant get it to the wheels efficiently it is worthless. The manufacturer engine ratings use flywheel ratings from an engine dyno.
So if I put some 4.56 gears in my stock SS, and go put it on a chassis dyno, that dyno will now show my car as making more torque than all other stock SS Camaros? And since the Horsepower number that the dyno gives me is actually mathematically derived from the torque curve, I now have more HP than stock too?
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Old 10-25-2012, 04:56 AM   #22
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lets not forget about the electric steering and the NPP exhaust possibily providing an ACTUAL additional bump.
Not following why the steering helps?
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Old 10-25-2012, 05:49 AM   #23
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Usually the power steering is run by a hydraulic pump belt driven by the engine. By having to drive the ps pump it took Hp away from the total Hp available to drive the car. By going electric assisted ps, that is 1 less thing for parasitic loss. Essentially freeing up a few Hp to the flywheel, transmission and down the line to the wheels.


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Old 10-25-2012, 08:37 AM   #24
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Unless the dual mode exhaust diverts before the cats, it won't make much if any difference. If anything, it will add more weight.
NPP is significantly lighter and reduces backpressure. It does make more power on the vette after the cats, but requires a different engine call I think. Anyhow, if u do any other mods and get a tune, the NPP will help you
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Old 10-25-2012, 08:38 AM   #25
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Not following why the steering helps?
It doesnt use energy from the engine due to not having a mechanical pump. Hence, less load on motor, better fuel efficiency and maybe more power.
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