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Old 01-29-2013, 10:55 AM   #205
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I don't think it has anything to do with the C7. The LS7 is the obvious engine for the Z/28 and I don't think GM will do it. I doubt they can't do it, more like they won't do it. They want to keep the top model Vettes as exclusive as possible and don't want to ruin that by dropping their engines in anything else.

With the 6th gen Camaro coming, GM better get to work on the LT engines to power them or we will be stuck with a V6 Camaro and a V8 Camaro until they do. If they want to keep the Camaro around, they can't hold back viable engines to power it. Other wise, they will have to limit it's performance to keep it below the Vette and it will die off again.

I'm starting to think that document showing the LS7 as a Camaro engine was a photoshop.
Look in the LS7 vin card thread. It was definitely not a typo. GM acknowledged the vin card in that thread and said that it wasn't complete. They never said that an LS7 Camaro wasn't coming. The LS7 was listed but a model for it to go in was not. That's what was missing on the card, they're just not ready to say it yet. They wanted to give the Z28 fans a little tidbit to hold them off until they're ready for the announcement. We're getting restless again so maybe we'll get some more info soon. I'm not ready to give up on it yet.
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Old 01-29-2013, 03:07 PM   #206
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Old 01-29-2013, 06:24 PM   #207
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It's soley a matter of timing. All new 2014 C7 Vette gets LT1 DI motor. The new Camaro, when it debuts, will also get the LT1 as the base 8 cylinder. Will the Gen 6 debut in 2015, or 2016? So, since GM will not put a new Gen engine in an old frame and body, we shall see more of the usual LS motor fare, unchanged internally, until the end of the Gen 5 Camaro line. Timing once again,...the ZL1 was supposed to be the Z/28. It morphed into the mega perma grin ZL1 over time. Now, since so much time and effort was placed into it, and it has become a special model for all that GM could achieve and bring to market for a bargain price...all things considered..., timing dictates the Z/28 will not be placed in direct competition against sales of the ZL1. Chevy will discontinue the ZL1 in the not too distant future I believe, which will preserve the special nature of the ZL1 model. When this happens, the Z/28 will be the heir apparent, and have no other internal competition. Timing is everything.
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Old 01-29-2013, 09:22 PM   #208
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It's soley a matter of timing. All new 2014 C7 Vette gets LT1 DI motor. The new Camaro, when it debuts, will also get the LT1 as the base 8 cylinder. Will the Gen 6 debut in 2015, or 2016? So, since GM will not put a new Gen engine in an old frame and body, we shall see more of the usual LS motor fare, unchanged internally, until the end of the Gen 5 Camaro line. Timing once again,...the ZL1 was supposed to be the Z/28. It morphed into the mega perma grin ZL1 over time. Now, since so much time and effort was placed into it, and it has become a special model for all that GM could achieve and bring to market for a bargain price...all things considered..., timing dictates the Z/28 will not be placed in direct competition against sales of the ZL1. Chevy will discontinue the ZL1 in the not too distant future I believe, which will preserve the special nature of the ZL1 model. When this happens, the Z/28 will be the heir apparent, and have no other internal competition. Timing is everything.
I think your thoughts are very accurate. My thought/wish for the 2014 SS and 1LE is a slight HP boost on the 6.2L to about 480-495. This would help even out the current power to weight ratio the Mustang holds over the Camaro.
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Old 01-29-2013, 09:35 PM   #209
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Pyrolysis: I didn't know that VIN card was confirmed by GM.

OldSchool: I don't see the ZL1 going away. It may not be produced for the first few years of the 6th gen but I think it will come back.

Nova: I doubt they will rework any of the LS engines at this point in time. They will more than likely develop the new LT engines instead.
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Old 01-29-2013, 09:35 PM   #210
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I think your thoughts are very accurate. My thought/wish for the 2014 SS and 1LE is a slight HP boost on the 6.2L to about 480-495. This would help even out the current power to weight ratio the Mustang holds over the Camaro.
If I were you, I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for them to raise the HP by that much on the LS3.
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Old 01-29-2013, 09:40 PM   #211
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Originally Posted by OldScoolCamaro View Post
It's soley a matter of timing. All new 2014 C7 Vette gets LT1 DI motor. The new Camaro, when it debuts, will also get the LT1 as the base 8 cylinder. Will the Gen 6 debut in 2015, or 2016? So, since GM will not put a new Gen engine in an old frame and body, we shall see more of the usual LS motor fare, unchanged internally, until the end of the Gen 5 Camaro line. Timing once again,...the ZL1 was supposed to be the Z/28. It morphed into the mega perma grin ZL1 over time. Now, since so much time and effort was placed into it, and it has become a special model for all that GM could achieve and bring to market for a bargain price...all things considered..., timing dictates the Z/28 will not be placed in direct competition against sales of the ZL1. Chevy will discontinue the ZL1 in the not too distant future I believe, which will preserve the special nature of the ZL1 model. When this happens, the Z/28 will be the heir apparent, and have no other internal competition. Timing is everything.
I think you may be right on track in your thoughts/reasons. At the same time, I think that it could well be a marketing mistake to wait too long to bring out a new Z/28. I think a properly executed 5th gen. Z/28 would take far more sales from other makes than the few sales it would "steal" from the ZL1, I think the case can be made for both the ZL1 and the Z/28 being concurrent models. I don't expect it to, but I think the case could be easily made.
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Old 01-29-2013, 09:41 PM   #212
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If I were you, I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for them to raise the HP by that much on the LS3.
Clyde
Yeah your likely right. If GM could re-tune it adding 25-30hp they could gain the sales of the guys looking at buying used. 460hp could be convincing enough to do that.
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Old 01-29-2013, 10:25 PM   #213
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I think GM can build both a Z/28 and ZL1. The ZL1 is a forced induction engine with all the technology like mag ride so it can be good on a track but not too harsh on the street. The Z/28 is as close to a track car as you can legally drive in the street. The ride might be stiff and it won't have all the tech the ZL1 has but it will fly around a track.
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Old 01-31-2013, 05:53 PM   #214
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They wanted to give the Z28 fans a little tidbit to hold them off until they're ready for the announcement. We're getting restless again so maybe we'll get some more info soon. I'm not ready to give up on it yet.
Ahem. Told ya so.
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Old 01-31-2013, 08:05 PM   #215
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Ahem. Told ya so.
You think those Camaro pictures Tran posted is a Z/28 mocked up as a regular Camaro?
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Old 01-31-2013, 09:43 PM   #216
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You think those Camaro pictures Tran posted is a Z/28 mocked up as a regular Camaro?
It's possible. I don't think GM would go through the trouble of having those photos taken and given to Camaro5 for nothing.
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Old 02-01-2013, 12:50 AM   #217
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It's possible. I don't think GM would go through the trouble of having those photos taken and given to Camaro5 for nothing.
It's basically the only thing that makes sense, if it is any kind of new car. There doesn't seem to be anything that jumps out from those pictures. They aready developed the V8 and V6 performance kits, the ZL1, the 1LE and all the special editons. The Z/28 is the only thing I can think of left.
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Old 02-01-2013, 09:17 AM   #218
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...it does sit rather low to the ground...lower than what a production SS looks like to me....
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Old 02-01-2013, 12:13 PM   #219
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It's soley a matter of timing. All new 2014 C7 Vette gets LT1 DI motor. The new Camaro, when it debuts, will also get the LT1 as the base 8 cylinder. Will the Gen 6 debut in 2015, or 2016? So, since GM will not put a new Gen engine in an old frame and body, we shall see more of the usual LS motor fare, unchanged internally, until the end of the Gen 5 Camaro line. Timing once again,...the ZL1 was supposed to be the Z/28. It morphed into the mega perma grin ZL1 over time. Now, since so much time and effort was placed into it, and it has become a special model for all that GM could achieve and bring to market for a bargain price...all things considered..., timing dictates the Z/28 will not be placed in direct competition against sales of the ZL1. Chevy will discontinue the ZL1 in the not too distant future I believe, which will preserve the special nature of the ZL1 model. When this happens, the Z/28 will be the heir apparent, and have no other internal competition. Timing is everything.
I don't see why GM would put the ZL! tro sleep. It makes no sense to me especillay for the Gen 6. The base V8 Camaro can have the LT1 (compete with GT), the Z28 will be NA LT4 (LS7 replacement to compete wiht the Boss) and the ZL1 (supercharged LT engine to compete with the GT500). There is a HUGE market for supercharged V8s and if GM ended the ZL1 it would be IMO the dumbest thing they done this century. There is also a HUGE need for the serius road course guys a NA V8. As the Mustang and 1LE has proved there is room for both.

As for now, the LS7 is almost certain, at least based on all the tidbits and rumors. The only question is whetehr it gets the Z28 name which I think it will.
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Old 02-01-2013, 12:30 PM   #220
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I don't see why GM would put the ZL! tro sleep. It makes no sense to me especillay for the Gen 6. The base V8 Camaro can have the LT1 (compete with GT), the Z28 will be NA LT4 (LS7 replacement to compete wiht the Boss) and the ZL1 (supercharged LT engine to compete with the GT500). There is a HUGE market for supercharged V8s and if GM ended the ZL1 it would be IMO the dumbest thing they done this century. There is also a HUGE need for the serius road course guys a NA V8. As the Mustang and 1LE has proved there is room for both.

As for now, the LS7 is almost certain, at least based on all the tidbits and rumors. The only question is whetehr it gets the Z28 name which I think it will.
...because, the new very stringent CAFE requirements for 2016 gives rise to that thought I feel. Car manufacturers, especially those making high performance models such as Ford and Chevy, will be shrinking model availability, not increasing it. Performance level options as a trend will be downsizing, and overkill horsepower cars will be priced at a premimium. Less consumer spendable income and the lack of foreseable economic growth are forcing manufacturers to contract, rather than tool up for growth in a climate where the GOV is not smiling on cars with ravenous appetites for fossil fuel consumption. We are in the twilight of the rebirth of the Detroit HP nuclear war waged many decades ago in the glory years. There will be SHP cars no doubt, but they will be shrinking in choice, and increasing in cost accordingly. How many niche cars/models, made in low volumes, can they support in an ever faster growing competitive market where the bottom line gets tighter and tighter? Just some thoughts....
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Old 02-01-2013, 05:50 PM   #221
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...because, the new very stringent CAFE requirements for 2016 gives rise to that thought I feel. Car manufacturers, especially those making high performance models such as Ford and Chevy, will be shrinking model availability, not increasing it. Performance level options as a trend will be downsizing, and overkill horsepower cars will be priced at a premimium. Less consumer spendable income and the lack of foreseable economic growth are forcing manufacturers to contract, rather than tool up for growth in a climate where the GOV is not smiling on cars with ravenous appetites for fossil fuel consumption. We are in the twilight of the rebirth of the Detroit HP nuclear war waged many decades ago in the glory years. There will be SHP cars no doubt, but they will be shrinking in choice, and increasing in cost accordingly. How many niche cars/models, made in low volumes, can they support in an ever faster growing competitive market where the bottom line gets tighter and tighter? Just some thoughts....
Those that want powerful cars will always find a way to afford them.
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