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Old 06-08-2009, 06:23 PM   #1
DallasMike
 
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Pedderizing the Nickey Camaro! Pedders coilovers / suspension fitted & tested.

As featured on homepage.

Due to the late release of the Camaro by GM, Pedders is behind on our Xa Coilover production. We held up production of our Xa coilovers until we could get under a couple of production vehicles to confirm fitment. Our high profile installations with a couple of Dealers and GM at the Proving Grounds were great opportunities for this. The Xa coilovers fit perfectly, are produced and waiting for the boat to ship out.

Radius rod bushes are good to go.
Differential bushes are good to go.
Sway Bars are being revised for clearance.
Endlinks are good to go.
Sub-frame Insert are being revised.
Trailing Arm Bushes are good to go.
Upper Control Arm Bushes are good to go.

We expect to have stock for all these bits when the first Pre-Order of Xa coilovers arrive in the USA is about five weeks. Now allow me to make the wait interminable.We have air freighted, at considerable expense, a handful of Xa coilovers for magazine cars with Nickey, Hennessy and Fesler Moss. With the Nickey car we did the fitment of the Xa coilovers, eXtreme Radius Rod Snubbers, eXtreme Rear Camber and Toe Adjusters and a Pedders alignment at the Autobahn Country Club in Joliet Illinois with TEAM Stradale. Our first test was to establish the base line performance with stock tires, wheels, suspension and alignment. The head of the Autobahn Track Driving School Francesco Abate was our designated driver. Typically he is driving track prepared BMWs and Ferrari's. Last Thursday it was a Camaro SS. his initial drive was solid, but a bit uncertain. There is substantial lean and roll and a significant amount of understeer resulting in solid lap times.

We brought the Camaro into the shop and installed the VERY first 2010 Camaro Radius Rod Snubbers originally developed for GM High Performance. Unfortunately that project was been dropped, but we still have the parts so the Nickey Camaro was a logical place to test them. They take up space and remove compliance making the radius rod bush eXtremely stable. This part is one of the very few bits Pedders makes that will be sold for Track Use Only.

Installing the Xa Coilovers alters the spring rates with 8Kg coils up front and 10Kg coils in the rear. Damping set to full soft starts where the OEM dampers end. We tested at 25 or 5 off full hard upfront and 15 or in the middle in the rear. This was done to minimise the push created by vehicle balance and a staggered set of OEM tires. The alignment is the same as the one we use on my four door Camaro / Pontiac G8.

Front
Camber -2.2
Castor -- it is fixed from the factory on the Camaro -- well at least until Pedders releases front Castor eXtreme Adjuster Bolts and Washers.
Toe -.25

Rear
Camber -1.1
Toe 0.02
Thrust Angle 0

We lowered the Camaro SS quite a bit. I am waiting on some data from Francesco, but from memory we dropped the front 30mm and the rear 40mm. The transformation on the vehicle was incredible. Our first lap, Francesco was uncomfortable. The car just didn't feel right. Then we noticed that the Traction Control had not been turned off. While still running at speed, I turned off the traction control. The car felt more than alright. It felt fast. It still had too much push which can be further reduced by lowering the rear. That was my fault. Being a Nickey car, it should look like Nickey Camaro with the traditional Muscle Car stance so I left it a bit too tall. We need to bring the rear of the vehicle down another 15mm. Moving to 10.x20 rims all around with something like 295/35/20/XL or 305/30/20/XL should balance out the car with more grip up front and be balanced front to rear, but I digress.

The Nickey Camaro with Pedders Radius Rob Snubbers, Xa coilovers and a Pedders Alignment was a blistering 2.41 seconds per lap faster on our worst Pedderised lap. We feel that with ONLY suspension upgrades to include sub-frame bush inserts, upper rear control arm bushes, trailing arm bushes, bars and endlinks we have another 1.5 seconds. That would mean you can take a Camaro SS and find 4 bullet proof reliable seconds with nothing more than a few suspension upgrades. There is no motor upgrade that could deliver this improvement, because we were at the limits of the OEM suspension with OEM RWHP. Adding HP would do nothing for lap times.

As for Francesco, he is now an American Muscle Car addict. As we continue to work with Nickey Chicago at the Autobahn with Francesco we will continue to update this thread. Our next session should take place in about a month when we finish the suspension with our revised bits. Following that, will be a matched set of tires and wheels. Following that will be more RWHP. As time allows, we will be working with Hennessy and Fesler Moss on similar projects that will all receive national media attention.

Orders and retail sales of our Xa coilovers have been staggering. I never expected to sell coilovers in this volume for the Camaro, GTO, G8 and other platforms. Volume is good. Because we are running production at this level we are LOWERING the retail price for our coilovers across the board. They will not be as low as the December Dollar Days, but they will be going down based on volume. I can't thank the online communities that are the driving force behind these orders enough. We haven't had delivery on the first pre-order and we have already sold out the second order and while neither the first of second orders have arrived in the USA, we are on our third order with a production schedule that is eXtremely different than it looked 60 days ago.

Aside from that, I don't have much new information to share with you.

What a great parking place. These are the rides that normally would be found in the Stradle Stable.



What happened to the Castor Adjustment slot on the Camaro ZETA II chassis?



The front Camaro Xa Coilover is hung,



We talked about the Camaro project so much that we were pressed for time to complete our work and get out on the track for session II. It was all hands on deck to get the job done.



The gold rear strut washer goes on top and the silver washer on the bottom.





The verys first set of eXtreme Rear Camber and Toe Adjusters is installed on the Nickey Camaro. There are benefits to being close to Pedders Head Office.



TEAM Stradale has great facilities. Thier state-of-the-art drive on alignment rack made the Peddersised Camaro alignment a breeze. It must be something iabout Illinois becuase the first drive on alignment rack I used was at Waukegan Tire and they have four of them.



Pictured from Left to Right: Pete Basica Pedders USA, Stafano Bimbi Nickey Chicago and Francesco Abate TEAM Stradale. Yes, you have to love Italian food to hand with this crew.






This is a great shot of the OE suspension running at speed on the track.



These are on track with the Camaro Pedderised.


Last edited by DallasMike; 06-08-2009 at 09:50 PM.
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Old 06-08-2009, 06:31 PM   #2
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This is remarkable. I'd love to see some side-by-side lap times if possible.
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Old 06-08-2009, 07:08 PM   #3
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This is remarkable. I'd love to see some side-by-side lap times if possible.
Francesco has the lap data and the aliognment specifics. We are waiting on him to forward the data.
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Old 06-08-2009, 07:44 PM   #4
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Drop looks good
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Old 06-08-2009, 07:56 PM   #5
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LOOKS LIKE WE NEED TO GET BUSY, AS SOON AS I GET MY MARO SS
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Old 06-08-2009, 07:57 PM   #6
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Good to hear... Has much time been spent with the Hennessey car in regards to tuning?
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Old 06-08-2009, 07:58 PM   #7
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I'm really diggin' the drop as well. Just don't know how practical it is for a daily driver. I'd love to lower my car when I get it but not at the expense of ride/handling.
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Old 06-08-2009, 08:04 PM   #8
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Very cool! Good job Pete and Pedders team!
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Old 06-08-2009, 08:06 PM   #9
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What kind of wheels did they put on that yellow camaro?
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Old 06-08-2009, 08:16 PM   #10
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damn it, i want that interior for my 2ss rally yellow with black stripes!!!

all the other stuff is awesome, just not for me.

how much for just the interior?
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Old 06-08-2009, 08:39 PM   #11
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love the stance
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Old 06-08-2009, 09:06 PM   #12
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What kind of wheels did they put on that yellow camaro?

They are lorenzo WL 21.
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Old 06-08-2009, 09:44 PM   #13
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I love the lowered look & feel. Keep up the good work!
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Old 06-08-2009, 10:09 PM   #14
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The Camaro is turning into a bundle of adult fun!!!

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Old 06-08-2009, 10:51 PM   #15
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yea im loving the stance
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Old 06-08-2009, 10:54 PM   #16
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yea im loving the stance
So which Camaro color, the Orange Hennessey or the Yellow Nickey? both are pretty awesome!!

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Old 06-09-2009, 09:37 AM   #17
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I'm loving the look and what it looks like the performance is going to be. It was interesting to read about the development with GMPP (presumably before the current situation). It's too bad they couldn't get that worked out so that Track Pack Mustang package would get snuffed-out. Anyways, it looks like I gotta' save MORE money now. Sheesh! I'm going to have enough money for a CTS-V at this point

Thanks for sharing the information and keep it coming
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Old 06-09-2009, 10:26 AM   #18
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Hmmm....

I wonder what this car would do around the ring?

I have a sneaky feeling it would beat 8:19
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Old 06-09-2009, 11:40 AM   #19
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How does this lowered car handle around town now? ie. going over curbs and such.

Tom
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Old 06-09-2009, 11:44 AM   #20
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How does this lowered car handle around town now? ie. going over curbs and such.

Tom
I am not sure what levels of drop they did with this Camaro. The Orange one was pretty low, and had no issues with speed bumps and normal driveways

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Old 06-09-2009, 11:53 AM   #21
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Awesome cause I KNOW I want to get a set of their coilovers when I order my car......... It's just gotta wait til after I get married next summer :(
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Old 06-09-2009, 12:37 PM   #22
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What kind of wheels did they put on that yellow camaro?
Both Camaros are running OEM wheels and tires. Nickey does have their own custom Nickey wheel coming soon.
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Old 06-09-2009, 12:42 PM   #23
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How does this lowered car handle around town now? ie. going over curbs and such.

Tom
Tom,

It should be no different than my G8 with 20K on it -- all lowered. Pedders Xa coilovers adjust by screwing the monotube into the mount. That means that ride is not changed when ride height is changed as full jounce travel in GM speak is preserved. The coils are 8Kg front and 10Kg rear, much firmer than OE. The ride is probably about 85% of OE fully lowered with the damping to full soft. The unique thing about Pedders Xa coilovers is the damper mapping. It covers a huge range. Unlike most adjustable dampers Pedders Xa coilovers provide the end user with control of the low and high speed circuits of the dampers. When you turn the knob you are making real changes in the performance of the dampers. The ratio of bound to rebound is fixed to protect the end user and to protect Pedders. On full soft the ride is close to OEM fully lowered. On full hard, the ride is really firm and track ready for R compound tires.
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Old 06-09-2009, 12:50 PM   #24
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I love the lowered look & feel. Keep up the good work!
The look is secondary to the performance. I really screwed up on this car because I wanted to stay true to the Nickey traditional Muscle Car look and didn't drop the rear enough for optimal handling. We need to lower the car another 15mm in the rear to take load off the front tires under hard braking in the turns and make the car more neutral. As it delivers from the factory there is significant understeer in daily driving and what most race car drivers would refer to as pushing or plowing. In the current lowered stance we greatly reduced the understeer. If I had done it right and dropped the rear as far as I have the rear dropped on my G8 the lap times and handling would have been better.

When we hit the track the next time around with the adjustable bars and remaining bushes, we'll also correct the ride height while going through a complete corner weighting process. We expect to see another 1.5 to 2 full seconds come off the lap times.

When I get my Camaro you can expect to see a very non-traditional set of Forgeline wheels that are 20x10.5 all around with something like a 305/30/20/XL Pole Position from Bridgestone. Eliminating the stagger from the OEM wheel and tire package will further reduce the understeer on the Camaro. Increasing the front tire contact patch will improve handling. We may need to do a little fender stretching to make it work, but we'll cross that bridge as soon as my car comes.
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Old 06-09-2009, 12:53 PM   #25
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Pedders has developed a set of rear camber and toe eXtreme Adjustment Bolts and Washers to get your Camaro exactly where it should be for street, drag strip, autocross of road course or road course use. They should be ready to ship[ some time next week. Here is a sneak peek at the ZETA Rear eXtreme Camber and Toe Kit.



The OEM adjuster provides less than a degree of adjustment. Pedders eXtreme Camber and Toe Kits provides more than 2 degrees of adjustment range. We also go one step further and provide jam nuts to lock down the alignment bolts. We'll have pricing for the eXtreme Camber and Toe Kit shortly.
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