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Old 01-22-2008, 10:44 PM   #1
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V8 Engine Is Far From Dead at GM

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DETROIT — Afficionados of the grand ol' American V8 moaned when news came last month that General Motors killed an ambitious program that was well on its way to developing a sophisticated, all-new DOHC V8 architecture. The so-called "Ultra" V8, or UV8 in GM parlance, was to replace the aging Northstar in a variety of GM premium cars, but was mainly earmarked for Cadillac.

Yeah, the UV8 program is shelved, Tom Stephens, GM's group vice president for global powertrain and quality, told Inside Line at the recent Detroit auto show — but he says don't be in a hurry to write any obituaries for the V8 at GM.

First, the ubiquitous small-block V8 architecture remains for any number of applications, including the Corvette, obviously, and Cadillac's high-power V-Series models. GM will go out of business — or be taken over by Greenpeace — before it ever kills its historic small-block V8 architecture.

Second, although in the decision to shelve the UV8, Stephens says, "I think we did the right thing for this moment in time," the UV8 development is "wrapped up with a bow," and the program could be revisited in the future, if market conditions warrant.

In fact, Stephens teased us by saying the UV8 is "as refined as anything in the history of internal-combustion engines. It was the quietest engine we've ever tested."

He also says that while it has been assumed the long-in-the-tooth Northstar V8 would be discontinued by around 2010-'11, "you'll have to wait and see," regarding the ultimate fate of the V8 that has been in production since being introduced in the '93 Allante roadster. The insinuation is clear: Keeping the old Northstar around longer than planned now may be an option for premium-car customers who still insist on seeing a V8 when they lift the hood.

But Stephens says GM already has observed a change in consumers' engine preferences: At the Cadillac division, 85 percent of buyers for the SRX crossover and STS luxury sedan are opting for the 3.6-liter DOHC V6 instead of the Northstar 4.6-liter V8. GM Chief Executive Rick Wagoner recently said buyers of Chevrolet's hot new Malibu midsize sedan also are opting more for the car's base four-cylinder engine than GM planners anticipated.

What this means to you: Fantasize about what might have been with GM's now-discontinued premium V8, but take heart in the knowledge the great small-block V8 remains — including for the all-new Camaro. — Bill Visnic, Correspondent
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...ticleId=124444

I don't know that this really says anything new or anything at all. Caught my eye. Here you go.
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Old 01-23-2008, 12:32 AM   #2
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Darn right it will remain. GM won't, for many many many many many years scrap the V8...if they have anything to do w/ it. Remember, it's what the people want that they get.
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Old 01-23-2008, 12:59 AM   #3
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^ Hopefully that will be FOREVER. The Chevy small block in the heartbeat of America.
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Old 01-23-2008, 01:28 AM   #4
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It’s like the quote from MAD MAX. “She’s the last of the V8’s”
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Old 01-23-2008, 09:37 AM   #5
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What it should have said was the end of the passenger car v8.
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Old 01-23-2008, 10:12 AM   #6
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V8's will last as long as they can provide more power at the nearly the same mileage as V6's.
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Old 02-03-2008, 09:47 PM   #7
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Here's what GM should do.Make the direct injection,11.5 to 1,E85 compatible V-8,the standard engine in the Z-28,as well as an option for the base Camaro.Here's why:First,with cylinder deactivation under cruise or light load,the dreaded "Gas Guzzler Tax"is avoided.Second,vehicles that are capable of running E85,are eligigble for tax credits.Take that Al Gore!!
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Old 02-04-2008, 12:31 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TurbineX-2000 View Post
:First,with cylinder deactivation under cruise or light load,the dreaded "Gas Guzzler Tax"is avoided.
This rumor is false, the charger, magnum, ram, and 300 come with cylinder deactivation, and only the magnum and ram avoid the Gas Guzzler Tax due to being classified as "work" vehicles.
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Old 02-04-2008, 12:54 AM   #9
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bad news :-/

http://www.thecarconnection.com/blog/?p=759

They're sort of killing the V8 and killing the RWD zeta platform and killing any future cars based on it.
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Old 02-04-2008, 01:16 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vod View Post
http://www.thecarconnection.com/blog/?p=759


They're sort of killing the V8 and killing the RWD zeta platform and killing any future cars based on it.
Horses mouth on 2/4/08
Welcome to the site vod

They are trimming the North American Zetas, there are other markets besides the US. The V8 isn't being killed either, its just not going to expand its market share much. If there was a time to think that the V8 was dying it was ~2003. To the best of my knowledge, there were no V8's availible on GM cars in north america for under 40k.
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Last edited by DGthe3; 02-04-2008 at 01:17 AM. Reason: forgot to welcom
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Old 02-04-2008, 02:48 AM   #11
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Well, the story talks about the death of the RWD GM vehicles.
They're saying unless it's a truck or SUV, future cars will not have V8 or RWD.
I'm sure they're excluding the corvette?
So in north america, no future cars with v8 or RWD sounds like killing to me not trimming. No future cars on the zeta platform sounds like killing. Their next gen v8 tech being put away for the forseeable future that sounds like 'oh hold'.
If they turn out not to develop V8 tech anymore they may want to downsize to v6 and FI engines even for trucks or suvs.

Look on the bright side at least the camaro is safe. But they are talking about bumping the price up for the V8...
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Old 02-04-2008, 03:09 AM   #12
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Well, if the vette and the Camaro turn out to be the last two V8 RWD cars GM makes, I'm getting and keeping the 5th Gen forever.
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Old 02-04-2008, 04:04 AM   #13
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Quote:
The Camaro will still be built, but higher-end V-8 versions likely will be priced higher than expected. As for other planned GM rear-drivers–a new Chevrolet Impala, Buick LaCrosse and the replacement for the Pontiac G8 due this spring–all have been dropped along with a new V-8 engine GM was contemplating building.
The impala has been on and off ever since it was first heard about. And I just have a hard time accepting a blog that makes a mistake in its second paragraph, vs an article from edmunds. The G8 is not being replaced, it is the replacement. And none of the cars that are being 'killed off' are rear drive right now anyways. The shelved V8 is the northstar replacement (see original post). GM used to have 2 V8 engine designs, now it will be 1. no biggie. That article makes things sound far worse than they actually are. This is nothing like the early 90's when everything switched rear drive V8s to V6's with front drive.

The reason why the modern V8 will stay around for a while is because you can now have a 400 hp car getting over 30 highway mpg with a V8. They are better suited to technology such as AFM, DI, and dual mode hybrid drive. This is because a smaller engine has to work harder to meet the needs of regular driving so the fuel saving technology won't be used nearly as often. a V8 has so much extra capacity that it can reduce its power output when at speed.

Thats my take. I'm not trying to beat you down or anything, just giving the short version of what we've discussed since we first heard about 'the death of the V8'
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Old 02-04-2008, 11:16 AM   #14
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I'm new here myself, but are you (Vod) the same person causing mischief at another 5th Gen. site?...
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Old 02-04-2008, 11:54 AM   #15
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Quote:
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Look on the bright side at least the camaro is safe. But they are talking about bumping the price up for the V8...
Gm's not stupid, and neither is thier marketing, As long as you can buy a Mustang, charger, 300, challenger, ect.. You will be able to buy a V8 Camaro for market price.

*the sky is falling*.... Im gonna have to add this to my signature along with the whole pricing, maybe people will start reading it..
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Old 02-04-2008, 11:04 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DGthe3 View Post
The impala has been on and off ever since it was first heard about. And I just have a hard time accepting a blog that makes a mistake in its second paragraph, vs an article from edmunds. The G8 is not being replaced, it is the replacement. And none of the cars that are being 'killed off' are rear drive right now anyways. The shelved V8 is the northstar replacement (see original post). GM used to have 2 V8 engine designs, now it will be 1. no biggie. That article makes things sound far worse than they actually are. This is nothing like the early 90's when everything switched rear drive V8s to V6's with front drive.

The reason why the modern V8 will stay around for a while is because you can now have a 400 hp car getting over 30 highway mpg with a V8. They are better suited to technology such as AFM, DI, and dual mode hybrid drive. This is because a smaller engine has to work harder to meet the needs of regular driving so the fuel saving technology won't be used nearly as often. a V8 has so much extra capacity that it can reduce its power output when at speed.

Thats my take. I'm not trying to beat you down or anything, just giving the short version of what we've discussed since we first heard about 'the death of the V8'
I'm quoting this because it is exactly what I was going to say. I consider Edmunds to be more reliable than The Car Connection. They are the internet car media leader. I've said it many times before: bad news gets good ratings, and some of these smaller auto media web sites are just crying out for attention. There's no news like bad news, and they'll reach pretty far to get the bad angle on things. Relax. Everything is ok.
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Old 02-05-2008, 08:34 PM   #17
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so obviously someone knows that the ls3 is the camaro motor????

i never really was fond of the northstar motor. yeah its nice in a NEW car but i had an older sts fwd and i know that style was notorious for leaking oil and burning oil very quickly. hopefully the new motor will be a little better. my new sts has the northstar v8 and it is a world of difference in the rwd platform. im sure it was changed a little bit but its a bad little car!!
god speed northstar motor....god speed.
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Old 02-06-2008, 11:29 AM   #18
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I never really understood the alure of the Northstar series. I worked at a Cadillac dealer for several years and like you mentioned, there were leak problems and what-not; no biggie. I always was left wondering if GM just wanted to appeal to an upscale crowd with a DOHC motor because an OHV is thought to be prehistoric. I don't see many benefits to a DOHC over OHV, but I'm a little biased I guess. I think Northstar was just a little more complicated than necessary.

JMHO.
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